Should I buy it

[jerdsneker]

I am new to sailing...or hope to be. I live in the Hudson River Valley in NY and an amazing offer has come my way. In short, I think I can get my hands on a 1965 19' O'Day Mariner for the price of a 16-piece bucket of KFC. Seriously, the cost to purchase the boat is less than nominal.

The catch...and there is always a catch, is that the boat needs some TLC. It looks like the bottom needs to be painted (who knew that boat paint cost $180 a gallon. But how many gallons does it take to paint the bottom of a boat?) and the outboard motor probably needs a hearty servicing (notice it holding up the boat). Other than that I think she'll float...and hopefully sail. it had been used by a local sailing club and they decided to sell off two of their extra boats.

The sails and rigging are all intact. I have access to a boat slip and the current owner will allow me to keep the boat in their yard until the Spring and let me work on it there as well with the folks who will be working on three other sail boats, so I will have no storage or mooring fees until the fall.

Oh there is one other minor point to consider...I don't know how to sail. So one option is to forgo the boat and the repairs and take sailing lessons (a minimum of $200 -$400 a person) and enjoy the summer on the Loose Goose II, my father-in-law's Maxum motorboat. Or for the same price, I can buy the O'Day and learn on my own.

The dilemma is, as my wife stated, " You are a renaissance man. Between the garden, inoperable Harley, kayaks and camping, photography and cooking do you really have time for another hobby this summer?" and she's right! Do I?

But for the price of a some original recipe thighs and a box of biscuits I can fall down the rabbit hole of owning a boat.

Can anyone give me some insight on what I am really getting into.

 

[Phil Herring]

I think I can get my hands on a 1965 19' O'Day Mariner for the price of a 16-piece bucket of KFC.

I don't know if you should buy the boat or not, but that's a great line.

 

[KMm]

First of all,have you sailed? Do you have any experience in restoration work or the trades? From the pic I would guess that you will spend the better part of the next three months getting the boat ready. At least $2000 on material and repairs if you do the work yourself. After 12 Boats if I have learned anything its there won't be time for any other hobbies. Then after its all ready, it works out to about an hour of work on the boat for every hour of sailing. I wouldn't have it any other way traded my Harley+ for the first boat in 1970. So ask yourself, not knowing how to sail are you dedicated enough to see it through? I took lessons and that how my addiction started, I fell in love with sailing the first day and never looked back. Fixing up a boat and then sailing the finished product is as good as it gets. I would spring for lessons or at least a couple of sails to see if sailing is what you want, then look for a boat. Good luck and Happy Boating

 

[Joe11688]

The Mariner is a fast little boat but being a centerboard sloop, it doesn't have the stability of the O'Day 192 (19') or the 222 (21' 9") which have keel/centerboards and are very forgiving boats to sail for the novice sailor. On the other hand, the Mariners are easier to trailer and set up and they make excellent trailer sailers.

 

[olsalt]

Of course you should buy it. What's the worst that could happen?

If the seller is a sailing club, a treacherous mmmerrrrrr renaisance man like you ought to be able to negotiate a membership or somethin so somebody can show you the ropes.

Except for hte bottom, house paint works just fine.

 

[jerdsneker]

good points

Thanks Olsalt...could you ball park the bare minimum maintenance costs I'd be looking at just to keep her in the water for the first year? My fear is that I could end up spending $1,000 and still be a square one.

I agree with Kaymar676 recommendation about taking a lesson, but the local school is about $400 per person. So $800 for my wife and I, where $25 for a boat just seems like too good of a deal to skip.

 

[Mich222]

Re: good points

Of course you should buy it. Give it a bath. Slap some paint on the bottom. Have fun.

 

[caguy]

The dilemma is, as my wife stated, " You are a renaissance man. Between the garden, inoperable Harley, kayaks and camping, photography and cooking do you really have time for another hobby this summer?" and she's right! Do I?

My advice, get rid of the wife.

BTW if you rearrange the letter of your handle you get, "D' Knee-jerks". What does that tell you? It's got to be a sign.,

 

[upei1]

Is this boat from the town of Ossining? Curious if it is...Cause I have already fallen into the rabbit hole. That cradle looks eerily similar to the one that came with my boat. I am similar to you, except I took the lessons last year and realized I should have done it 20 years earlier. Listen to the above advice given here my friend. you will spend some money, and hey if you don't buy it, let me know (smile). I plan (notice the use of that word "plan" ) to clean mine up a bit, put some paint on the bottom and sail the heck out of it until it dies (1965 O'day Tempest). You are lucky that you don't have to worry about fees until the fall. Maybe I'll see you out on Haverstraw Bay

 

[upei1]

Oh and By the way you do know what "boat" stands for, right?
Break
Out
Another
Thousand
Hahhahahhahahhahah
Best of luck and happy sailing......

 

[jerdsneker]

Upei1,

It is the boat from Ossining. I guess you bought the other boat the were auctioning off? Did you get to keep the cradle? How did you transport everything?

What shape is your Tempest in?

As much as this boat is a deal...my wife and I are not sure we want to start investing in a boat this year.

We living in Ossining, but my folks live in Nyack on the water...hence the free slip.

 

[upei1]

My tempest is in pretty much the same shape as your boat. Do like the man above suggested if you buy it. Give it a bath, put some paint on the bottom and have fun.

Thats what I'm gonna do. I'm new to sailing, but I love it, and if I'm not careful, I can see myself throwing serious money into an old boat. So I must repeat my new mantra:
Must not restore the boat...must not restore the boat...

 

[Indysailor]

I say buy it, but think hard about what your goals are first. The boat probably is a great opportunity to learn to sail and you can do that with blown out sails and a less than perfect looking boat. Of course, it depends on the surroundings and your ability to keep from spending wildly to upgrade. Our boat is on an inland lake and there are plenty of dilapidated tubs out there, but then we don't really have to worry about getting caught in the rolling seas of an ocean gale. Mind you, it's not free to own a sailboat, but I think the cost (which can be relatively low if you keep from pining after stuff other people have on their boats) is worth it for the wonderful experience.

 

[Sunbird22358]

The Mariner is a fast little boat but being a centerboard sloop, it doesn't have the stability of the O'Day 192 (19') or the 222 (21' 9") which have keel/centerboards and are very forgiving boats to sail for the novice sailor. On the other hand, the Mariners are easier to trailer and set up and they make excellent trailer sailers.

Joe, based on the height that the boat is sitting off the floor, I'd guess that this is a Keel Mariner, not the CB model. Keel will be cast-iron, weight is 415# and draft is 3'3". However, even the CB Mariner is supposed to be self-righting (165# Cb plus 200# lead inside bilge).
I have attached the 2-pages showing the Mariner from a 1966 O'DAY Brochure for reference for all.

jerdsneker; based on my experience, you will use about 1 to 1 1/2 Quarts of bottom paint per coat depending on brand, type, and your application technique.

 

[jerdsneker]

Thanks for the input everyone...we're still thinking about it. It's a 50/50 proposition right now. One thought we had was to wait a year, get some sailing experience and if we really enjoy it...then bu a boat that does not need as much restoration work.

 

[Joe11688]

Thanks for the input everyone...we're still thinking about it. It's a 50/50 proposition right now. One thought we had was to wait a year, get some sailing experience and if we really enjoy it...then bu a boat that does not need as much restoration work.

That's your best bet because like I said, the Mariners are a nice fast little boat but being a centerboard sloop they are not as forgiving as a keel/centerboard sloop of that same size and can scare the whits out of a novice sailor on a puffy day. A boat like that is an excellent choice for trailer-sailer that you can store at the house when you're not using it. If you want something that you're going to leave in the water, you may as well buy a keel boat or a keel/centerboard sloop that is more stable for learning on and also a boat that is going to be a keeper. I love my O'Day 222. To me these boats, and the O'Day 23s built after 1973 are keepers as far as small boats are concerned. Who knows? Maybe by then you may decide on a larger boat when you finally make your choice.
Joe

 

[jerdsneker]

Thanks Joe,

It's been a very tough decision to make. As much as I would prefer to trailer the boat, I don't think my wife is too keen on the ideal of having a boat stashed in her yard during the winter. Plus we have several options for keeping the boat in the water during the summer and I think we would get out on the water more often if we didn't have to haul the boat. being a newbie and trying to launch a boat with a 3-year old in tow might prove too much.

The more I think about it, not having to restore my first boat is starting to sound appealing.

 

[Joe11688]

If you're going to keep a boat in the water, you would be better off buying a boat that is stable, large enough for your family, and in good sailing condition. This could be a 23, 25, or a 27. When the time comes, you'll have a good idea of what you want. In the mean time, find some friends who own small boats and larger boats who are willing to take you out. This is the only way you will find out for sure.
I don't mean to talk you off this boat but years ago I went to a boat building company on Cape Cod and bought a brand new 16' racing sloop with twin centerboards. This boat scared the living crap out of me when I first tried it out on the lake. I tipped it over out on the lake one day and I couldn't get it righted because the stern had no flotation and it was impossible to flip up and bail it out. I lost my outboard which was stowed up in the bow. You couldn't sail this boat with the outboard on the transom because it was in the way of the rudder. I was a neophyte back then and that salesman should never have sold me that boat. It was built for speed and racing and not day sailing. I don't think I'd be into sailing today if I still had that boat but you learn from your mistakes. I've owned three new sailboats and this boat that I have now is the one which I have grown to love and it's a keeper.
Good luck!
Joe

 

[Sunbird22358]

Joe, look at the picture that was posted of this MARINER, I still think it looks more like the KEEL version! 415# of Cast-Iron should make a pretty stable sail-training vessel. I guess this could be a CB version sitting on a high cradle (maybe for a TEMPEST?), but I still have a feeling she is the KEEL version. What am I missing that tells you he is looking at a CB MARINER?

PS: The CAPE COD GEMINI is a very capable vessel, the first rule of sailing centerboard boats is ALWAYS keep the mainsheet in hand, that way you can easily pop it out of the camcleat to spill the wind in a gust. I have safely sailed for many years now in the GEMINI's home waters and can count on one hand the number of times that I came close to a capsize in the last 35+ years (including sailing a SUNFISH). The only knockdown I ever experienced was on our old Cal 21, A fin-keel boat (keel actually was retractable, but locked down while sailing) with 365# of lead ballast at the bottom of her keel.
I am also confused about how the outboard on a GEMINI would interfere with the rudder, it is clearly offset to port enough to clear the rudder (as is the 4 hp outboard on the transom of my DS II).

PPS: As much as I like the GEMINI......... I prefer my DS II, if for no other reason than her self-bailing (well, mostly!) cockpit. The wider beam may make the DSII easier to keep upright, although my old Widgeon was narrow like the Gemini and still was easy to keep upright. Bet the Gem would be faster though!

 

[Joe11688]

Joe, look at the picture that was posted of this MARINER, I still think it looks more like the KEEL version! 415# of Cast-Iron should make a pretty stable sail-training vessel. I guess this could be a CB version sitting on a high cradle (maybe for a TEMPEST?), but I still have a feeling she is the KEEL version. What am I missing that tells you he is looking at a CB MARINER?

PS: The CAPE COD GEMINI is a very capable vessel, the first rule of sailing centerboard boats is ALWAYS keep the mainsheet in hand, that way you can easily pop it out of the camcleat to spill the wind in a gust. I have safely sailed for many years now in the GEMINI's home waters and can count on one hand the number of times that I came close to a capsize in the last 35+ years (including sailing a SUNFISH). The only knockdown I ever experienced was on our old Cal 21, A fin-keel boat (keel actually was retractable, but locked down while sailing) with 365# of lead ballast at the bottom of her keel.
I am also confused about how the outboard on a GEMINI would interfere with the rudder, it is clearly offset to port enough to clear the rudder (as is the 4 hp outboard on the transom of my DS II).

PPS: As much as I like the GEMINI......... I prefer my DS II, if for no other reason than her self-bailing (well, mostly!) cockpit. The wider beam may make the DSII easier to keep upright, although my old Widgeon was narrow like the Gemini and still was easy to keep upright. Bet the Gem would be faster though!

If it is the keel version, I stand corrected. I know that they did build them even though I never saw any. Most were the centerboard version.

As for the Gemini; I hated that boat after I tried it. I'd have been better off with an O'Day Javelin. In fact, I did buy one after I sold the Gemini and although it wasn't as fast as the Gemini, it was a heck of a lot more stable than the Gemini.
I once sailed her all the way around Prudence Island from Bristol Harbor one day with my son and his friend. I would never have dared to do that with the Gemini.
It's true about the outboard. I had a small British Seagull engine on the stern and it kept interfering with either the rudder or the main sheet arrangement. I forget which. It got to be such a pain that I had to remove it and stow it up into the bow.
The guy at Cape Cod Shipbuilding should never have talked me into buying that boat. That boat is not for a novice. They may have improved it through the years but I'm talking about the late 1970s and early 1980s when I first got into sailing.
Of course, a self bailing cockpit would have been ideal even on the Javelin that I had which was very old but capable and fun to sail.
Joe