Mirage 24 - Looking to buy

[Kazimierz]

I am going this Sunday to look at this 1981 Mirage for purchase.
The seller wants $6,500 CAD and what comes with the boat is listed below.
Its my first sailboat purchase and would like some advise.
Is the price ok for what it comes with?
What should I look for?
Thanks

6hp Suzuki outboard,
Roller furler, main, jib, sail covers,
anchor,
New lower shrouds,
forestay,
winch Fixed keel,
4 foot draft,
Newer cushion covers,
porta potty,
new BBQ,
Sleeps 4.
Onboard stereo,
VHF radio,
Depth finder,
Wind speed direction,
Custom dual axle trailer,
2 person tender,
Can be launched and retrieved from a boat launch.

 

[Project_Mayhem]

Look for signs of leaks inside. You'll most often see staining on wood surface if there was a leak. I could be wrong but that looks like it'd be difficult or impossible to launch at most ramps.

 

[rgranger]

I could be wrong but that looks like it'd be difficult or impossible to launch at most ramps.

I'm not sure why you would list a forestay as a "feature" but....

Anyway, when buying an older boat, especially a fiberglass boat, you need to look past the cosmetics of the boat. Fiberglass is forgiving stuff and can be cleaned and made to look nice again. What you are really buying is the outboard motor, the sails and the trailer. Everything else that is wrong with the boat can be fixed for relatively little money. But a new O.B. is $3K, new sails are $3K, and a new trailer is $3K. Does the trailer have breaks? Does the O.B. start within three pulls? Does the O.B. idle smooth and stay running at idle? Are the sails blown out or still in usable shape?

Those are the sort of things I look for in an old boat. Rigging, fiberglass, wood trim etc. can all be fixed up for a few hundred dollars.

 

[shemandr]

I wouldn't fixate on the buying price. You'll spend way more on, for instance a bottom job, replacing chain plates, bulkheads, re-building mast support or fixing spongy decks not to mention the sails and motor. That is a normally equipped boat at roughly the right price. Focus on any deficiencies there might be. I assume it is a deck stepped mast with a tabernacle (Hinge). Look at the mast step area. Spill some water there and make sure it runs away from the mast. No dimple. Is there a compression post? See what it's sitting on. If it's wood is there any sign of softness. Poke it with an awl. Walk around on the deck looking for spongy areas, particularly around deck hardware. The bottom should be smooth without a buildup of paint. The rudder should turn easily but not rock on it's supporting hardware. Go over the rigging. Look for loose strands or rust especially around the lower turnbuckles. Why did the seller not replace all the rigging? Look around the keel especially fore and aft for signs of a hard grounding - cracks in the fiberglass. Is the keel/ joint sealed well or are there gaps. Look at the keel bolts under the cabin sole. Rust? Is there standing water there?
All that said, it looks like a nice boat and Mirage is a well regarded brand.
https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/mirage-24 Read the section under builder and designers.

 

[Kazimierz]

Thanks rgranger.

The concerns you mentioned are very valid. Up here is Edmonton Canada we can’t get boats in the water until middle of May.

Any idea how to get these concerns met moving forward with the interest of buying the boat - like a contract contingent of x, y, z. How can I convince the owner to wait 2 months before putting it in the water.

You gave me an idea to ask for service paper work on the motor and trailer.

I am not sure if the trailer has brakes, which would be a concern to take boat across province to another location.

Why does this boat seem hard to launch?

Thanks

 

[DArcy]

I raced on a Mirage 24 many years ago and also considered buying one before my last boat. They sail very well and were well built. $6,500 is a LOT for this boat however. If the boat comes with a full suit of brand new sails and a new outboard then maybe it would be worth it but that is still a lot. Around here you could find a CS or C&C 27 for that much.
The comments on ramp launching are because of the fixed keel. You just need a ramp deep enough to float off the trailer and will likely need a tongue extender to allow the boat to float without driving your truck right into the water. It looks like close to a foot under the keel while on the trailer so you need 5 ft of water at the end of the ramp. It certainly can be done, just not at all ramps.

 

[rgranger]

The comments on ramp launching are because of the fixed keel. You just need a ramp deep enough to float off the trailer and will likely need a tongue extender to allow the boat to float without driving your truck right into the water. It looks like close to a foot under the keel while on the trailer so you need 5 ft of water at the end of the ramp. It certainly can be done, just not at all ramps.

Yep! What @DArcy said



Regarding the other stuff... quality of sails are best evaluated sailing, but you can visually inspect the trailer for rust and breaks and take it for a test pull to see if it pulls straight without yawing. Electric breaks are about $600 to install yourself and surge is closer to $1000. If you plan to launch in salt water, get surge. You'll end up replacing the electric breaks too often otherwise. Also, if you plan on pulling on a lot of mountainous terain, the surge is a much better way to go. With electric breaks, you have to tap the break peddle to actuate the trailer breaks... very doable once you get the feel for it but surge breaks are automatic and anytime the trailer tries to pass the tow vehicle, the breaks automatically engage... very nice for keeping the trailer BEHIND you when going down a long hill. Regarding the O.B. Put it on a saw horse and submerge the lower unit in a garbage pail full of water and fire it up.

 

[rgranger]

If you plan on keeping it in a slip for the summer, the launch and retrieval thing becomes much less of an issue. You can get a lift to take it off the trailer. Day sailing is nice but can get old fast when you spend an hour on each end of a sail ... It relly discourages those short "afterwork" quick sails. So you may want to look at getting a slip.

 

[Kazimierz]

I raced on a Mirage 24 many years ago and also considered buying one before my last boat. They sail very well and were well built. $6,500 is a LOT for this boat however. If the boat comes with a full suit of brand new sails and a new outboard then maybe it would be worth it but that is still a lot. Around here you could find a CS or C&C 27 for that much.
The comments on ramp launching are because of the fixed keel. You just need a ramp deep enough to float off the trailer and will likely need a tongue extender to allow the boat to float without driving your truck right into the water. It looks like close to a foot under the keel while on the trailer so you need 5 ft of water at the end of the ramp. It certainly can be done, just not at all ramps.

Is 6500 Canadian still expensive? Prices in Edmonton are generally higher than Ontario area because it is very rare a boat is for sale in this area

 

[Kazimierz]

Is a 6 hp Suzuki motor enough to move this 3700 lb boat down a 22 km lake?

 

[Kazimierz]

If you plan on keeping it in a slip for the summer, the launch and retrieval thing becomes much less of an issue. You can get a lift to take it off the trailer. Day sailing is nice but can get old fast when you spend an hour on each end of a sail ... It relly discourages those short "afterwork" quick sails. So you may want to look at getting a slip.

Yes , I plan to.

I was also thinking of taking it to BC for a month each year

 

[DArcy]

A mirage 24 in good condition in Ontario will be around $3,000. I've never looked at the boat marked in Alberta so you may well need to pay a premium because of location. They were made in Ontario and there are still quite a few of them around here. If they are well maintained they last a long time.

6 HP is plenty, I'd say 4 HP would be sufficient for a Mirage 24.

 

[Drinky Crow]

What was fixed re: keel. How was it fixed. Who did the work. Receipts?

4 HP would be sufficient for a Mirage 24.

On flat water but against any amount of current or headwind? Had 6hp on a SJ24 and wouldn't have wanted any less.

 

[Drinky Crow]

Is a 6 hp Suzuki motor enough to move this 3700 lb boat down a 22 km lake?

It'll be fine.

 

[Kazimierz]

What was fixed re: keel. How was it fixed. Who did the work. Receipts?

On flat water but against any amount of current or headwind? Had 6hp on a SJ24 and wouldn't have wanted any less.

How heavy is a SJ24

 

[Davidasailor26]

What was fixed re: keel. How was it fixed. Who did the work. Receipts?

I assumed that meant it’s a fixed keel, not a centerboard or swing keel.

 

[shemandr]

How heavy is a SJ24

3,200 lbs./1451 Kgs. according to Sailboatdata.com

 

[rgranger]

I have a Tohatsu 6 on my H26 and I'm at hull speed at 3/4 WOT

 

[Kazimierz]

I assumed that meant it’s a fixed keel, not a centerboard or swing keel.

He should have put Fin Keel instead of fixed keel

 

[Kazimierz]

I wouldn't fixate on the buying price. You'll spend way more on, for instance a bottom job, replacing chain plates, bulkheads, re-building mast support or fixing spongy decks not to mention the sails and motor. That is a normally equipped boat at roughly the right price. Focus on any deficiencies there might be. I assume it is a deck stepped mast with a tabernacle (Hinge). Look at the mast step area. Spill some water there and make sure it runs away from the mast. No dimple. Is there a compression post? See what it's sitting on. If it's wood is there any sign of softness. Poke it with an awl. Walk around on the deck looking for spongy areas, particularly around deck hardware. The bottom should be smooth without a buildup of paint. The rudder should turn easily but not rock on it's supporting hardware. Go over the rigging. Look for loose strands or rust especially around the lower turnbuckles. Why did the seller not replace all the rigging? Look around the keel especially fore and aft for signs of a hard grounding - cracks in the fiberglass. Is the keel/ joint sealed well or are there gaps. Look at the keel bolts under the cabin sole. Rust? Is there standing water there?
All that said, it looks like a nice boat and Mirage is a well regarded brand.
https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/mirage-24 Read the section under builder and designers.

Thanks rgranger.

The concerns you mentioned are very valid. Up here is Edmonton Canada we can’t get boats in the water until middle of May.

Any idea how to get these concerns met moving forward with the interest of buying the boat - like a contract contingent of x, y, z. How can I convince the owner to wait 2 months before putting it in the water.

You gave me an idea to ask for service paper work on the motor and trailer.

I am not sure if the trailer has brakes, which would be a concern to take boat across province to another location.

Why does this boat seem hard to launch?