do you have a smoke / CO detector?

[WayneH]

We've got both the smoke and CO detectors. The smoke detector isn't mounted, it just lays in an open side compartment across the boat from the galley. None the less, it goes off EVERY time the wife uses her griddle on the propane stove. Just about the time I think, "MMMM, pancakes smell good!!!" the damm thing goes off in my ear. I can't even see any smoke coming off the griddle so we're just going to leave it where it is and evacuate if we ever hear it go off when we're NOT cooking.

 

[rpwillia]

It is not just your boat

I read in a BoatUS article about a couple who was anchored out and their detector went off from a boat anchored nearby that was running their generator.

 

[FastOlson]

Always in interesting and relevant thread. We saw some good replies to a thread on this subject over at the EY.org site a few years ago.
Link posted to avoid trying retype a lot of stuff.
http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?6713-CO-Detector-on-duty&referrerid=28

While it was the insurance company's idea and not mine, it really does work, out in the real world.

L

 

[AtlanticAl]

If you do, what appliances are you protecting against?

And if you don't, do you use oil lamps and/or a stove and/or a heater?

The reason I ask is the previous owner had no smoke or CO detector, but used a propane stove (infrequently) and oil lamps.

I wouldnt really bother with a smoke detector, it will be a pain in the butt, besides which, on a small boat, you wont need a smoke detector to tell you its on fire, you will know that before the smoke detector does. Carbon monoxide detector, may be a good idea, but i doubt you could seal a boat up well enough, to be effected by carbon monoxide, but if you are going to install one, make sure you install it bellow the level of the bunks, because carbon monoxide is heavy, and it builds up from the lowest point, so if the alarm is higher than you, you will be dead before it goes off.

 

[Bad Obsession]

I have a CO2 detector and smoke alarm in my boat. This is something that the surveyor suggested and I have to agree. It is foolish to not have something so basic and so inexpensive that could save your life.

CO2 can come from cooking, a heater, or the engine if there is an exhaust issue.

 

[KD3PC]

I wouldnt really bother with a smoke detector, it will be a pain in the butt, besides which, on a small boat, you wont need a smoke detector to tell you its on fire, you will know that before the smoke detector does. Carbon monoxide detector, may be a good idea, but i doubt you could seal a boat up well enough, to be effected by carbon monoxide, but if you are going to install one, make sure you install it bellow the level of the bunks, because carbon monoxide is heavy, and it builds up from the lowest point, so if the alarm is higher than you, you will be dead before it goes off.

Horrible advice!!!
...the detectors are ALL worth the time and money as an investment in keeping you and your crew alive. You can have a fire on a small boat and NOT know about it and could die from noxious gases put off by the materials before you could get to fresh air..

CO is even more insidious and doesn't even have to come from YOUR boat to be deadly. Just anchoring downwind from a poorly tuned gennie or engine can kill you or worse.

ludicrous to even post this crap. Al, If your life isn't worth $30 ....and a battery or two every year then so be it....at least let the OP choose.

 

[KD3PC]

but if you are going to install one, make sure you install it bellow the level of the bunks, because carbon monoxide is heavy, and it builds up from the lowest point, so if the alarm is higher than you, you will be dead before it goes off.

I call BS on this statement and the numerous manufacturers agree:

FROM but ONE, http://www.homesafe.com/coalert/detect.htm

When considering where to place a carbon monoxide detector, keep in mind that although carbon monoxide is roughly the same weight as air (carbon monoxide's specific gravity is 0.9657, as stated by the EPA; the National Resource Council lists the specific gravity of air as one), it may be contained in warm air coming from combustion appliances such as home heating equipment. If this is the case, carbon monoxide will rise with the warmer air.

 

[All U Get]

Three things to consider when you rely on your nose.

In parts per million the human nose detects odors over 10,000 ppm. A detector is set much less.

CO is odorless and accumulative in the blood. This means during the night, your blood build up CO to dangerous levels.

Lastly your sense of smell doesn't work while you're asleep. Theres a lot of research on my statements in support.

All U Get

All U Get

 

[Bad Obsession]

I have to agree....Horrible advise. This is a quick, simple, and cheap piece of safety. Don't fool around with safety. Get the device and install it.

 

[wgkenney]

We have 3, one in each cabin. We have a genset that in the aft locker. Completely sealed and exhaust overboard, but I feel safer with the CO monitors. They also monitor Smoke (and my wife's cooking at times).

One benefit / downside it that if you have excess gassing in your batteries it will also alarm on that. Our batteries were coming to end of life and just before we replaced them the alarm was sounding when we did a normal charge. Shut down charge and replaced the batteries.

 

[Ken Cross]

I spoke to a fireman about these

Don't buy a combination unit. CO is heavy the detector should be low. Smoke goes up mount them high.

 

[KD3PC]

where are you guys getting CO is heavier than air?

Don't buy a combination unit. CO is heavy the detector should be low. Smoke goes up mount them high.

CO has almost the same measurements as air (carbon monoxide's specific gravity is 0.9657, as stated by the EPA; the National Resource Council lists the specific gravity of air as one)....it will do the same as the air we breathe....

WHere are you guys getting the idea that CO is heavier than air????


reference please.... I looked at over 20 manufacturer sites and ALL said the same thing...see my post above.

 

[Bill Roosa]

CO2, Carbon dioxide IS heavier than air but you don't normaly hear of folks waking up dead from it. Course you don't normaly sleep in the bilge either.

 

[LloydB]

"WHere are you guys getting the idea that CO is heavier than air????"

Not from here:
http://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/Publications/co_brochure_0105.pdf

However I'd like to offer an explanation as to why that has sometimes been the perception. Anecdotal/news reports of death by CO poisoning with the cause stated that CO was more heavy than the air so it stayed or pooled in a boat. The technical details of conditions where CO could be heavy are often left out and not remembered or passed on.
FWIW

 

[Bill Roosa]

The real reason CO is so dangrous is that it bonds with hemoglobin about 400 times more readily than O2. It also stays bonded with the hemoglobin and does not enter the tissues. So the hemoglobin can't transport O2 due to the CO already being strongly bonded to it.
That means it only takes a little and you can get it over time and it is still deadly.

 

[AtlanticAl]

Horrible advice!!!
...the detectors are ALL worth the time and money as an investment in keeping you and your crew alive. You can have a fire on a small boat and NOT know about it and could die from noxious gases put off by the materials before you could get to fresh air..

CO is even more insidious and doesn't even have to come from YOUR boat to be deadly. Just anchoring downwind from a poorly tuned gennie or engine can kill you or worse.

ludicrous to even post this crap. Al, If your life isn't worth $30 ....and a battery or two every year then so be it....at least let the OP choose.

I didnt say i would advice against a CO detector, i said it was a good idea, so why give me a hard time about something i didnt say. As for smoke detector, put one in if you want, wont help you much on a 30 foot boat, Like i say, if it goes on fire, you will know it probably before the smoke detector does. I am also trying to think of what your statement "kill you or worse" means, i cant think of anything worse than being killed,

 

[AtlanticAl]

"WHere are you guys getting the idea that CO is heavier than air????"

Not from here:
http://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/Publications/co_brochure_0105.pdf

However I'd like to offer an explanation as to why that has sometimes been the perception. Anecdotal/news reports of death by CO poisoning with the cause stated that CO was more heavy than the air so it stayed or pooled in a boat. The technical details of conditions where CO could be heavy are often left out and not remembered or passed on.
FWIW

I got the idea from a CO detector i bought, that said it was to be fitted between three and four feet high in an apartment i lived in. A gas that is truly lighter than air, is not really a problem, because it goes up, and away from you, If CO was truly like that, in a boat with ventilation, it couldnt pool in the cabin, unless you were producing massive amounts of it.

 

[KD3PC]

I am also trying to think of what your statement "kill you or worse" means, i cant think of anything worse than being killed,

Al, this will be my last response to ANY post you make. I can't handle the thought that someone could be seriously hurt, on your account. And to have to repudiate your comments, seems to be a waste of my time. You still come back and justify the errors of fact.

FYI -
For me, worse than dying - would be so buggered up as to not be able to care for myself, and worse than that would be to be the burden on my family - due to my ignorance or in not wasting the $30 for a device which certainly would have kept me safe.

For me worse than dying - is the pain of a horrible burn. Even morphine will not touch that pain. Seen that first hand.

I am done with this, Dave's Corollary #62 - Is if you have a $10 head, buy a $10 helmet...similarly, if you have anything bigger than a rowboat, keep your self safe. You guys can believe or not believe this information of Al's. I choose to not.

 

[LloydB]

Hot air rises. Fires can smolder. People sleep at 3>4 feet. Smoldering fires often cause stratification of the air in an enclosure. I was once told by a wise man that some of my best thinking would be done with my mouth closed.
kd3pc thanks for your response.

 

[Tom J]

I wouldnt really bother with a smoke detector, it will be a pain in the butt, besides which, on a small boat, you wont need a smoke detector to tell you its on fire, you will know that before the smoke detector does. Carbon monoxide detector, may be a good idea, but i doubt you could seal a boat up well enough, to be effected by carbon monoxide, but if you are going to install one, make sure you install it bellow the level of the bunks, because carbon monoxide is heavy, and it builds up from the lowest point, so if the alarm is higher than you, you will be dead before it goes off.

We almost didn't wake up one night, forever! About 2 AM, my wife shook me awake, and said there was smoke in the cabin. I couldn't see the other side of the main cabin from our bunk in the v-berth. I jumped up and opened the companionway hatch, while my wife carried our two dogs topside. The smoke was coming from the microwave. When I opened the door of the microwave, a smoldering roll of paper towels burst into flames. Quickly, I grabbed the roll and threw it under running wate in the galley sink. Apparently, the microwave had turned on when we plugged into shore power, and eventually "cooked" the paper towels we normally stored in it. Next day, we threw away the microwave, and installed two smoke alarms. Yes, they do go off when we cook, but it is a simple matter to pull them off the bulkheads and set them on a shelf until we finish eating.
We also installed a CO alarm in the main cabin. Sometimes, when motoring downwind, we can smell diesel exhaust in the cockpit, and the CO alarm will sound off. So now we keep our dog with us in the cockpit when we are motoring.
Yes, alarms are cheap insurance, even necessary equipment, and I don't understand why my Catalina 310 didn't come with any installed.