Catalina Island Generator Question

[Rick D]

I have been asked to participate in a survey. I am primarily interested in the opinions of those who frequent Catalina Island, but welcome others' opinions too. This is a question about the policy on generators. The current policy is that generators are permitted after 0700 and no later than 2200. So, do you think this rule is OK? Should there be a different rule or time relating to on-deck air cooled portable generators? Should generators be allowed at all? Should generators be restricted to certain locations?

I want to remind you that many power boats do not have large inverters and rely on gensets for electric stoves and all AC needs. It isn't just a sailboat issue. However, sailboats are the dominant users of portable generators.

So, what do you think?

 

[larryw]

I've been doing the Catalina Island thing for over 40 years, on a variety of boat, some my own, some belonging to other, both power and sail. I don't mind generators, as long as they're quiet. Power boat gensets usually are, but they usually diesels, with an annoying stink and a constant burble of exhaust water. Irritating if it's right next to your sailboat. I use a Honda EU2000 to charge batts and heat water, but only at certain times, generally between noon and 1600. There's nothing more irritating than some person, frequently an employee of the island living on his vessel in the harbor, running a noisy construction generator he bought cheap when we're trying to have a sundown cocktail. Some of these guys run a genny all day, from 0700 to 2200. I usually ask to be moved when that happens, sometimes it works, sometimes not.

 

[caguy]

Sounds reasonable to me. I dont hear that well for them to be annoying.

 

[Frank P]

Hello Rick,
We make 10 to 15 trips to the island each year and primarily stay in Emerald bay were the moorings are spread out somewhat more than other coves. We also use an EU 2000 generator on most trips. I am very conscious of our generator noise and try to only run it only between 0900 and 1200. I feel the current rules are reasonable for quiet inboard generators particularly when dealing with power boats due to their limited DC systems. Unfortunately it all comes down to common sense which some people just don’t have. For example, I would not think it appropriate for me to fire up my Honda at 0700 let it run full throttle nor would I do this between 2000 and 2200 unless of course I had extenuating circumstances to which I would most likely explain the situation to my neighbor.

I know this is a very touchy subject, if the harbor department was to address this issue I would like to see something as follows:

1) All generators producing noise of XX DB’s at 10 ft from the vessel can operate from 0700 to 2200
2) All generators producing noise between (XX and YY DB’s) at a distance of 10 feet from the vessel can operate between the hours of 0900 and 1900.
3) All generators producing noise greater than YY DB’s shall not be used

XX DB’s would be equivalent to a properly installed inboard genset with water muffled exhaust

YY DB’s would be equivalent to properly exhausted portable generator

Each patrol boat would require a hand held meter (about $60) to be able to justify there actions of shutting someone down

 

[Richard19068]

This may not be helpful but nothing drives me more bonkers than generators gong on all hours of the day. There should be a limit on the number of hours a day someone can run their generator. We were next to a boat last year that turned theirs on ( an inboard set) and left the boat for six hours. They returned for fifteen minutes and were leaving again when we mentioned the generator. They said they needed it on because they were cooking dinner in a slow cooker! I know an hour limit would be unenforceable but just need to vent that.

I also can't stand people using a generator to run their televisions. Stay home if you want to watch TV! (Go to Doug's if you want to watch the game).

Most boats are at the island for a couple of days. For a relatively small investment I think most people should be able to get some sufficient amp hour batteries to get them through the weekend with maybe a couple of hours of generator between say 1100 and 1600 .

More specifically I think generators should be banned for an hour before and after sunset.

That being said, its a free country and I know people should be able to do what they want. I just wish more people considered how their actions affect other's enjoyment.

Thanks Rick. This is like the weather, lots of talk about it but there doesn't seem to be anything you can do.

 

[windward54]

I also carry and use a Honda EU2000 generator. I bought it because it was quiet. Since there is nothing worse than trying to sit on your boat and enjoy the harbor while some generator is next to you running, we try to use ours between 1300 to 1600, and adjust our time to do most of the charging when neighbors are gone. I usually try to stay away from morning hours as there seems to be more people on their boats in the morning.

I know that some of the employees at the island have caused a few issues, but they have been in the minority in my experience. Most of the time the boats excessively running a generator have been powerboats. You wouldn't believe how many times we have been on our boat, next to an empty powerboat with a generator running all day, their owners enjoying themselves on shore and away from the noise. And a lot of them fire up the genset early morning and run all day and into the evening.

Legislating good behavior never seems to work, but the amount of noise has grown over the years. I guess some people don't seem to care about being neighborly anymore. So I guess I would come down on the side of setting a window in which generators could be run.

 

[timvg]

I think the current policy works fairly well. Like you said, it's not just sailboats. I've often been moored next to a powerboat with an inboard generator's exhaust having direct access to my cockpit. I'll take the noise over the exaust any time, so it's really a matter of ALL generators.

If possible, I try to run my 2000 when people are not sitting in their cockpits. I even go as far as pointing the generator away from occupied boats.

So my vote would be to keep it the same, but do your best to not disturb your neighbor when they are in their cockpit. It's the price we pay for living in a very crowded state.

 

[Franklin]

I have an in-board, kind of, genset. It came with the boat and is mounted in the lazerette. It had very limited insulation and was very loud, it being a diesel 3.5kw. I put in 1" insulation all the way around (except underneith it). That reduced the noise a lot but I believe it's still too loud if somebody is within 80-100 feet but it's even louder down below

So I ordered a $600 wind generator and hope to get a 150W solar panel. I figure between those two, I should be able to keep my batteries up without the engine or genset but I'll keep the genset for 110v usage when needed.

Not meant to hi-jack, but my question is: would you rather have a mildly noisey wind generator all day at high winds or a diesel genset for 2-3 hours at mid-day?

 

[Rick D]

I'd rather have the diesel, Franklin. The wind generators (three-blade) IMHO are really irritating within 150'. The five - plus blade units are a lot quieter in my experience, but not noise free. I personally can't imagine having one in the cockpit 24 / 7 and would rather invest in more solar or a sound enclosure and water separator muffler for the genset. But, hey, that's just me.

 

[RonMcCoy]

Generator for medical reasons

I have a sailboat with a built-in 3.5kw diesel generator with sound enclosure, along with a water silencer for the exhaust discharge. Unfortunately, I have a medical situation where I need 120 vac power to run a machine for me at night. To our boat neighbors, it isn't too bad on noise but it's absolutely necessary for me. I run it from 9 pm to dawn, then shut it down.
I don't believe in the running the portable gasoline gensets as they must be placed in the open (cabin tops, etc) and the occupants run the risk of CO poisoning (along with those moored close by). They were never meant for marine use.
However, everyone is free to captain their boat as they wish. I try very hard to be a good boat neighbor and will make extra effort in choosing my anchoring spot and how I moor. Maybe that's the answer to many of our problems. Think about your actions on others. A little consideration will go a long ways.

 

[David in Sandusky]

Most annoying to us...

In the mooring field at Put-in-Bay, the sailboat directly behind us doesn't like to listen to their portable generator, so they carry it up and leave it running on their bow, which is, of course, 15 feet from our cockpit living room.

I am delighted that there is some regulation that is working somewhere!

My proposal would be same decibels as a properly installed inboard generator, from an hour after sunrise to an hour before sunset. Anything louder limited to 9 AM to 3 PM.

I would hope for a higher standard in pristine anchorages, like the North Channel, San Juan parks, and Apostle Islands. Of course, sound carries much farther than we think over water. Luckily the worst violators seem less interested in these cruising grounds.

There are no limits in our Lake Erie Islands. So popular anchorages like the north side of Kellys Island are a madhouse during a weekend day. But it is only 5 to 10 miles from home marinas, so the thoughtless (sorry, mostly power boat) captains all up anchor and run home before sunset. And weekend mornings there is bliss until around 10:30 AM. We have had much better luck at less well known anchorages, which I won't name!

 

[Guest]

Regulations?

Welcome to the country of regulations. There is no need for courtesy and consideration as the regulations will take care of it. If you were the only boat in the basin would it matter if you ran a generator.? Most likely not, but give it time and a boat will come out from shore to tell you you are in violation.

 

[kenn]

Given the size of the area, would it be feasible for the authorities to designate certain coves or harbours as generator-free - eg motoring only when maneuvering, no motors when at anchor or moored?

On our little boat, the battery is enough for two nights out. It's delightful to drop anchor somewhere and enjoy total silence... til a stinkpot arrives and fires up their A/C and their stereo .

(David in Sandusky: Put-In Bay - been there, done that, got the sweatshirt! This past May, we sailed from Leamington to Pelee Island, then to Put-In Bay, then around Kelly's, and back to Pelee. Fun!)

 

[Ross]

Oh my, The hidden advantages of being deaf. It would seem that the concern is not about generators but about the noise. Your freedom to swing your arm stops about one foot in front of my nose. Your freedom to run a noisy devise on your boat ends at my gunwale. The sound of .30 cal rifle fire usually drowns out the sounds of a generator.

 

[Joe]

Welcome to the country of regulations. There is no need for courtesy and consideration as the regulations will take care of it. If you were the only boat in the basin would it matter if you ran a generator.? Most likely not, but give it time and a boat will come out from shore to tell you you are in violation.

We're not talking about regulations........... we're talking about being considerate and respectful. Like identifying yourself. Regulations would be unnecessary if everyone respected the enviroment and were considerate of their neighbor. Unfortunately that is not reality... some people must be told when they are rude...

In your example, if there were no code violation.. then the boat coming out from shore may be loaded with a couple of campers with shotguns.... instead of citations.

 

[Anchor Down]

Cacophony Cove

Yeah, I'm over @ Two Harbors every summer, at least.

I understand a bay filled with rows of moorings is different than anchoring in a cove w/ three neighbors, but "getting away" is still at the heart of crossing the channel, and I do expect some level of peace and quiet.

I'm sorry for the powerboaters, but that shouldn't stop some common-sense policy that protects a minimum of quiet enjoyment for the majority. If their boats are not equipped for this destination, some simple modifications are in order for them.

How about shoving the generator-dependent off into a specific leper colony, er, cove?
Upon check-in: "Do you need to run your generator longer than three hours per day, or in order to run necessary appliances such as your stovetop or lights? Yes? Then you are assigned to Cacophony Cove: right that way."

What's common sense to one is unreasonable restriction to another, but I'd like to protect the mornings first, followed by the hour before and after sunset. So for me:
No generators before 9 AM.
No generators from one hour before sunset to one hour after sunset.
Shut'em down after 11 PM.
No running generators on unattended vessels.

That leaves a 10-hr window during the day and a few hours at night to purr away. If you can't re-charge in those generous windows, maybe re-thinking your energy use is in order.

I usually take at least one night per visit to anchor in a snug little cove somewhere between the Isthmus and Avalon, just for the perfect peace and quiet. The loudest noise comes from the swells on the beach.

 

[petersea]

OK here is my 2 cents.........this really appears to be more about noise then generators. If you are going to enforce sound levels you need to enforce all sound levels i.e. the late night cocktail parties and loud music (the drunks in boat next to you with the country or opera music way to loud), loud boat exhaust from dink engines to go fast boats, what about the screaming kids ?? What about the couple in the boat next to you who are getting a little loud in the pasion department ! ! It goes on and on....... Maybe keep in mind it is a public area and open to everyone . Camp grounds have same problems. Then there is the person who due to medical condition need his or her generator.... what would you do about them ??? Next thing you know the exception list is longer then the allowed list. (think about he handicapped parking program) It is difficult to regulate behavior and even harder to enforce it. Be careful of what you wish for ! !

 

[kenn]

petersea, you're exactly right that regulations can't possibly address all situations. But that doesn't mean that everything must sink to the lowest, loudest denominator.

Many campgrounds have noise-free areas, where radios, stereos, generators, loud partying etc is not permitted. Some also have no-RV, tent-only areas in near-wilderness conditions.

It seems to me that Catalina Island, like the US, is big enough that a space can be made for different preferences, including having a quiet no-generator anchorage or two.

My 1.83 cents .

 

[sailingdog]

Unfortunately, the mentality that common sense and common courtesy can be legislated is a really bad one, but stupidity and rudeness have run rampant and there is not much else that can be done.

 

[Liamla]

noise

How about generators from 10am till 2pm? Four hours should be enough to charge batteries and do what needs to be done. I don't get it that people will sail to Catalina and then need to sit inside the boat with air-conditioning on watching TV.
As for wind generators, I was at Cat harbor this summer and had the misfortune to be assigned a mooring next to a boat with an Air-X. It was awfull! It ran with a whining sound day and night. The good thing about boats is that when faced with this situation you can just up and leave.
PS; how about barking dogs? There was a tri on a mooring with a black lab and every time a dinghy went by it would run around on deck and bark for 15-20 minutes. Then twice a day the owners would take it in their dinghy to go shit on the Island!!