I'm installing a PSS seal. I had a hell of a time getting the coupler off. I'd like to use some sort of goop to prevent it from sticking to the shaft in the future (yes, I've heard the warnings against it). The PSS seal has two o-rings made from nitrile. PYI/PSS strongly warns against using petroleum products. I have the following on hand: Starbrite PTFE, silicone spray, dielectric grease, possibly some lithium spray and if I absolutely have to, I have some TefGel. I would really hate to waste all my expensive Tefgel on this
Anti-seize that's safe for o-rings
- Thread starter Project_Mayhem
- Start date
I would use TefGel. The sprays you have will disappear rather quickly and not prevent longer term sticking.
A little goes a long way for TefGel, so you might not use as much as you think. Use a small acid brush to put on a thin layer.
Mark
A little goes a long way for TefGel, so you might not use as much as you think. Use a small acid brush to put on a thin layer.
Mark
A better solution is a split coupler and an anti corrosion spray like CRC Heavy Duty Corrosion Inhibitor (Amazon Link). After installing the split coupler to the shaft and transmission, spray it with the Corrosion Inhibitor. Learned this from one of Steve D'Antonio's articles. It works. Buck Algonquin also makes a coupling removal tool.
So now I'm realizing the coupler you are talking about is the shaft coupler on the transmission. I thought you were describing some type of coupler the PSS used in its assembly (I don't know much about those).
How would you expect any grease from the shaft-transmission coupler to get to the PSS o-rings? Seems like they would be separated from each other by some distance.
Mark
How would you expect any grease from the shaft-transmission coupler to get to the PSS o-rings? Seems like they would be separated from each other by some distance.
Mark
jssailem
SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
- Oct 22, 2014
- 24,454
Terminology.
PSS Seal uses a "The Shaft Retention Collar" with O-rings.
The Coupler is at the end of the shaft, connecting it to the transmission.
In either case, the idea of both the Collar and the Coupler is to attach to the shaft securely and not move. Any coatings you add are potentially defeating the purpose of the units.
The collar uses clamping friction to ensure that the collar stays in place. It is the belt and suspenders that keep the shaft from sliding out of the boat in a catastrophic failure. The O-rings provide a way to minimize water from getting beneath the Rotor. Annual inspection for signs of "wear, aging, or chemical deterioration".
If you are talking about the coupler, I did not use any chemicals to impact the friction needed to maintain the fitted connection between the rotating shaft and the transmission. Should I need to remove the coupler, I would need to take the shaft and coupler to be fitted and refaced so that there is a proper match to the transmission.
PSS Seal uses a "The Shaft Retention Collar" with O-rings.
The Coupler is at the end of the shaft, connecting it to the transmission.
In either case, the idea of both the Collar and the Coupler is to attach to the shaft securely and not move. Any coatings you add are potentially defeating the purpose of the units.
The collar uses clamping friction to ensure that the collar stays in place. It is the belt and suspenders that keep the shaft from sliding out of the boat in a catastrophic failure. The O-rings provide a way to minimize water from getting beneath the Rotor. Annual inspection for signs of "wear, aging, or chemical deterioration".
PSS Seal suggests preventative maintenance with a precautionary replacement recommendation in 8-10 year intervals. During bellows replacement, it is recommended that the o-rings and set screws in the stainless steel rotor also be replaced.
It is not anticipated that you will remove the collar frequently. When done, it will be an out-of-the-water replacement project. If you are talking about the coupler, I did not use any chemicals to impact the friction needed to maintain the fitted connection between the rotating shaft and the transmission. Should I need to remove the coupler, I would need to take the shaft and coupler to be fitted and refaced so that there is a proper match to the transmission.
My appologies for not being clear. I'm looking to apply anti seize to the prop shaft coupler and shaft
CRC would need to be applied to the shaft or ID of the coupler for it to be effective in this situation. My coupler is loose on the shaft because I don't have enough clearance to get a hammer in there to tap it on. Even with this extra clearance on the ID of the coupler, it was a pain getting it off due to corrosion
There's around 5" between the shaft and the PSS seal. I assume at some point a small amount will creep from the coupler to the PSS seal
This is why a split coupler is nice. The coupler can be spread open so the shaft can easily slid into the coupler and then clamped down on the shaft. The spray then seals the coupler and prevents moisture from getting in between the shaft and coupler. To remove a split coupler, the clamp bolts are removed and a wedge is driven into the split to increase the ID. The B-A flange puller can then pull the flange off with a little help from some PB Blaster.
Marine Coupler Flange Puller Removal Tool
Easily remove marine shaft couplings from the shaft using the 5" Coupler Flange Removal Tool - Marine Shaft Transmission Coupler Removal Tool by Buck Algonquin (50MCP00500) from The Prop Shop.
propshopinc.com
I'm aware of the benefits of a split coupler. They are also never centered according to the prop shop I used. I'd like to use what I have. It's less than a year old. I'd just like to be able to remove it easier.
The tool you posted will not fit. There isn't enough clearance. I 3D printed a 1" thick puck with holes that match up to the coupler. I placed various sized sockets in the center and pulled the puck towards the coupler with the bolts. It worked but it was time consuming and painful on the wrists due to poor access. This process can be greatly improved with the addition of some kind of antiseize
The tool you posted will not fit. There isn't enough clearance. I 3D printed a 1" thick puck with holes that match up to the coupler. I placed various sized sockets in the center and pulled the puck towards the coupler with the bolts. It worked but it was time consuming and painful on the wrists due to poor access. This process can be greatly improved with the addition of some kind of antiseize
Then pick up some anti-seize for vehicles. Boating is a tiny market, things specifically made for that market are going to be crazy expensive. But, nearly everybody has a vehicle of some sort, and an anti-seize compound is cheaper. There are several types for different metals, so be sure you get the one for aluminum, and you'll be fine. It keeps SS from seizing to aluminum in a salt water environment.
I can't help you with your question, sorry.
I also need to reassemble my coupling this spring, after a very difficult disassembly. (Though I did get to test Harbor Freight’s return policy on an exploded gear puller 
). If any kind of spray or gel is used to prevent sticking does that weaken the coupling/shaft interface at all and risk shearing the key?
). If any kind of spray or gel is used to prevent sticking does that weaken the coupling/shaft interface at all and risk shearing the key?
That was my impression / concern. They don't use a "light interference fit" on those couplers just because it's more fun to assemble and disassemble... I applied the anti-seize liberally while I was dry-fitting everything, but made sure to clean it off before final installation.
Better than my friend who bent his transmission's output flange trying to press the shaft out. After I saw that I went almost immediately to the Sawzall and had no regrets.
@rgranger Would you be able to shed some light on the chemical compatibility of PTFE based lubricant on a nitrile o-ring? I'm not seeing any compatibility charts that list those two together.
I'm also curious why PYI/PSS says not to use oil based products when nitrile is generally compatible.
If lubricating splined axles and shafts is the norm to prevent seizing, then I doubt it would cause any harm to a keyed shaft. I suppose it would make the key slip into a different position more easily but if it's enough to cause an issue, there was too much play between parts to begin with. I'm speculating so if there's anyone with more knowledge on the subject, I welcome your expertise
I'm also curious why PYI/PSS says not to use oil based products when nitrile is generally compatible.
The prop shop I went to said that lubricant on the shaft/coupler causes a suction effect. I guess it's because of the small grooves left over from machining? I feel like the likely hood of this happening is pretty low with a coupler that's open on both ends. I've seen this happen on greased automotive parts where the end of a shaft goes into a socket. This generally happens when a part is over greased and it wont go all the way in because it's being hydrolocked for lack of a better word.I also need to reassemble my coupling this spring, after a very difficult disassembly. (Though I did get to test Harbor Freight’s return policy on an exploded gear puller
If lubricating splined axles and shafts is the norm to prevent seizing, then I doubt it would cause any harm to a keyed shaft. I suppose it would make the key slip into a different position more easily but if it's enough to cause an issue, there was too much play between parts to begin with. I'm speculating so if there's anyone with more knowledge on the subject, I welcome your expertise
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My understanding was that the load on a keyed shaft was carried by the interference fit with the shaft, different from a splined axel where the splines carry the load. I could be wrong or misinterpret the effects of that though.
I don't believe you are incorrect. The friction from the tight fit carries most of the load, the key is secondary. Applying anything that would reduce friction would put more of the load on the key. A splined gear, like the one between the transmission and the flywheel spreads the load over many splines.
Same goes for the load on the set screw that keeps the prop from pulling your shaft out of the boat when you reverse.
I called PSS and got a very clear answer on this topic. The reason that they dont recommend oil based grease is because it creates a gap between the collar and carbon seal face. They agreed that it would do no harm to the nitrile o-rings. Since I had to use silicone to get my collar/o-ring assembly on the shaft (soap/water kept freezing) they suggested I wipe everything down with alcohol as best practice.
They said that PTFE grease on the shaft coupler shouldn't cause any issues.
They said that PTFE grease on the shaft coupler shouldn't cause any issues.
Dave, Sounds like you figured out what to do.
I use Lanocoat on my shaft/coupling to keep it ”loose”.
But as you know, I use a Volvo Penta shaft seal. It uses a water-proof grease on the lip seal. But the lanocoat doesn’t relit come into play.
Greg
I use Lanocoat on my shaft/coupling to keep it ”loose”.
But as you know, I use a Volvo Penta shaft seal. It uses a water-proof grease on the lip seal. But the lanocoat doesn’t relit come into play.
Greg
On paper it sounds like the perfect grease. I had never heard of lanolin before. I'm a bit weary of fat based products in this application due to the fact that it's similar to oil based. However, it appears that it is not a true fat due to the lack of glycerin. It'd be really interesting to see some test results of this along with other types of lubricants.
If you can use oil based, I'd take a look at Green Grease. It's beat all other products in a few different Practical Sailor tests.
I figured at some point it would drip down the shaft and potentially contaminate something. It turns out that my suspicion that the nitrile o-rings can withstand oil is correct. What surprised me is that they said the oil can cause a gap between the PSS collar and their hard graphite seal that the collar spins on