Winter wet storage in Massachusetts North Shore

[Walsh0575]

Hi all! I'm posing an open ended question and looking for all the pros and cons. I'm thinking of wet winter storing my boat in a protected harbor (Gloucester, MA) in a slip. What are all the possible cons and pros to off-season wet storing a sailboat in New England? I see a few boats around the harbor that are wet stored (and a few sailors enjoying a warm February sail), but the VAST majority of sailboats in my region go on the hard. I've mentioned doing this to a few sailors and they look at me like I'm crazy. Then others say it's no big deal to leave boats in the water (most of the lobster/small fishing boats in my area stay in all winter). Gloucester Harbor rarely freezes over.

NOTE: I WILL NOT BE LIVING ABOARD

Pros for me include: possible winter sailing, lower storage costs (current calculation is about $2,000 less expensive than being on the hard), extended season at the end and beginning of season, easy access for projects in the off season, I take the boat out late (December) and put it in early (by early May) all the work of getting the boat on the hard for 4.5 months on the hard seems wasteful.

Cons for me include: ensuring the engine is properly cared for so it doesn't freeze but I can still use it on occasion to motor to/from a day sail, covering the boat in a way so snow/ice doesn't build up (I won't use my regular fairclough cover because I want to use the boat occasionally), wear and tear of exposed canvas/sails (I assume I'd raise and lower my head sail each time I go out so it isn't exposed all winter, winter storms/nor-easters, any below the waterline work that needs to be done (non expected, except many new zincs in the spring).

Thanks!

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

Will you really be doing any sailing in the winter if the engine is ‘winterized’ and the boat is covered?

We sometimes left the boat in while living in New England with no problem but replacing the cover and winterizing after a sail is a pipe-dream. Too much work.

 

[Davidasailor26]

Years ago we alternated years between in and out of water storage in New Jersey. Keeping the boat in the water can certainly be done safely, but I agree with Don that taking the boat out is going to be so much work that it won’t happen much. Consider that even if you get a nice patch of weather it’ll probably only be really pleasant for an afternoon sail, which means you’ll still be doing things like uncovering the boat and bending on the headsail while it’s a cold morning. Then you’ll get back from your sail and need to winterize the engine again, cover the boat, and fold the headsail in the cold and dark.

 

[jssailem]

All is true.
Then there is the thrill of sailing with your buddies.

Strait of Georgia, February 2019

 

[Tally Ho]

I wouldn’t do it.

How are you going to keep a battery and bilge pump charged and working?

How will you know if something is leaking, as I assume you won’t be out to the boat very often , if ever?

Is the boat insured? What does your insurance company say about storing the boat in the water over the winter? I think they will frown on the idea, if it outright refuse to insure.

As others have said, you are not going to go sail for a few hours and then restore the cover, winterize the engine, remove the sails, etc…

For these reasons, and many others, I wouldn‘t do it.

Greg

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

I wouldn’t do it.

How are you going to keep a battery and bilge pump charged and working?

How will you know if something is leaking, as I assume you won’t be out to the boat very often , if ever?

Is the boat insured? What does your insurance company say about storing the boat in the water over the winter? I think they will frown on the idea, if it outright refuse to insure.

As others have said, you are not going to go sail for a few hours and then restore the cover, winterize the engine, remove the sails, etc…

For these reasons, and many others, I wouldn‘t do it.

Greg

Lake Michigan is one of the few places where everyone pulls their boat in winter. On the coasts, it’s not unusual to leave a boat in. Keeping batteries charged isn’t problematic, alarms are ubiquitous these days, and underwriters have no problem insuring them. But doing so simply to facilitate sailing isn’t practicable.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

I've been thinking about the same thing - leaving the boat in the water. On Barnegat Bay in New Jersey, the marinas are almost entirely in brackish water areas that are very shallow, so the water can get hard pretty easily. But we haven't had a winter in several years, even in the northern part of the state. I can't remember the last time I saw ice around a marina. If the shore power was left on (it often is because I've seen the bubblers in place), I wonder if it is even necessary to winterize in New Jersey. If you lived near the boat, why not just run the engine for a few hours during a cold snap (it rarely lasts more than a day or so). A tiny amount of heat could keep inside plumbing from freezing.

I think your winters in Massachusetts are quite a bit different, however.

 

[Art12050]

Our Winters here are now very erratic, you never know what we’re going to get. Others have raised very good reasons not to do it. Insurance, covering, uncovering, protection from freeze ups etc.
Above all would be peace of mind knowing your boat is safe on the hard during a howling Nor’Easter is the best reason not to do it.
Here on the other side of Cape Ann from Gloucester, by the end of October, everyone is out of the water.
If you really want to do some Winter Sailing, check out Frostbiting at The Boston Sailing Center or Courageous Sailing over in Charlestown,

 

[jssailem]

I think winter sailing in a keel boat can be somewhat encumbered, as has been identified. If winter sailing is high on the list of desired activities, then perhaps, a trailer enabled day-sailor would be a good option.

My Montgomery 15 was a dry boat to sail in all sorts of weather. There are many others that could fit the bill for a hardy soul with an urge. Suggest a dry suit with body flannels as preferred sailing attire with winter sailing gloves.

 

[dLj]

I spent two years where I kept my boat in the water instead of hauling it. Yes, it's less expensive. But as others have noted, the hassle of de-winterizing to go for a mid-winter sail and then winterizing again when done, is daunting. Turns out I never did go through all of that just for a day sail. I'll also note, that wintering in the water is harder on the boat than putting it on land. There would be numerous things I'd have to fix on the boat after a winter on the water that wouldn't have needed fixing if it had been on land.

I was just talking with the folks here, I'm on the Chesapeake, and they said that leaving the boat in the water is not as good for the boat as taking it out and leaving it hauled for the winter. I'm now opting for taking the boat out of the water for the winter. I'm also now in a position where I know I won't want to come down for a winter sail, I'll be spending winters with my granddaughter so that's also part of my decision making that may not apply to you.

I do know that I will be happier pulling the boat for the winter than I was leaving it in the water. If I were living on the boat, that would definitely change the equation....

dj

 

[Walsh0575]

Thanks for the replies and I completely hear you on the low probability of actually getting out very often. Overzealous sailor here…

So aside from not being being able to sail in the dead of winter (take that off the list) what are some of the actual disadvantages? @dLj you said there would be numerous things to fix after wet storage vs dry…what items broke for you?

Keeping the battery topped up for the bilge pump is an issue
Relying on dock lines to secure the boat in a winter storm
What else will be an actual detriment to the boat while in the water covered vs the hard covered?

 

[dLj]

Thanks for the replies and I completely hear you on the low probability of actually getting out very often. Overzealous sailor here…

So aside from not being being able to sail in the dead of winter (take that off the list) what are some of the actual disadvantages? @dLj you said there would be numerous things to fix after wet storage vs dry…what items broke for you?

Keeping the battery topped up for the bilge pump is an issue
Relying on dock lines to secure the boat in a winter storm
What else will be an actual detriment to the boat while in the water covered vs the hard covered?

I had two fairleads on the stern that actually broke in one winter storm. In some ways I actually think that was a good thing as it identified a weakness that I addressed and those two fairleads are now really solid - and time tested.

There were a couple places where some of the lines I had added on to withstand winter storms chaffed in ways that required work to clean back up.

I was actually on the boat in one winter storm and the wind was such that the boat was healing quite a bit. Luckily, the boat next to mine had about the same motion so our spreaders never got tangled up - but that would be something I would be concerned about. In that instance, I got lucky.

I have never covered my boat. I'd consider that if I lived on the boat in a northern clime. Makes for a much warmer boat...

It takes a toll on your lines as well. It's a hard life on the water in winter....

dj

 

[Walsh0575]

Hi all - OP here. I thought I'd give an update on my wet storage and winter sailing experience in New England thus far - consider this a Part 1 (Nov-Dec) with Part 2 being Jan-March.

I moved my boat from a mooring in Gloucester Harbor to a slip in a protected cove in November. I originally was squeezed into a slip right next to another wet stored sailboat. The concept from the marina was that we could both "hunker down together" which was an awful idea. We had different drafts and the boats moved differently in swell and wind - meaning the other boat was always rocking too much and in the small space left between our hulls I was able to squeeeeze a few fenders in, just barely. I did worry about spreaders touching. It also made coming and going for sails more challenging because I had mere inches on both sides when it came time to reverse back into the slip. When a to-be-winterized powerboat in the next slip finally left I moved over to a slip completely my own. Huge difference being able to come and go, secure the boat on both port and starboard in weather, and secure the boat a bit off the dock in wind so it's sort of floating in the middle of the slip.

Sailing has been amazing! I can only go on weekends due to the sun being set by the time I get off work, but every weekend in Nov and Dec there's been one sunny and windy day and me and my friends have gone out. It's been great to put my reefing points to use, and get the crew trained up on reefing. Winds have been considerably higher than a normal summer here. I changed out my genoa for a jib. It can get cold (last sail was about 25 F as a high) but with everyone bundled up and life jackets on we were good to go.

I left the solar panel on the boat and it has been keeping the batteries nicely topped up. I can attach to shore power if needed to charge the batteries.

I have a Yanmar 3GM30F which are notorious to start in cold weather (search the forums for more info). To alleviate the strain on my starter I've begun to come down to the boat earlier than my crew and with shore power run a marine heater aimed into the engine compartment. It does take time, but makes a noticeable difference in the engine starting faster and cleaner. (I looked in to block heaters and dipstick heaters and for my purpose they seemed more than what I need).

I added some product to my deiseal fuel so it won't thicken in cold weather - seems to be working.

Checked my zincs are there's plenty left.

For winterizing the engine. It's actually been fine. I look at the forecast and if any nights are predicted to go below 29F, at the end of the sail I have a buddy help me and with the engine running I close the water intake seacock, open the fresh water strainer, pour pink stuff in until it comes out the back, have my buddy kill the engine. Whole process takes less than 5-minutes. It's been a mild end-of-year here and I've only had to do this twice so far.

All fresh water systems are winterized and crew can only do #1 in the marine head with flush overboard. Pink stuff in the head when the sail is over if freezing is a concern.

Thus far there does seem merit to the idea that the boat in water stays more mild than the air temperature, I have bottles of water on the boat and I check each time I come on the boat after a well-below-freezing night and they've yet to show signs of freezing.

No concerns yet about the harbor water freezing around the boat.

I've yet to decide if I'll cover the boat at some point. I've been talking to some "old dogs" around here and it seems to center on sailboats with lots of brightwork people like to cover, those with less brightwork (like mine) seem to be fine leaving it uncovered. This is the one area I'm not sure of yet. When we do get snow and ice I'll be on top of removing it and clearing the scupper drains. If it looks to be a bitterly cold Jan/Feb I might just shut her down completely and throw a cover on. To be determined!

Important for me is I live in walking distance to the boat, so I check on it often. Also important to me is all the amazing sailing I've had with my favorite people - my crew!!

 

[dLj]

Friends of mine that live on their boat in Boston, put a covering on to keep the boat warmer in the winter. Since you are not living on the boat, might not need it

I've always found winter sailing to have lovely sailing days - dress for it - enjoy!

dj

 

[RitSim]

I looked at winter slip storage but I would need a Spring Quick haul for bottom cleaning/ zinc replacement and any maintenance on keel (cast iron). But the quick haul was $1200. This on top of the winter slip fee was way more expensive than hauling for the winter.

 

[Davidasailor26]

Hi all - OP here. I thought I'd give an update on my wet storage and winter sailing experience in New England thus far - consider this a Part 1 (Nov-Dec) with Part 2 being Jan-March.

I moved my boat from a mooring in Gloucester Harbor to a slip in a protected cove in November. I originally was squeezed into a slip right next to another wet stored sailboat. The concept from the marina was that we could both "hunker down together" which was an awful idea. We had different drafts and the boats moved differently in swell and wind - meaning the other boat was always rocking too much and in the small space left between our hulls I was able to squeeeeze a few fenders in, just barely. I did worry about spreaders touching. It also made coming and going for sails more challenging because I had mere inches on both sides when it came time to reverse back into the slip. When a to-be-winterized powerboat in the next slip finally left I moved over to a slip completely my own. Huge difference being able to come and go, secure the boat on both port and starboard in weather, and secure the boat a bit off the dock in wind so it's sort of floating in the middle of the slip.

Sailing has been amazing! I can only go on weekends due to the sun being set by the time I get off work, but every weekend in Nov and Dec there's been one sunny and windy day and me and my friends have gone out. It's been great to put my reefing points to use, and get the crew trained up on reefing. Winds have been considerably higher than a normal summer here. I changed out my genoa for a jib. It can get cold (last sail was about 25 F as a high) but with everyone bundled up and life jackets on we were good to go.

I left the solar panel on the boat and it has been keeping the batteries nicely topped up. I can attach to shore power if needed to charge the batteries.

I have a Yanmar 3GM30F which are notorious to start in cold weather (search the forums for more info). To alleviate the strain on my starter I've begun to come down to the boat earlier than my crew and with shore power run a marine heater aimed into the engine compartment. It does take time, but makes a noticeable difference in the engine starting faster and cleaner. (I looked in to block heaters and dipstick heaters and for my purpose they seemed more than what I need).

I added some product to my deiseal fuel so it won't thicken in cold weather - seems to be working.

Checked my zincs are there's plenty left.

For winterizing the engine. It's actually been fine. I look at the forecast and if any nights are predicted to go below 29F, at the end of the sail I have a buddy help me and with the engine running I close the water intake seacock, open the fresh water strainer, pour pink stuff in until it comes out the back, have my buddy kill the engine. Whole process takes less than 5-minutes. It's been a mild end-of-year here and I've only had to do this twice so far.

All fresh water systems are winterized and crew can only do #1 in the marine head with flush overboard. Pink stuff in the head when the sail is over if freezing is a concern.

Thus far there does seem merit to the idea that the boat in water stays more mild than the air temperature, I have bottles of water on the boat and I check each time I come on the boat after a well-below-freezing night and they've yet to show signs of freezing.

No concerns yet about the harbor water freezing around the boat.

I've yet to decide if I'll cover the boat at some point. I've been talking to some "old dogs" around here and it seems to center on sailboats with lots of brightwork people like to cover, those with less brightwork (like mine) seem to be fine leaving it uncovered. This is the one area I'm not sure of yet. When we do get snow and ice I'll be on top of removing it and clearing the scupper drains. If it looks to be a bitterly cold Jan/Feb I might just shut her down completely and throw a cover on. To be determined!

Important for me is I live in walking distance to the boat, so I check on it often. Also important to me is all the amazing sailing I've had with my favorite people - my crew!!

That’s great!

Years ago we alternated years between in and out of water storage in New Jersey. Keeping the boat in the water can certainly be done safely, but I agree with Don that taking the boat out is going to be so much work that it won’t happen much. Consider that even if you get a nice patch of weather it’ll probably only be really pleasant for an afternoon sail, which means you’ll still be doing things like uncovering the boat and bending on the headsail while it’s a cold morning. Then you’ll get back from your sail and need to winterize the engine again, cover the boat, and fold the headsail in the cold and dark.

Glad to hear I was wrong on that one!