Need advice on 24 hour from long beach CA

[Ryan Blocker]

I have been reading some cruising books and mags like att & Latts. I have sailed all my life in california and have made a few dozen night crossings. And may day crossings. One of many things I have not experanced is sailing all through the night. I don't have alot of time but would like to feel what it is like to sail all night.

Myself and a crew of 3 (all have a fair amount of coastal sailing experance) want to leave our slip (long beach CA) at about 12:00 noon and sail for 24-30 hours strait. We want to do it in late November.

We would like to sail past the east end of catalina, out around San Clemente island, up to the west end of catalina and home. Of course this depends on wind.

A few questions for the "pros"
1. How much wind is there in the middle of the night between catalina and san clemente island?
2. Should I reverse my plan?
3. Has anyone in the area done this?

Thanks for your help!

 

[Ross]

This NOAA link may help.

http://www.ndbc.noaa.gov/show_plot.php?station=46086&meas=wspd&uom=E&time_diff=7&time_label=PDT

even better is this one:

http://www.ndbc.noaa.gov/station_page.php?station=46086

 

[Calif. Ted]

"typical" wind pattern for the area between the islands is for the strongest wind from the west starting about 1:30PM and peaking about 3:30PM and dying off till a calm at Sunset. Most nights a "sundowner" is common after sunset where the breeze will fill in from the west again, usually not as strong as in the afternoon. Sometimes the sundowner will only last a few hours, with luck maybe most of the night. Mornings a light land breeze from the east is common till before noon unless there's some weather in the south then the morning breeze will be outa the south.
Following a front down from Cat to SC is sometimes the best way to insure a nice wind that will last all night.

 

[newly anonymous]

you're asking the wrong questions

while I would agree that there's a gap in your sailing resume if you've never pulled an all-nighter, I would suggest a few other questions that you might want to contemplate first:

1. Moonlit night or moonless night?
2. Summer (short nights) or winter (long nights)?
3. Single-boat adventure or multi-boat (such as a race to Ensenada) adventure?

I'll never forget the first time I was so far offshore I couldn't see land, watching the sun set, realizing that I was committed to an all-night sail whether I still wanted it or not. And I'll never forget the beauty of my first offshore dawn.

My advice: jacklines, tethers, strobes, and a rule that no one leaves the cockpit after dark unless there's someone else on deck.

 

[sailingdog]

Also, it is generally a good idea to require everyone to clip in and wear your PFD after dark if leaving the cockpit.

 

[Ross]

If I were planning this I think I would plan on sailing with a full moon close to the equinox 12 hours of daylight and dark. I wouldn't plan a destination I would sail (in your case "west ) for 12 hours and turn and sail home. If you plan a destination then scrap the time table and take as much time as you need. The wind can fail or worse become adverse. Check the currents in that area, with no wind you may be set several miles off your planned course and have to do some serious navigating to find home. With an adverse wind you may be blown way off your planned course. At any rate I wouldn't plan my first all nighter during a dark moon.

 

[caguy]

You can check Wunderground and get archived graphs of previous year's monthly, weekly and daily weather patterns. Windspeed direction, swell and wave heights, etc. I used it to pick the best months to go to Santa Cruz.
Here is a link to the one from the buoy I think you need.

http://www.wunderground.com/MAR/buoy/2007/11/1/46086.html?graphtype=1

Here is a link to the general weather site where you can pick your buoy.

http://www.wunderground.com/MAR/PZ/655.html

Frank

 

[Calif. Ted]

Only problem I have with your planned route is that it leaves the "uphill" portion for the last leg and may impose some time problems. Consider going uphill to Santa Barbara Island, going around then to the East end of Catalina where you can decide if you have time to circumnav Cat. or stop for breakfast then hit the beam reach back to LB.
Yeah, Full moon and clear sky would be nice but on a clear night the freakin' glow from LA/LB lights up the whole channel anyway.

 

[newly anonymous]

A word in favor of moonless nights

The stars are amazing when there's no moon, and the phosphorescence is even better. Know how dolphins will come play in your bow wake during the day? They do it at night as well, and it's unbelievably cool when you can see their "trails" through the phosphorescence. And when their splashes glow.

A bit difficult to see your spinnaker when there's no moon, however. I used to have a maroon chute, and on a moonless night the only way I could tell it was there was to note where the stars were blocked out. After that I tried a florescent yellow chute, but settled with a pure white chute on the new boat.

 

[newly anonymous]

San Clemente Island

Not quite a decade ago I crewed for a buddy on a passage from San Diego to San Francisco. We got an afternoon start out of SD, and passed San Clemente in the middle of the night. There were perhaps a dozen navy ships out there with us, including a carrier and at least one sub. I suspect they were engaged in war games of some sort, because they were running without lights. At least once every half hour one warship or another would contact us, ask our intentions, and then request a course change.

One of the most bizarre nights of my entire sailing career.

 

[Nik]

As a rule in the past, and now; on after dark, short handed, offshore sails. Everyone on deck has PFD's and is clipped if they leave the cockpit. During the day we are a bit relaxed (dangerous) since day or night the risks are about the same on a boat. Yes it is a case of "our" culpa. Safety is important; but, it can be taken to extremes. The only way for me to design a machine so it is safe is to make it unusable. Anything other than that, will bring a risk. Bottom line is COMMON SENSE.....

Nik

 

[Rick D]

Good Plan...

...sounds like fun. Go to Sailflow.com to watch some wind directions. In general. going around the east end will give you a better point of sail from your departure. You will sail onto a wind shadow off the east end of Catalina tho in the later PM. You'll have to work through it, but will have some decent wind between the islands until midnight-ish. Then. you'll have light to zip until sometime around dawn. You'll probably have a beat to the west end of Catalina and a run after rounding it. Now, of course, you need to factor in the time change (I'd be inclined to shove off 1000 myself) and the fact that this description I gave is my experience on average, but there have been lots of time a run turned into a beat, etc. However, only a very few (precious) times have I had wind all through the night. The notion about going around Santa Barbara Island is one worth considering. I haven't done that, but the area around San Clemente can be a PITA and I have twice run into detours because of ops in the area. Anyhow, have a great time! Post how it went.

 

[Patrick S/V Shangra-La]

Moonless night for more enjoyment.

I agree with using jack lines, harnesses, and two people in the cockpit at night. I love the view of the milky way as it comes above the horizon on a moonless night, and the dolphins splashing through the phosphorescence is amazing. Just one word of caution. Keep a flashlight on deck. If you see a power boat of any size light up your sails. It will better show them your position and heading than your running lights will, and makes you more visible. You only have to show the light 10 to 15 seconds for a couple of minutes. Also make sure you have a radar reflector in you rigging.

Good luck have a great sail.

Patrick

 

[sailingdog]

Also helps to have a mast-top tricolor, rather than deck level running lights. The masttop tricolors, if your boat is small enough to allow one, are far more visible, since they're above the sails and swell, even when heeled. Second having a radar reflector aloft...

 

[Randyonr3]

Just my openion, but I'm wondering why in hell you are getting replys from people other than from the area you requested and on information other than for what you asked. I didnt see anything refering to safety or lighting in the origional question... seems some cant keep they're nose out of the forum where they dont belong, and just have to post something,
And back to the origional question...
I got caught in an area out on the islands thats known as "windy lane" where we saw the winds build to above 20 knots in just minutes. It was on the east side and further north but after we got back to the mainland, were told its common in the area where we were.. We were on a beat back to Santa Barbara from Catalina when it hit.. for over an hour we were pounded and then as fast as it came on us, it was gone..
Might ask around if anyone has heard of the term "windy lane"

 

[Ross]

Just my openion, but I'm wondering why in hell you are getting replys from people other than from the area you requested and on information other than for what you asked. I didnt see anything refering to safety or lighting in the origional question... seems some cant keep they're nose out of the forum where they dont belong, and just have to post something,
And back to the origional question...
I got caught in an area out on the islands thats known as "windy lane" where we saw the winds build to above 20 knots in just minutes. It was on the east side and further north but after we got back to the mainland, were told its common in the area where we were.. We were on a beat back to Santa Barbara from Catalina when it hit.. for over an hour we were pounded and then as fast as it came on us, it was gone..
Might ask around if anyone has heard of the term "windy lane"

Randy, To answer your first question, The last time I looked oceans are oceans whether they are on the left coast or the right coast. NOAA has weather bouys on all the coasts and making reference to them is just informative. I didn't read any of the east coast posters claiming local knowledge.
You make reference to "windy Lane" but have done no research concerning it so you only put it out here as a term that you heard or coined but thet you have little or no knowledge about other than a one time experience of an anomalous wind.

 

[Randyonr3]

Ross, the question, origional question was addressed to Pros. as that I am being I've sailed the west coast in question for the past 35 years.. The area in question was the Catalina Islands and not the east coast which if you knew any thing about them have tricky wind patterns that are only known locally and thats what he was asking for.
not safety or coments from the east coast.......
Keep to what you know.....and windy lane is an area known to many locals and was mentioned as an area to have knowledge of if he decides to stray north in the direction of Santa Barbara........

 

[Ross]

Ross, the question, origional question was addressed to Pros. as that I am being I've sailed the west coast in question for the past 35 years.. The area in question was the Catalina Islands and not the east coast which if you knew any thing about them have tricky wind patterns that are only known locally and thats what he was asking for.
not safety or coments from the east coast.......
Keep to what you know.....and windy lane is an area known to many locals and was mentioned as an area to have knowledge of if he decides to stray north in the direction of Santa Barbara........

Randy, Quote just one line that I posted that was in error or not pertinant to his question and I will conceed your argument.

 

[caguy]

Ross, Google Windy Lane Channel Islands

Ross there are quite a few references to the Windy Lane among the Channel Islands. It is the reason that we made the trip to Santa Cruz in July. The passage can be pretty treacherous and comes on suddenly. I have noticed the winds pick up from 10 kts to 25+ in nothing flat. I have been caught with my Genoa up each time. On the way to Catalina it hits about 5 miles out and last until you're about 1/2 mile out.
Randy knows of what he speaks. I for one would like to see a chart with those windy areas marked. We also have one out from the LA harbor known as Hurricane Alley. A favorite of local kite boarders. Novleman and I are planning a trip to Santa Barbara Island next summer and that kind of information would be helpful.
Frank

 

[Breezy Chris]

"Windy Lane" extends a few miles out (North) from the Northern Channel Islands (San Miguel, Santa Rosa, Santa Cruz, & Anacapa) where the prevailing North Westerlies are sort of "bent" by the islands and accelerate toward Pt. Mugu from Pt. Conception. Everyone who sails the Santa Barbara Channel knows of it, but it's a non-issue for the proposed cruises on this thread.

I like the original poster's plan, but I would probably reverse the direction (West End Catalina first). That's been a racing route for some time, I believe. But since San Clemente is essentially off-limits, under control of the Navy, I'd seriously consider the Santa Barbara Island alternative posted above too. SB Island to port --> E. End Catalina to port sounds like fun! Also SB Island, though tiny, has a lighthouse (San Clemente has several).

BTW--Can't recommend highly enough Brian Fagan's Cruising Guide for these waters.