Anchor Question
- Thread starter frmreilly
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I have a question that is relevant also, what is the differnece between a danforth and a fortress?
For your sailing venue, for best versatility, you probably should have a 'modern' plow type such as Rocna, Manson or Spade, etc. ..... AND the Danforth.
The Danforth, especially if a BIG danforth, would be especially good for those anchorages that have deep gooey gelatenous MUD (like what you find inside of Great Kills Harbor). The other types would be good for all other bottom conditions.
One is steel one is aluminum but the Fortress performs better. Neither are the most reliable re-setters on wind or tide shifts..
Fortress are a Danforth type anchor which main claim to fame is that they are lighter as they are made out of aluminum and can be dissasembled and stowed in a bag. Some models come with a steeper fluke angle and can perform better in certain types of bottom. Danforth generally require a full stock of chain, about a foot per foot of boat length, and a good healthy scope. Identify your anchor and check the manufacturers recommendation of anchor size for boat size. Going bigger is never a problem except on your back as you pull it up. As has been mentioned they do not reset well. You do not mention the reason why would the PO consider it a secondary anchor. It could be is to small or it could be a clone of lesser quality in which case you will need a new anchor. I always think it is prudent to get an anchor one size up than recommended as long as your back can handle it as it will provide a safety cushion should the anchoring technique falter. Research your regular anchorage bottoms, currents and prevalent wind speeds and choose a suitable anchor and tackle.
I wouldn't recommend using a fluke-type anchor as your primary anchor. The problem with fluke-type anchors is that they can have serious problems with resetting if the wind or current reverses.
I would highly recommend you get a next generation anchor, something like a Rocna, Manson Supreme, Buegel or Spade. The Bulwagga is supposed to be quite good but is far harder to stow and the third fluke may foul the rode in a shifting current or wind situation.
BTW, I wouldn't call the next gen anchors plow-type anchors, as they are not designed to move through mud or sand—having more a scoop or plate like shape to their fluke than the plow-type anchors like the Delta or the CQR.
I would also recommend that you get at least 30' of chain and use a load-rated anchor shackle, one size up from the chain. Don't forget to mouse the anchor shackle pin.
I would highly recommend you get a next generation anchor, something like a Rocna, Manson Supreme, Buegel or Spade. The Bulwagga is supposed to be quite good but is far harder to stow and the third fluke may foul the rode in a shifting current or wind situation.
BTW, I wouldn't call the next gen anchors plow-type anchors, as they are not designed to move through mud or sand—having more a scoop or plate like shape to their fluke than the plow-type anchors like the Delta or the CQR.
I would also recommend that you get at least 30' of chain and use a load-rated anchor shackle, one size up from the chain. Don't forget to mouse the anchor shackle pin.
Anchors
Hmmm. Lots of opinions here. Let me repeat our situation for the umpteenth time. Our boat weighs 30,000 pounds and we've anchored hundreds of times in PNW waters in all sorts of wind and bottom conditions since we purchased Belle-Vie in 2002. Most PNW anchorages are some mix of sand, gravel and mud. The depth of this mix varies, but what I do know is that our 40 pound Danforth connected to 50 feet of chain with a 20 pound kellet, except one incident in Cortez Bay on Cortez Island a notoriously bad anchorage consisting of a thin layer of mud over hard shale, has always set well, always held even in wind shifts and has never been a holding issue.
I cannot speak good bad or otherwise about the other anchor brands, I am very pleased with the performance of our Danforth and have no desire to change at this point. One other odd note. Our skipper friend Bob has a Cal 27 with a 15 pound Danforth. In Cortez Bay that very next day he could not get is Danforth up. He was about to abandon his anchor when I offered to take the bitter end of his rode and give it a try. For a moment I though that Belle-Vie was going to break his ground tackle until the anchor finally broke loose.
I had 300 feet of rode out that night in 25 feet of water and we still slid about 100 feet. No harm done, but the Danforth flukes just would not cut into the hard shale. Of course the winds were pretty strong that evening, but still Bob's Danforth held just fine, but not so ours. Pretty good record, IMHO.
Terry Cox
Hmmm. Lots of opinions here. Let me repeat our situation for the umpteenth time. Our boat weighs 30,000 pounds and we've anchored hundreds of times in PNW waters in all sorts of wind and bottom conditions since we purchased Belle-Vie in 2002. Most PNW anchorages are some mix of sand, gravel and mud. The depth of this mix varies, but what I do know is that our 40 pound Danforth connected to 50 feet of chain with a 20 pound kellet, except one incident in Cortez Bay on Cortez Island a notoriously bad anchorage consisting of a thin layer of mud over hard shale, has always set well, always held even in wind shifts and has never been a holding issue.
I cannot speak good bad or otherwise about the other anchor brands, I am very pleased with the performance of our Danforth and have no desire to change at this point. One other odd note. Our skipper friend Bob has a Cal 27 with a 15 pound Danforth. In Cortez Bay that very next day he could not get is Danforth up. He was about to abandon his anchor when I offered to take the bitter end of his rode and give it a try. For a moment I though that Belle-Vie was going to break his ground tackle until the anchor finally broke loose.
I had 300 feet of rode out that night in 25 feet of water and we still slid about 100 feet. No harm done, but the Danforth flukes just would not cut into the hard shale. Of course the winds were pretty strong that evening, but still Bob's Danforth held just fine, but not so ours. Pretty good record, IMHO.
Terry Cox
Anchors
Whoa there partner, never heard that term before; mouse the shackle pin!? In my distant past working on the F4H Phantom J79 engines we always safety wired all fasteners clockwise, which is what I do with all critical shackles (halyard, anchor, etc.) and pins on our boat. Just never heard that term before.
Terry Cox
Whoa there partner, never heard that term before; mouse the shackle pin!? In my distant past working on the F4H Phantom J79 engines we always safety wired all fasteners clockwise, which is what I do with all critical shackles (halyard, anchor, etc.) and pins on our boat. Just never heard that term before.
Terry Cox
Yup, I agree. Anybody suggest that our new respondent do a search in the archives on "anchors" "anchor" and "anchoring" and "anchoring SYSTEMS ??????????
Heck, no, not me! :Liar:
:naughty::dance:
Yes, you missed something- the umpteen times that anchors/anchoring/rodes have been in this forum. And for the umpteenth time, when someone says a particular anchoring system works for them, someone will come in and badmouth that system just because it's something they don't believe in and/or does not work in their home anchoring area. And it almost seems that some people probably get kick-backs for pushing certain brands of anchors- for the umpteenth time.
Anchors
To Stu and Higgs, thank you for your comments. The purpose of my reply, which I have made many times before over the years on this forum, is that our specific ground tackle configuration works for us. I would hope that some might find this knowledge worthwhile.
Terry Cox
To Stu and Higgs, thank you for your comments. The purpose of my reply, which I have made many times before over the years on this forum, is that our specific ground tackle configuration works for us. I would hope that some might find this knowledge worthwhile.
Terry Cox
Ron -I do understand your frustration, but guest does not seem to be "for the umpteenth time" about that. He said, "Let me repeat our situation for the umpteenth time." How many times have you read about his 30,000 # boat asnd his anchoring problems?
Anchors
Mr. Higgs, unlike some posters I always provide a complimentary close to my replies. If someone disputes whether I've posted something like my previous reply for the umpteenth time or not, please check the archives.
Perhaps umpteenth is an overstatement on my part, but anchors, anchoring, anchoring systems, et al, has been covered at least umpteen times on this forum over the years and I have been more than willing to provide my knowledge and experience free of charge for those who are interested in my opinion for the umpteenth time.
Terry Cox
P.S. And I always offer a cold beer to my Guests.
Mr. Higgs, unlike some posters I always provide a complimentary close to my replies. If someone disputes whether I've posted something like my previous reply for the umpteenth time or not, please check the archives.
Perhaps umpteenth is an overstatement on my part, but anchors, anchoring, anchoring systems, et al, has been covered at least umpteen times on this forum over the years and I have been more than willing to provide my knowledge and experience free of charge for those who are interested in my opinion for the umpteenth time.
Terry Cox
P.S. And I always offer a cold beer to my Guests.
I am not sure who "guest" is. it could be anyone, but I appreciate your identifying yourself. i took your post literally meaning it referred to your 30,000# boat.
There are a lot of topics that get repeated. i have been on the board for quite a few years. If I have a question, I do not check the archives to see if someone asked it in the last 5 years.
I do not mind giving someone the same advice I gave another guy a year ago. We probably have covered pretty much every topic over the years. We could just forget the forum and let people access the archives. I would rather interact, even if it means repeating myself. If one is tired of responding to a topic, why not just not respond?
There are a lot of topics that get repeated. i have been on the board for quite a few years. If I have a question, I do not check the archives to see if someone asked it in the last 5 years.
I do not mind giving someone the same advice I gave another guy a year ago. We probably have covered pretty much every topic over the years. We could just forget the forum and let people access the archives. I would rather interact, even if it means repeating myself. If one is tired of responding to a topic, why not just not respond?
Reilly-Anchor questions at best raise blood pressures and provoke many to anger. If you do a search in the archives, there is plenty of posts going way back. You can track certain people's opinions and see how they change over time as new anchors come out and they buy them and use them.
Some have been using the same anchor for a long time and feel they have no reason to change.
I needed another anchor but I am not going to spend alot right now. After a bit of research on the net and walking the docks where I will cruise, I bought a bruce type anchor, 33 lbs. for $100 including shipping. I bought it because many believe it sets easily and it resets better than any other anchor in that price range. As a bonus, many full time cruisers swear by it and are willing to cut themselves to prove it! The plow type anchors are probably the most popular on my docks, closely followed by the claw(bruce) type. Many boats had them both.
As mentioned the new gen anchors are plow like in apearance but scoop and burrow more than plow. They are claimed to be better in grass which makes sense since they have a point instead of a wide edge like the claw I bought. If I was going to spend $400 on an anchor I would buy a rocna. These opinions of mine are what I could glean from reading the archives and sales literature. Though I don't buy anything based on sales literature, I do trust the opinions on here though. "in the counsel of many there is wisdom"
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