Questions?

Hermit Scott · Apr 10, 2009

Welcome to the forum Andy. I started here 6 months ago. I have learned most of what I know about sailboats from this forum. These guys and gals are very experienced, knowledgeable and you would not believe just how far some of them are willing to go to help another sailor/potential sailor.
One big question the experts on here are going to want to know is how much are you planning on spending? Do you plan on doing the Great Loop or are you sticking with Lake Michigan?
One observation of mine, and I am by no means ane expert, if you are concerned about speed, 30' sailboats may not be for you. In the best of conditions you may get 10 knots. Usually, less than that though.
How old are you if you don't mind me asking? (has nothing to do with sailing, jsut curious)
Just my opinion from reading stories about sailboats and reading the forum, but the sailboats that you have seen that ran aground didn't do so because they have small engines. Many world cruisers do not run aground and have no engine at all. The skipper most likely failed to plan or failed to heed a weather warning.

sinnettc · Apr 10, 2009

Andy,

If you're used to power boating you might want to take a look at the Macgregor 26x. It's not as big as you mentioned but they're an interesting hybrid between power & sail. They're trailer sailors with water ballast. As I recall they'll handle about a 70hp outboard and do 20-25kts. Not sure they sail quite as well as they power but they do seem to sail ok - technically the longer hull should make them a bit faster than my Catalina Capri 22 but I've been able to overtake the one on our lake more than once - I'd guess they'll do about 6kts in a moderate breeze unless you can get the hull to plane.

Paul Mermelstein · Apr 10, 2009

Andy:

Like many things, (cars, houses, girlfriends, jobs, etc.) it all depends on your individual preferences. We all have our own needs, so maybe you shouldn't listen to us. That said, there is indeed a lot learn from this forum. I suggest that you spend some time learning what you need, what features you'd like in a boat, and what you can spend (it's always more, by the way). You might also want to peruse www.yachtworld.com where you can search for all kinds of boats, any size, any brand, and every configuration possible.

To start the ball rolling, ask yourself if you want a used boat or new one. If used, how old, and how much time are you willing to put into it. In my case, I wanted a recent model, used, so I could get some value from it but not have to do a rebuild. So I bought a 39 foot Beneteau circa 2003 with a lot of upgrades and options late in 2007. Also, since you probably want a boat just for recreation, consider the three "production" manufacturers (Beneteau, Hunter, and Catalina). They are very good quality for the money, and large numbers are built and sold. Other folks, however, prefer other manufacturers based upon how much blue water sailing they intend to do, or layouts, or features, or whatever.

This season, talk to sailors in person. Go out with folks. Ask those with boats if you could crew for them to learn. Lot's of opportunities out there.

So ... research what is out there and that may help you determine what you want. Spend some quality time. Don't rush into it.

Joe · Apr 11, 2009

First of all, 10 kts is completely out of the question for a cruising sailboat. For a 35 ft boat, averaging 5-6 kts is a more realistic goal... that's not the max speed, it'll be in the 6-7 range.. just the average you might try to maintain when planning your trips. (even so, I wouldn't get married to that number, because, unlike powerboating, there are many variables in sailing.)

Second, sailboats don't go aground because of their engine size. That's normally caused by skipper error or a faulty depth meter.

Third, don't buy a Mac 26x. Those things are an abomination and not real sailboats. If you want a power boat, that's what you should buy. If you want a real sailboat, get one.... you can't have both

Fourth, a traditional cruising sailboat's maximum speed is limited by the nature of its displacement hull. Therefore, designers install engines that provide adequate power without losing effeciency. Not only will a larger motor not push the boat faster, it'll use more fuel doing it.

Finally, before you run out and spend a bunch of money on a 35 ft Catalina or Hunter you need to answer your primary question: why do I really want to switch from power to sail?

Roger Long · Apr 11, 2009

Hermit Scott said:
30' sailboats may not be for you. In the best of conditions you may get 10 knots. Usually, less than that though.

"Best" is a very subjective term. While myself and some other sailors would like to experience going 10 knots in the average cruising keelboat, most intermediate sailors and 99% of all guests would be white knuckled in terror and ears ringing from the skipper screaming to get some sail off. The amount of white water and difficulty of control goes up exponentially with speed so 10 knots feels about four times as fast as five.

I made the transition back to cruising after 15 years of flying airplanes so I'm familiar with the speed reference shift. It's an adjustment. I went sailing on a friends boat I designed, first time my boys ever sailed BTW, a couple years before we bought "Strider". Sailing in under the Harbor Visual approach to Portland, I realized that the last hour had taken us just about exactly the time it used to take me to say, "Portland Tower, 827 is on right base for 29." I thought, I'll never go back to doing this again. How wrong I was.

The mental adjustment you have to make is that the journey is the destination. You are already there. The gallley is stocked with food, there are books on the shelf, beer in the cooler, berths to nap on while someone else steers. Especially in an area where there is not a lot of scenery and islands, I urge you to get a boat big enough that you will be comfortable just being on it. Once you adopt that attitude, it's amazing how fast the shore slides by.

Five knots is an ambitious average speed for a cruising sailboat. You'd better be fixed and sure in your mind that you can make the shift to being content at a fast walking pace or you are going to be a frustrated gardener with a neglected sailboat sitting at a marina dock.

sailingdog · Apr 11, 2009

I'm going to offer a slightly different opinion, since the majority of those responding are monohull sailors. 10 knots is not all that unreasonable for a 30-40' multihull. I regularly sail at 9-12 knots on my 28' trimaran. I would highly recommend you get a bit more experience in and try sailing on as many different types of boats before buying your own. By doing this, you'll have a much better idea of what you're really looking for in a sailboat.

I'd point out that a sailboat is requires far more skill and planning to operate than a powerboat, since you can't just drop the hammer on the throttle and point the boat where you want to go. If your destination lies to windward, you're going to have to think a bit about what the best way to get there is. That is one reason why sailing is more about the journey than it is about the destination—IMHO, if you don't get this... don't buy a sailboat.

Five people is a lot of people on a sailboat, and a mid-30's catamaran might be a better choice, given your stated goals than a monohull, as it will have far more space for five people. Some good choices in this size range are: Catalac 8/9/10M, Iroquois, Prout Snowgoose, MaineCat 30, TomCat 30, Gemini 105, etc.

A lot of what boat you get will depend on what your budget is. This is especially true of catamarans, which can often be more expensive than their monohull counterparts. However, given the same LOA, the catamaran will generally provide far more space than the monohull.

I wrote this summary about multihulls and would recommend you read it.

andy k said:
Hi, I am new to this forum. I also have never sailed other then a little sunfish a few times a summer. I have grown up on the water and have spent a lot of time cruising on the great lakes with powerboats. I am considering switching to wind power. I apologize for the basic questions. First off who makes good sailboats in the 30-40 ft range. I am looking for a boat that I can spend every summer weekend on and a few week long trips with a family of five. Since I am used to cruising at 25 knots from point a to point b in a straight line, how fast should I expect a 35 ft sailboat to cruise for different wind conditions and under power. Also growing up on lake Michigan I have seen horrible weather conditions and many sailboats who run aground because of such a small engine. what would be appropriate set-ups for sailboats to avoid these scenarios. Please let me know what I should be looking for and what I should know before looking at sailboats.

Thank you

Boompa · Apr 11, 2009

Throw your watch away

Kidding, but realistically, the wind is so variable that consitancy of speed changes a lot. Whew, theres a windy sentence. We have an older 30' Morgan OI and the only time we see 10 knots is with a big current and 20 knot winds. Ave good speed is 6 knots and thats the hull speed. Our boat is a slug re fast design though and if you get one thats shaped better w a good fin keel you can go faster. But like everything, its a trade-off. Narrow vs wide, speed vs comfort. Our boat sleeps 6 and we do enjoy week long sailing vacations. 6 means 4 adults and 2 children. 4 is more practical. But owning it is the most enjoyable thing we've done.

seadaddler · Apr 11, 2009

Family

How about your family are and you going to adjust from power boat to sailboat,sailboats do like to sail kind of side ways at different angles depending on the wind conditions.
Look around at all kinds of different boats and take your family out on a sail boat with a captain for a day and than do a week charter with your family and captain and make sure you and family are really into sailing before you spend $$$$$ and find out it's not for you or you may love the slow pace relaxing of sailing but your family hates it,but it could be very exciting with some real wind while your flying along with out the motor just the wind pushing you through the water but your family is scared to death because the boat is heeling over side ways.
I started out sailing Hobie Cats with my wife when we in our 40ies and now in our 60ies with a 36 Hunter and she still does not like the heeling so be sure every one is on the same page or you could be very unhappy.
I am not trying to talk you out of a sailboat just telling you to make sure you will be happy,my wife likes our sailboat and she talked me into buying bigger newer but she is not always in love with sailing like I am.
Nick

bffatcat · Apr 11, 2009

couple of comments for newbie

Most of it has been said, Ill try to add a couple of things that have not.
1. Most women dont like sail boats (not all but most) If you want to sail with your wife or
partner find out if she is willing FOR REAL

2. Figure out what you want to spend before you go looking.

3. Be very careful about selecting a multihull for your first boat They sail faster but have other shortcomings Look in any harbor 95% of the boats are monohulls. There is a reason for it.

4 Said by others on the board, Sailboats run aground because the get into shallow water not because of a motor. Motors on sailboats are auxilary power and just that

5. Any Finally Sailboats are very different from motor boats. Motor boats are transportation Sailing is a sport. Most sailors do not intentionally spend a lot of time motoring