Newbie, Need advise on how big a boat

[Baja Will]

Hello,

I am a newbie here, so I apoligize if this has been covered before.

I am looking to buy my first big sail boat, only had sunfish, hobie cats before. So first how big can one person normally handle, I am thinking 33-36' boat.

Next is a 33-36 big enough to sail to some of the islands say Bimini, Bahamas, and maybe down to US Vrigin islands. I know these are high asperations but if I am going to drop this much coin, want to make sure the boat is capable if I go for it.

Finally some background on me, have been boating all my life I am 32. Mostly all power, everything from jetski to 100mph+ Cigarette boats. Basically I want to see if I would like longer slower trips.

Sincerely

Will:dance:

 

[Baja Will]

Oh, any advise will be taken instride and appreciated,

 

[Sol Perros]

Hi Will-
We were in the same position 2 years ago- we had power for many years and considered switching to sail for many reasons - ease of maintenance, economy, space, convenience etc. We visited the dealers and looked at all of the new models of brand new boats first to determine which builder we preferred for features, creature comforts, perfromance etc. Once we selected a manufacturer (in our case Hunter) we then looked for a particular model- in our case the 34'. It offered many features that were important for coastal cruising (full galley etc). In the cae of Hunter the difference between even a 32-33 and 34-36' is marked (34-36 offers more interior room in the head and a wider beam). So when you go looking, check out not only the maker, but all of the different models (sizes) and also the years of those models (assuming you are not buying new) for more attractive features. We found for example that a 1999 34 had a wider cockpit than earlier years of the same model. And, as with car buying, it is the unfortunate truth for the seller that the cost of the add-on equipment that he paid dearly for will very rarely be recouped at selling time in any meaningful way- that means you will do very well to find a boat that is fully equiped with everytihng you want- chartplotter, a/c, gps, etc rather than to buy a stripped down model thinking to add these items on later. We love sail and would never go back! Have fun and enjoy your search- it is a buyers market now!

 

[kk703hh]

Buy as big as you can afford, up to say 42. Installing autopilot helps significantly for short handed sailing. When not in a hurry, pick your weather to meet your sail.

Key attribute for sailing the islands, which you can easily do an a 36 footer, is the depth of the keel, the smaller the better for island sailing. Ideally, but hard to find, is a retactable keel. Not finding one , a shoal keel is the best for going inside the islands. Over 6 feet limits your ability to get into a lot of places, but this can be compensated by a good, hard bottom, inflatable dingy and anchoring further away.

Good luck,

Keith

 

[sailingdog]

Baja-

James Baldwin, of Atom fame, published a list of small (<33' LOA) sailboats that would be decent pocket cruisers... you might want to read his list.

For a novice sailor, a boat bigger than 37' might be a bit much to handle...but a lot of it depends on the boat and how it is setup.

It would help if you said what your rough budget is, since that will often be one of the bigger determinants on what you can afford. Personally, I'd recommend going a bit smaller and getting a smaller boat that is in better shape and leaving yourself a 15-20% reserve of the total boat buying budget to refit and upgrade whatever boat you do get.

If you've never owned a cruising boat before, I'd also highly recommend you get some time in on various makes/models so you can have some understand of what you're looking for in a boat. Cruising sailboats aren't like cars... you generally can't just buy one and have it "ready to go". Most boats will need some modification to the layout, rigging or systems to be best suited for the way you will sail the boat. This is true regardless of whether the boat is new or used.

 

[Baja Will]

Thanks for the input, Budget is probably going to be 70-100K all depending on the boat. Not looking new but say 1995 and newer. I already completed some sailing classes and signing up for more, want experience on larger boat like 28'.

I love the water, and want a change in pace.

Again this may be a complete newbie question, but with a larger boat, if I run into problems I can just run the diesel motor?? Obviously I would wayne myself off.:dance:

Will

 

[sailingdog]

Diesels have a notorious habit of being least reliable when you can least afford it...something to do with Mr. Murphy...

 

[Capt. Kermie]

Bigger boat = bigger $$$

The bigger the boat the more it costs to replace & repair everything and to run it and moor it. The cost goes up exponentially. Even a small boat costs money annually, there is no escape, just be sure you can budget for it.

 

[Ross]

Re: Bigger boat = bigger $$$

Size determines more about how much you can take with you than how able the boat is to sail big water. There are many boats under thirty that have taken rank amateurs around the world safely and there are many tales of larger boats that didn't make the same trip for many reasons. I will not get into a this boat is better suited than that boat discussion because there are far too many boats for anyone to have comprehensive knowledge about them all.

 

[sailingdog]

One other point... Beth Leonard, author of the Voyager's Handbook, does speak about boats and boat size in her book and several articles. She basically states that she was glad she learned to cruise on a smaller boat, before she and Evans moved up to their current boat. She said that a larger boat often takes better seamanship, since the forces involved with the boat are higher and more dangerous.

On a smaller boat, it is often more forgiving of mistakes and you can often fix mistakes using "brute force", where on a larger boat the forces involved would result in serious injury.

She also points out that even though modern conveniences like electric windlasses and winches have made larger boats more manageable, the do very little to help in other situations. For instance, an electric windlass doesn't help you carry the heavier anchor or stow it in a locker. It doesn't help you coil and put away larger, heavier and longer dock lines.

And, as others have pointed out, the costs escalate with the size of the boat, often tripling or so for every additional 10' of length.

 

[RichH]

A quick 'rule of thumb' on how 'big a boat'.

Consider the worst, and the biggest sail you have up HAS to come off (right now), its blowing more than stink, the bow is plunging deeply into waves, it raining - blowing straight across instead of down, etc.

.... and probably the biggest (sodden) sail one can man-handle on a violently pitching deck in such conditions is about 350-400 sq. ft. (or about 50-60 lb. - soaking wet) ... and that gets you to a boat thats approx. 36-40 ft.

;-)

 

[sailingdog]

Of course, if your first mate/spouse/sailing partner is an 105 lb. 5' 3" woman, like mine was, you might want to consider what the maximum she can handle is as well... since, if you're out cruising as a couple, you're effectively two people singlehanding the same boat at different times....and there might be a time where she'll need to be able to get the sails down and stowed without your assistance.

A quick 'rule of thumb' on how 'big a boat'.

Consider the worst, and the biggest sail you have up HAS to come off (right now), its blowing more than stink, the bow is plunging deeply into waves, it raining - blowing straight across instead of down, etc.

.... and probably the biggest (sodden) sail one can man-handle on a violently pitching deck in such conditions is about 350-400 sq. ft. (or about 50-60 lb. - soaking wet) ... and that gets you to a boat thats approx. 36-40 ft.

;-)

 

[Sanders]

Charter first, then buy. That way you get to see what you are comfortable with. There are several charters available in the Miami/Keys area, everything from 27 Catalinas to big Hunters. As to size, it depends on you, your ability, and your comfort level, because some smaller boats are well built and can take almost anything, and some big boats are not up to snuff. We sailed comfortable for three weeks in the Bahamas (from Florida) in a 32 foot boat, and chartered a 27 in the Keys. But you will be more comfortable in the 35-40 ft range.
Have fun looking.

 

[Baja Will]

Sincerely, thank you for the advise so far, I especially like the comparison of getting the sail down.

I am thinking the 35 boat is what will fit the best, I normally would not be by myself, however want to be able to go out on my own if I choose. Also I could be living onboard for say a few weeks and don't want to get too bad of cabin fever.

As for mooring, have a place in Tampa that I can keep it.:dance: I believe the cost of ownership would be less than a 38' 1000hp go fast, but I guess we will see.

Sincerely

WILL

 

[TimCup]

Baja- I REALLY think you should listen to Sanders-

Sailboats are like any big ticket item- you have to pay too much, and have to sell it for too little. A mistake could easily cost 10 or 15 grand. And by that, I mean buying the wrong boat.

Most sailing magazines have 8 or 10 pages in the back dedicated to various charter companies. Most offer bareback charters, where you choose what and whom you need. You and one (or 3!) other person can take it and go. You'll find out more on 2 charters with 2 different boats than a month's worth of reading. How important is a12v refrigerator? Until you've been out there, you have no idea.

Things like power consumption (for proper batt bank), cooking, SHOWERING, etc are unknown until you do it. And until you do it, how can buy a boat with the equipment YOU need? Everybody's needs are a little different.

Good luck!

cup

 

[Rick D]

Things to Think About

I think you've gotten good advice. Over 50 years, I've had a lot of boats. Three were in the 20's: 26, 27 and 28. However, they were NOT the same to handle; design makes a big difference. Between my 32 and my 40, there is little question the 32 was easier to single hand. There is a large difference in anchoring, sail handling and generally muscling the boat around, to say nothing of the maintenance and expense. Certain things help: good sail handling controls, electric winches, good windlass and a helpful mate. I can and do singlehand the 40. Were I to do that a lot, I'd opt for something 35 or smaller that was a modern design with good gear and moderate displacement. Good luck, I'm sure you will enjoy whatever you buy, and the notion of chartering first (or bumming some rides on dockmates' boats) is worth doing.

 

[lrschultz]

Take some lessons in a club, use their fleet, a different boat every week/month if you want, and after a couple years you will know exactly what you want.

http://www.windworkssailing.com/pages/charterfleet.php