another boater life, lost

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Feb 6, 1998
11,760
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2011/072011/07032011/637064

Sad to pass along another boating accident in Virginia...this one fatal.

Thoughts are with the family and resquers this holiday weekend.

Be safe.
Sad, and creepy for me. One of my best friends fathers was killed in the same fashion by a drunk on a big lake in NH and they shared the same last name...

If the COLREGS are enforced the boater who ran them over should be charged with the death in this "overtaking" situation, if the story has been reported even close to accurately. Sad really...
 

RAD

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Jun 3, 2004
2,330
Catalina 30 Bay Shore, N.Y.
First thing that comes to mind is that a jet ski was involved.......I was heading back to my home port last night and wanted to get back in before dark because of the risk factor with the nautical nitwits on a holiday weekend, we've had many accidents involving "I didn't see you" and one ended in the death of a little girl
 
Mar 21, 2004
2,175
Hunter 356 Cobb Island, MD
We/I do Monday evening races out of Monroe Bay. I will see what I can find out from some of the regulars at Dahlgren Marina. Might take a week or better, no Monday races tomorrow...
 

gpd955

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Feb 22, 2006
1,164
Catalina 310 Cape May, NJ
We completely avoid going out during peak times on weekends (especially holidays) because of the rules ingnorant and courtesy challenged out there. Luckily there has been a significant reduction in powerboats out there recently. Most of the mega-yachts and fisherman are courteous and follow the rules.

There's a large dredge at the mouth of the inlet and their caution barrels are out at least 1/4 - 1/2 mi around and people continue to fly right through them. They're constantly hailing boats but most of them probably can't hear the radio or don't even have it on. I'm just waiting to be heading out of the inlet and needing to pluck someone from the ocean.

Gives everyone who boats safely a bad name, in addition to putting us all at risk.
 

mel22

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Oct 1, 2010
66
Hunter 22 Lake Dardanelle
Condolence to the family of the lady.
This kind of thing will continue as long as the law and law makers continue to be politicaly correct and refuse to put the blame on those who need to be held acountable. How could no charges be filed when the jet ski broke several laws right up front. The opperator should have been taken straight to booking and held. Looking back many years to the beginning of boater certification this was all started because of jet skies but law makers did not want to point out one or two groups of boaters so they made the certification law for all. Still nothing has changed. Just as auto driver test have not taken the unsafe drivers off the road. The law needs to be enforeced ro this will continue to happen and look out sail boats and small open fishing boats.
 
Jul 18, 2009
274
marine clipper 21 ft santa ana Southern Lakes,Yukon
Condolence to the family of the lady.
This kind of thing will continue as long as the law and law makers continue to be politicaly correct and refuse to put the blame on those who need to be held acountable. How could no charges be filed when the jet ski broke several laws right up front. The opperator should have been taken straight to booking and held. Looking back many years to the beginning of boater certification this was all started because of jet skies but law makers did not want to point out one or two groups of boaters so they made the certification law for all. Still nothing has changed. Just as auto driver test have not taken the unsafe drivers off the road. The law needs to be enforeced ro this will continue to happen and look out sail boats and small open fishing boats.

A jet ski appeared, and Hartman slowed "fairly quickly and dramatically," but the second boat did not,


i would have to have the full story to determine if the jet ski broke several laws like you seem to be indicating..??..it seems to me that the trailering boat was tailgating..??...jmo
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,760
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Condolence to the family of the lady.
This kind of thing will continue as long as the law and law makers continue to be politicaly correct and refuse to put the blame on those who need to be held acountable. How could no charges be filed when the jet ski broke several laws right up front. The opperator should have been taken straight to booking and held. Looking back many years to the beginning of boater certification this was all started because of jet skies but law makers did not want to point out one or two groups of boaters so they made the certification law for all. Still nothing has changed. Just as auto driver test have not taken the unsafe drivers off the road. The law needs to be enforeced ro this will continue to happen and look out sail boats and small open fishing boats.
Mel,

I don't know that it's fair to malign a jet ski just because they are a jet ski at this point. We have no indication from that article that the jet skier did anything wrong. All we know is that a jet ski appeared and Hartman slowed rather abruptly.

"The incident happened about 4 p.m. Lyle Hartman was piloting his boat, and another boat was trailing them, Bull said.

A jet ski appeared, and Hartman slowed "fairly quickly and dramatically," but the second boat did not, Bull said.

The second boat ran over the Hartmans' vessel, killing 53-year-old Margaret Hartman and seriously injuring her husband, Bull said."



We don't know where the jet ski appeared from and there is a possibility that the jet ski was technically the stand on vessel approaching from Hartman's starboard side and Hartman did the right thing by slowing as a possible give way situation. Of course at this point this is only one possible situation and the jet ski could have approached from port and not given way.

The only boat I can discern that did anything wrong, based on the little information we have in that article, is the boat that came from behind and ran over them. If they use the COLREGS in court the "Overtaking Rule 13", "Safe Speed Rule 6" and possibly "Proper Lookout Rule 5" could possibly come into play here. That boat was not listed as a jet ski.

I am sure we'll get more information, and may find the jet ski could be partially at fault, but let's try not to malign jet skiers just because they are jet skiers. I see plenty of bad moves by sailors out there so we are not immune and far from a perfect lot.
 

kenn

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Apr 18, 2009
1,271
CL Sandpiper 565 Toronto
We were sailing today on L.Ontario (glorious day to be out). Of the 4 or 5 powerboats whose paths we crossed, all insisted on crossing our bow instead of astern, even if astern was the smaller course variation. Something to do with penis size, I guess. At least most of them gave us some room. One oversized stinkboat coming nearly head-on, driven by a silver-haired Master of The Universe, at that sub-planing speed that generates the largest wake, barely altered course to cross less than 40 ft in front of us, necessitating a sharp starboard turn in order to cross the obscene wake at near 90 degrees to minimise the roll. We only have a 19' sailboat, after all...

I won't float any speculation about what caused the above-discussed fatality, which makes me sad, other than to point out that the boats involved were going fast and close, at least one of which is an error in judgment. And of course we have too little information to discern the role of the jetski. Personally, I'm not a fan of jetskis, and we've been buzzed by a few, but none have been as discourteous or threatening as the motorized whale in the hands of some Pillar of Society who thinks he's the stand-on vessel in any situation.

Even in our club today, as we were preparing to leave, we saw a 30' Nonsuch at near full throttle running out one of the club channels. If another boat had backed out, there's no way that Nonsuch could have stopped in time.

So, still too many a$$holes on the water, or normal folks who just don't know better. What's the solution?
 
May 23, 2004
3,319
I'm in the market as were . Colonial Beach
This happened right by where I keep my boat. It is a shame but we have been saying that Monroe Bay should be a no wake zone for the entire bay. This has been going on for sometime. People fly in that area right by my dock. Maybe now they will consider what should have been done and what should have prevented this from happening.

People do some crazy stuff in Monroe Bay. I have seen people on Jet Skis with babies...yes, young babies, on them. There are large power boats that go at mid speed through the harbor and launch 4 foot waves in a protected harbor. I am sure that my boat has taken a beating this holiday weekend while I was away at work.

It is a shame.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
The cause was simple and happens all the time. The second boat was following too closely and not giving full time and attention to driving. We have rearend collisions on the road everyday for the same reason. The Jet Ski was just there but was not the cause.
 

MitchM

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Jan 20, 2005
1,031
Nauticat 321 pilothouse 32 Erie PA
where i boat on the great lake erie, it is jetskier fun to try to cut in front of you and cross as close to your bow as possible . 5 blasts of the horn does nothing but increase their fun and reckless behavior. since i am under sail and they are engined, i have theoretical right of way -- but also an obligation to alter course if possible to avoid an accident. these young jetski morons need to take required mandatory safety boating courses before they are let loose on our waters. but that opens the door for more government regulation of the rest of us who are cautious and obey the COLREGS.... i might add that when i sail or row my 16 foot unpowered engineless skiff on the local waters, some motorboaters get a big kick out of cutting in as close as possible .. some even cut by to offer me a beer. ( go figure....)
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
There are many fools out there on the water and on the roads. Our marine police try to ride herd on the bad behavior but it is a big bay and there aren't many cops. We have enough laws and rules we just have too many Darwin candidates.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
If you run over a jetski he will have to be so close that you couldn't avoid him/it. You absolutely could not do it on purpose. It would be like trying to catch a dog or cat on foot.
 

kenn

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Apr 18, 2009
1,271
CL Sandpiper 565 Toronto
If you run over a jetski he will have to be so close that you couldn't avoid him/it. You absolutely could not do it on purpose. It would be like trying to catch a dog or cat on foot.
Except in the case of jetski breakdown, or rider injury. ;)

Once when I was windsurfing on Lake Erie (Long Pt) I sailed out to the aid of a jetski whose rider couldn't climb back on board due to a wrist sprain when falling.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Except in the case of jetski breakdown, or rider injury. ;)

Once when I was windsurfing on Lake Erie (Long Pt) I sailed out to the aid of a jetski whose rider couldn't climb back on board due to a wrist sprain when falling.
I can catch an injured dog or cat too. ;) But if that fool is buzzing my boat he is just a Darwin candidate. I will be glad to pick up the pieces.
 
May 23, 2004
3,319
I'm in the market as were . Colonial Beach
I have always said that it should be legal for us to shoot paintballs at jetskis. It could become quite a sport on both sides!
 
Apr 5, 2010
565
Catalina 27- 1984 Grapevine
Another sailor remarked as two sailboats were heading toward collision "Oh, no, we're gonna hit, in a few minutes". Notice how when sailors "collide" the result is usually a scowl and some waxing and a protest filed with a race committee. It's a difference in lifestyles from other boaters.
 
Dec 9, 2008
426
1980 Hunter 30 "Denali" Seaford, VA
Sad, I dont know what it is about the holidays... I was in my motor boat trying to get out the channel to the bigger water, I had three different boats towing tubers near me, one after another they dumped their rider in front of me. I had no where to go and had to come to a complete stop,which wasn't so bad, but who puts their riders in a situation like that? Someone less attentive may have accidentally not seen the riders in water. There was bigger water all around but they chose literally the worst spot... And it was three boats that seemed completely unrelated to each other.
 
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