Help me choose a boat

letterman · Nov 7, 2008

catalina 27, 30
ericson

kczach · Nov 7, 2008

One factor in deciding is your budget. I am a scow sailor that stepped up to a Catalina 270 this summer. We bought a seven year freshwater boat that was in pretty good shape. My wife isn't a real avid sailor either until we got the boat this summer. The Catalina 270 is a very stable boat that is easy to manage. It is very comfortable and just a lot of fun to spend the entire day/evening on. I realize there are lot of other good boats out there but whatever you get make sure it gets thoroughly inspected/ surveyed. It is worth the money to have an non biased set of eyes looking things over.

dvideohd · Nov 7, 2008

Costs...

Have you decided on a cost range... that will matter a lot...

Would you be willing to Trailer??

If trailer and new... Hunter Edge... Macgregor 26... Freedom boats....

If new and limited budget..... what is the budget range?

(Folks here will all have a lot of good suggestions.... go through the threads and you will see a lot of reasons why...)

If used - stick to major brands... If other people have them, then they will be talking about Maintainence...

What no one here knows is the budget you have to spend on the boat and the monthly time or $$$ you plan on paying out... that matters a LOT!!!!

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Just one lake? some ocean?? is there a sailing association nearby? You can join an association - get some training... rent some different boats.... this can save a LOT of $$$$$ - and you can find out if you want to do this...

Getting some training and experience is REQUIRED if you want a good sailing experience... When you are OUT on the lake - and the wind knocks the boat down - that is no time to start thinking.. Experience speaks there...

Have you found friends to go out with?

do you like power boats? Is sailing at 2-6 knots OK? would you rather go 12+? it is all part of the equation...

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Most anyone can cope with the 95% of good times... it's the 5% of sheer terror that you want to use the experience on...

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provide more info?

--jr

FWIW... spend less on the boat - and more on training - sailing schools and getting knowledgeable... find a local sailing school and have at it.... meet others out there and have a good time...!!!!

sailingdog · Nov 7, 2008

I'd second what JR said about getting some solid sailing experience and training... Unfortunately, without a bit more information, it is hard to recommend a boat. If you have a budget of $3,000, there's one set of boats... if your budget is $100,000, there's another..

One thing I would suggest is that you go sailing on as many different boats over the course of the next year or two, while you're learning. This will give you a basis for figuring out what you want in your own boat, and what kind of boat you're really looking for.

I would recommend that you try both monohulls and multihulls... most multihulls in the size range you're looking for are going to be sport trimarans, like the Telstar 28 and Corsair 24, 27, and 28.

Also, you will need to decide whether you want a trailerable boat or one that has to stay in the water... Trailerable boats are often convenient since you can store them more easily and less expensively, at your own home in many cases. They can also let you explore different bodies of water and sailing areas—and most other boats can't do 50 MPH to windward.

However, having a boat at a marina, in a slip, means that you can often go out for a short afternoon sail, where doing so with a trailerable boat wouldn't be possible due to the extra time the trailerable boat takes to launch, rig, un-rig and retrieve.

knowitall · Nov 8, 2008

Your smartest move would be to visit BHYC and OYS

There you can talk to sailors about boats, and the best ones for your suggested use. To sail on Lake Ontario (an inland sea), you will need lots of boat strength (both you and the boat).
Here's a link to one of the biggest regattas at this end of the lake - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYtrpiTSVeQ

higgs · Nov 8, 2008

You may be intending to do only day sailing, but after a while you will want to cruise to some nearby ports and from Oakville, you have many short overnighting possibilities including the Toronto Islands, which are really nice to cruise to.

For Lake Ontario I would try to approach 30 feet. A Catalina, as mentioned above is a good choice as would be many other boats. C and C are popular in the area and they made good boats, but some have deck problems. The lake can, at times, get pretty rough with steep waves. You will enjoy a little more substantial boat than a trailerable.

Perhaps I am out of line to bring this up here, but my YC in Olcott, NY has a Cal 29 for sale at around $4k with proceeds going to the junior program. I am told is has a good main. The boat needs some sprucing up, but for the price it looks like a good buy to me.

sailingdog · Nov 8, 2008

If you do decide to look at boats, I'd recommend that you read the following post, as it may help you decide whether a boat is worth looking into further or not.

Ross · Nov 8, 2008

Where boats are concerned I am the resident heretic. All of the boats that have been in service for a few years are good boats just as all of the cars available in the USA are good cars. Some are much better than others but if they sail and keep the water on the outside they are good. Almost everyone here will tell you that their opinions about the ideal boat have changed over the years of their experience. I have friends that sail a 22 foot centerboard boat by choice. They have had larger and have sailed on literally hundreds of boats. They will tell you that for their style of sailing and living this boat is fine. But different people have different needs and you will have to determine your needs and your sailing style. You can only do this with time and experience.

paphman · Nov 8, 2008

Dave

We sail out of Henderson Bay on the east end of the lake. We own a Catalina 22, and have had a great time with it. As some one has already said, the lake can get mean, and you need the right boat for the conditions. We have a great spot to sail. If the wind is up we stay in the bay, and if the winds are milder we are out in the lake. If you are looking for a go anyplace boat, I would not want anything smaller than a 26 or 27 footer. The Catalina 30 would make a great boat for the lake. You then have to decide how much you can spend for all the things that are needed to sail the boat ie slip fees, storage, sails, insurance, you get the picture. With our smaller boat we rent a slip for $700 a season, and in the fall bring it home. In the end it may boil down to dollars and cents. I do know that we are out sailing much more than most of the bigger boats, and that works for us. Lake Ontario has some of the best sailing to be found any place. Best of all you are at the top of the food chain! Look around for a nice boat, and have a great time. See you one the water.

Dale

Rich (P303) · Nov 8, 2008

Dave... you better get her interested in sailing. She will be pissed every time you shell out $1,000! And that will be often. It's one thing to have the money to purchase a boat... it is entirely different thing for maintenance and upkeep!

There's a BIG difference in price between a 27' and a 30'. Check it out. I would opt for a mid 80's / 30' in good shape... it will set you back 30k. 30' might look big in the back yard... it is SMALL in the water.

I have a Pearson 303... it is a coastal cruiser and/or daysailor... nothing more. It can get cramped for two... even though you can sleep six (I can't even imagine that)

I suggest going down to a marina and meeting some people... ask your questions... many of them would be happy to take you out for a sail (as they are short handed).

Good luck,

George H260 · Nov 8, 2008

I'd think small. Great Lakes sailors typically have only 4 - 5 months of sailing so find something that you can unload easily if your wife decides she'd rather have a horse or a RV. Ask how many identical boats there are out there. Try something like the Catalina 22 - over 15,000 made and still in production.

You said you'll be primarily a day sailor. I'd avoid anything that can't be easily handled by one person. Most boats over 25ft can be a challenge when the winds come up. In addition to maintenance and slip/mooring costs, You have to consider annual costs for winter storage, hauling out and splashing in the Spring. Do you want to move it and rig it yourself or have a professional do it for you?

Here's another option. Go to: http://h260.com . That should help you think this through.

Scott B · Nov 8, 2008

Dave, more info

We really need more info, such as your experience level & budget and a little more on what you're looking for.

You can sail a CL16 on Lake Ontario when the conditions are right. Friend of mine did so for many years and took his family out with him.

If you're lookig for a decent and well made sailboat / cruiser there are plenty of CS 27's or CS 30 available in this area. Made in Brampton back in the 70's & 80's and were a victim of the recession because they were too well built and thus more expensive.

Try Pat Sturgeon Yachts http://www.patsturgeonyachts.com/search_list_sail.php he used to work for CS Yachts and always has plenty of listings.

or Angus Yachts http://www.yachtsoftoronto.com/used_boats.php they have a few.

Or the CS Yachts owners site http://closereach.com/csoa/buy_sell.htm

They run $ 25K - $ 50 K. If your budget is bigger, try a Hunter with Inmast furling. Very easy to sail single handed with all sail controls in the cockpit.

larryw · Nov 10, 2008

Do you know how to sail already? Then get whatever your time/budget/desire dictates; but if you don't know how to sail, you should start with something small, a Lido 14 or something, spend a season with that, then move up. You'll be a better sailor for it.

higgs · Nov 10, 2008

I question wether a catamaran would be a good choice if sailing out of Oakville. It is pretty narrow in there and a lot of the dockage is mediteranean with not fingers in between boats. If you are thinking cat, a trip down to the docks would be a good idea.

bffatcat · Nov 10, 2008

What to buy

I dont mean to be redundant but lets see if my 50 odd years of experience might give you some insight about what to buy. Many good boats were built during the golden age of Fiberglass sailboats mid 60`s to late 80`s unfortunately most of these co`s are out of business. Dont worry about learning how to sail. You will learn after you get your boat.
Some do`s and donts: Dont get anything to big. An outboard boat should be suitable for
a first boat. This means something 26ft or less. You said your wife didnt like sailing. The problem : She probably thinks sailing is dangerous and is afraid of winding up in the water.
Dont buy a centerboard dinghy that can capsize. You get your wife out in a dinghy on a breezy day your gonna be sailing by yourself forever. My wife didnt like sailing about 40
years ago for these same reasons. She was afraid. After I showed her the boat would not capsize and sailing was not dangerous she liked it. We have been cruising the New England coast for the last 40 years. There are many many choices to name a few. Bristol, Pearson, C&C Islander Ericson ect: and many more. Do buy a stable boat with a keel. Get the boat surveyed by a competent surveyor. Dont buy a rehab project because its priced right. All your going to be doing is working not sailing or paying a boat yard $100 per hr to rehab it And finally when you do get your wife out the first time make sure its not blowing 25. Enuf said

Bob S · Nov 10, 2008

I totally agree with bffatcat. I am new to a boat this year. My wife is / was petrified of sailing. The first time she saw a boat healing (I'm not sure I spelled that right) she cried I'm not doing that! i have to tell you she literally cried in a panic the first time the wind filled our sails. I have to give her credit because she stuck with it and me. By seasons end we were doing overnights. Get her involved when you look and I suggest you look and many boats before you buy. Get her opinions and let them be part of your boat selection. Besides money, a boat will take much of your time. If she's not part of it or presures you from it there will be trouble.

Good Luck. Can't tell you how anxious I am for spring!

higgs · Nov 10, 2008

On Lake Ontario I gotta respectfully disagree with bffatcat. Your wife is not going to enjoy the lake on a small boat. The bigger and more stable you can get the better. a fixed keel will give you the stability she needs. Lake Ontario can be serious sailing and toy boats are not a good idea. Look at reputable boats up to 30 ft and you will not regret it.

Your day sailing will soon blossom into cruises so do it right from the start.

On this forum we recently discussed a McGregor rudder that was not up to lake Ontario. Avoid those problems and get a boat made to sail our lake. Most trailerable boats are not up to it. You may get away with it for years, but eventually the lessons of that McGregor will haunt you.

I am sure I will take a lot of flack for this post, but after 35 years on Michigan/Ontario I have learned a few things.

Brian M H23 · Nov 10, 2008

I sail a hunter 23 on Lake Ontario. It's a trailerable, but built in a lot of ways like a "big" boat - it has a big rudder and a 40% ballast/displacement ratio, with the keel rigidly bolted to the hull. I will admit - I took it across the lake last summer, and bad weather hit us. Survived just fine - though hard to make much headway against 40 knots when your outhaul lets go (Draft moved waaay forward and had nasty lee helm)
I would consider my boat about the bare minimum for open sailing on the lake. I've capsized 16' centerboarders out there more than once (then again, it was college sailing practice). You only get about 6 months of sailing, and half of them the wind blows like mad and the water is cold. I don't sail too much in those months. My boat is on a traielr, so I launch it when I want to sail. If I had more time, I'd have a bigger boat in a slip.

Scott B · Nov 11, 2008

and you wonder why people are hard on the newbies

Dave, if you're going to ask a question at least have the courtesy to repsond to all those that spend the time to research and answer your question. :cussing:

Help me choose a boat

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knowitall

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