waste digestion

[Quoddy]

I have three questions about holding tanks?

For the sake of understanding how this works, let’s say I have a small 3 gallon holding tank with mixed waste, no paper, and I add KO with plenty of air at 60 degrees.

Will the final product in time be so digested, bacteria and all, that it can be discharged?

How long will it take to digest?

If the air supply is sufficient will the process be odorless?

 

[Benny]

I don't think the end product is supposed to be discharged, but pumped out. Not that 3 gallons or a 100 of biodegradable waste are going to cause any harm in a large body of water but watchdogs are more concerned with the letter of the law than its spirit. Go to the Raritan web pages for KO use instructions.

 

[ITMaster]

Why would you not want to discharge it in a sanitary manner? I personally enjoy eating the fish, crabs, oysters and clams that I can get out of the waters I am normally in. I enjoy swimming in these same waters. I would think that you would prefer to use the waters that are unpolluted. In lieu of trying to figure out a way to legally get away with contributing to pollution, I would consider you a more responsible steward of our land, air, water and other natural resources if you would make use of an approved waste discharge station and saving our environment for our offspring. Please give this concept serious consideration for all of us that use and enjoy our limited resources.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Humor intended

Quoddy, buy Peggie's book, that's why she wrote it!

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

The answer to your question is: No.

It would not be legal to discharge the final product overboard in ANY U.S. waters, only in open ocean at least 3 miles from the nearest point on the whole US coastline.

However, whether there's any TP in the tank is irrelevant, and at 60 degrees, bacterial activity becomes so sluggish that very little would be happening in the tank anway...although plenty of fresh air and K.O. WOULD make the tank contents odor-free.

Only "treated" waste from a CG certified Type I or II MSD (treatment device) can legally be discharged into *any* US waters. There is nothing that can be added or done to the contents of a holding tank (Type III) to make it legal to dump it. In fact, even if waste is treated by a Type I or II before going into a tank, it's still illegal to dump the tank.

Reason: The law requires that "treated waste" meet specific minimum standards...for a Type I--legal on boats under 66'--the device must reduce bacteria count to no more than 1000/100ml and macerate to "no visible solids." That requires a chemical to kill bacteria and maceration for MUCH longer than any toilet or overboard discharge macerator would be in contact with it. Any treatment device must be certified in prototype by the USCG that it meets those standards, and then each unit must be mfrd exactly as certified and have a label affixed that has all the required info on it. So that rules out any boat owners cobbling up their own one-off treatment devices, because one-offs can't be certified by the CG.

Why isn't waste that's been treated before it goes into a tank still considered "treated?" Because only ONE bacterium has to survive multiply into zillions again in the tank and there's no way to measure the count once it's been in the tank. So the waste from any treatment device MUST discharge directly overboard for the waste to be considered "treated."

So if you'd rather discharge waste overboard legally (except in water specifically designated "no discharge") and with -0- negative impact on the environment instead of holding it for pumpout, your only choice is a Type I MSD. Check out the Raritan Electro Scan and PuraSan. Raritan Waste Treatment

And some of you need to climb down off your environmental high horses...he wasn't trying to figure out a way to legally get away with contributing to pollution, he asked if the tank contents would be changed to a non-polluting entity. And if you think that treatment devices DO contribute to pollution, you need to learn something about them.

 

[Quoddy]

Clean water

I am keenly aware of environmental stewardship and this is why I was wondering about the process of waste treatment. Composting toilets yield a pathogen free and clean substance as long as no toxic chemicals, metals or pharmaceuticals are introduced. I wondered if this KO would do the same.
I just read the answer to my question and now I understand the situation more clearly. I also see KO is for odor control not treatment.
Keeping clean water clean and helping clean up polluted water is my first priority.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Actually, quoddy...

It wouldn't be legal to dump compost overboard either, no matter how "clean" it is. In fact, in most states, it's not even legal to put it on gardens that grow produce for human consumption.

And there's the matter of liquids...disposal of liquids is one of the major drawbacks to onboard composting systems 'cuz they can't legally be discharged--drained, poured over the side etc--either.

Does any of that make sense? Doesn't matter whether it does or not...it's what the law dictates. So there's no point in debating whether it makes sense or not.

Holding tanks aren't a particularly environmentally sound solution either...the contents end up in sewage treatment plants where they MIGHT be treated to a lower standard than most onboard devices do it before they go into the waters...IF a heavy rain doesn't cause the treatment plant to overflow before it can be treated. It's the ultimate irony that the very day RI's statewide "no discharge" law went into effect, a sewage treatment plant spill closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in Narragansett Bay for a week!

So there is no perfect solution...we all do the best we can and hope it's enough.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Ultimate Irony or

... there's no point in debating whether it makes sense or not....It's the ultimate irony that the very day RI's statewide "no discharge" law went into effect, a sewage treatment plant spill closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in Narragansett Bay for a week!

Ultimate Irony or just tellin' us something about that lack of sense?

Divine intervention...???

 

[Napa Ed]

Sometimes a person will ask a hypothetical question in order to learn. It's putting the cart before the horse to jump on the op assuming he/she want to sling poo all over someone else's beloved sailing grounds.

Answering the questions in order: No, Can't get there from here, You won't smell it if you stand back far enough.

Then a respondent might add "of course you weren't thinking of slinging poo all over someone else's beloved sailing grounds, were you?".

quoddy didn't mention the possibility of dumping compost overboard. was just trying see if there is a comparison between processes.

 

[alexco38]

Go for a swim

The only way to get around the law is to go for a swim. But I wouldn't be swimming or fishing near you.

 

[Head Master18695]

Napa Ed wrote "Sometimes a person will ask a hypothetical question in order to learn."

Quite true. But there are others who ask "loaded questions," then search the reply for something that will tend to back up their own particular concept or theory, even if it was not what the author intended. These folks sometimes become argumentive, "Well what if... Suppose that...." As Peggie will (I'm sure) attest, one must thoroughly mull over their reply to a question, particularly when it applies to actual laws, before offering a response. Too often, someone is waiting to pounce on the reply and say, "gotcha!" So we all have to be very careful when formulating an answer to any particular question, especially when legal issues are at stake.

As Peggie stated, holding tank additives such as K.O. and Odorlos simply "treat" the contents of the holding tank to neutralize or reduce the odor. Nothing more. They do not disinfect the waste or treat it in any way that will make it fit to be discharged overboard.

The only way toilet waste can be treated to where it can be discharged overboard, is for it to have been run through a Coast Guard certified treatment system, then discharged overboard. This is an add-on MACHINE, used in conjunction with a toilet; it is not a toilet, or an additive to go into a holding tank.

While there are others also available, the two most popular Type I treatment systems, also called MSD's (marine sanitation devices), are Raritan's Electro-Scan and Purasan treatment systems. Type I systems are legal for use on boats up to and including 65 feet LOA - but only in areas that are not federally-mandated No Discharge Zones.