do you sail in the fog?

DArcy

.
Feb 11, 2017
1,731
Islander Freeport 36 Ottawa
We don't get a lot of fog around here. A couple of years ago on a crossing of Lake Ontario in a race, the fog rolled in. The wind was light, under 5 knots, but we were racing so kept on sailing. I really couldn't tell how thick the fog was since it was the middle of the night. I couldn't believe how disorienting it was not being able to see any point of reference at all. Without instruments I would have been sailing in circles; I pretty much stared at the compass the entire time I was at the wheel with glances at the wind instruments and chart plotter/AIS from time to time. It was surreal. I heard one ship thrumming in the distance but the AIS assured me our course was no where near them.
The boat had this blow horn on board which was an interesting design. You blow into this tube in the middle which redirects the air 90° to each side and makes an incredibly load noise. Unfortunately, the noise comes out a few inches from your ears and is deafening. Not something I would want to use too often without hearing protection.
 
Jan 1, 2006
7,340
Slickcraft 26 Sailfish
You're supposed to be scared. It's dangerous. I've been out in virtually no visibility with Radar and GPS (In fact with an overlay). But when you hear the throbbing of large engines approaching and the Radar isn't giving a clear signal, or too many signals it's terrifying. I didn't have AIS.
BTW, there was a pic posted on another thread that showed a fog event in the PNW. But you could see almost a mile. That's not fog. In New England when it socks in you can see the bow of your boat and wave or two ahead. Less than 100'. I anchored in Stonington CT. once only to find out I was less than 50' from the jetty. I could go on like any other New England sailor.
I've posted before that due to a client of mine who drove ferries professionally, I would not leave port in fog. His opinion was that his job was made so much more dangerous because of recreational boaters who, in his opinion, shouldn't be out in those conditions. He blamed GPS and Radar for giving the recreational boaters the confidence to operate in fog. He was talking primarily about fishing boats in and around Plum Gut. Nevertheless, maybe in fog the kiddies should be off the street.
 
  • Like
Likes: Kings Gambit

Dr. D

.
Nov 3, 2018
278
Beneteau Oceanis 35.1 Herrington Harbour North
The Chesapeake Bay can get some fog, too. This shows when it was breaking up.
fog.jpeg
 
  • Like
Likes: tfox2069

jssailem

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Oct 22, 2014
22,002
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
Those pictures are great. Fog does detract from the usual view.
 
Nov 21, 2012
664
Yamaha 33 Port Ludlow, WA
My boating career started on the Great Salt Lake in the late 70's-early 80's. They were drilling for oil and I captained a few different vessels out there, from a 42' crewboat to a 240' motor barge. The fog in the winter was thick. Salt Lake City is known for their winter inversions, and we had 53 straight days of pea soup fog one winter.

The lake is shallow (45' max depth) and the channel to shore base was about 3 miles long and around 75 feet wide. The bow of the motor barge frequently couldn't be seen from the wheelhouse in the fog. Depth outside the channel was less than 3' and we drew 8 or 10 fully loaded. The channel was marked with those small round inflatable fenders, which were just big enough to give a radar return. I got good at radar navigation in close quarters.

Fog doesn't bother me on the sailboat. I'm also an instrument rated pilot and I do my homework on navigation so that I can trust my pilotage, charts and nav gear. That said, I have great respect for the risks in zero visibility. Slow down. Shut the motor off if at all possible. I use the fog signal on my VHF when conditions warrant, and sailing lets you use your ears more effectively than on a motor vessel.
 
Dec 19, 2006
5,813
Hunter 36 Punta Gorda
Got caught in fog LI sound and wife scared as hell but told her look our radar was showing where
the very large car and truck ferry was and showed how I made sure we stayed away from the ferry
but the ferry’s fog horn was scaring her so don’t plan to leave port when fog sets in.
Nick
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,689
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
If you don't sail in the fog in Maine you're not going to do much sailing...;) Having been a commercial lobsterman fog is like any other day to me, except for the new breed "digital captains" who know nothing about fog and never boated or worked in it before Loran, radar, plotters etc.....

I know I have posted the below post before but I will put it here again:


Ok this is going to be a little bit of a frustration rant but mostly at folks who probably do not participate in these forums anyway.. I'm sure you guys don't behave like this..

I just returned from a rather foggy cruise and the growth of the GPS plotter is causing some rather inflated man jewels, (brass balls), on the water. No, make that big reckless man-jewels.

As one who grew up navigating in the fog, before the advent of GPS plotters, Loran & radar and also one who spent thousands of hours working the foggy waters of the North East as a commercial lobsterman & while fishing for Blue Fin Tuna, I am alarmed at the new quality of boaters who are willing to venture out in this stuff, totally ill prepared, being guided by nothing more than blind faith and a GPS screen.

Thick fog deserves RESPECT and you must use some common sense when out in the soup.

Here's a list of some things I witnessed, not just once, but many times over just one week, in visibilities from 70 feet to about 400 feet.

Boat #1 - Sailboat from MA in 100 feet of visibility = No running lights, no radar reflector, no radar, no fog signals/horn, boat not a good radar target & barely showing up about every third sweep, not monitoring VHF 16 or any of the standard channels.

Boat #2 - Sea Ray from South Portland doing 30+ knots in 150 feet of vis. Picked up at 1 mile out as a random sea clutter type of return, tracked it, and realized it was a vessel moving at a high rate of speed directly towards me. Made hard turn to stbd and Sea Ray passed seconds later within 70 feet. Did not slow down, did not respond to VHF 09, 13, 16 or 72 hails. No fog horn, no radar, no running lights no radar reflector boat showed up like sea clutter at best. If my radar screen was anywhere other than the helm he might have run us down.

Boat #3 - Center console from the mid coast doing close to 30 knots and heading straight for a nun. This is what all the "inexperienced in fog boaters" do in fog. Do yourself a favor and STAY AWAY FROM MARKS IN THE FOG! Set your course well proud of any widely used nav aids. All the "new bravado" guys with plotters & no radar head straight for them. "Hey baby, see how cool this GPS thingy is, we almost hit that can!":

I could go on and on and on from just a short trip. Please don't get me wrong we did meet plenty experienced skippers of boats who were using proper fog etiquette, communications, lights & signals but there seem to me more and more people who have NO CLUE how dangerous they really are to themselves and others.

If your one and only tool for navigation in the fog is a plotter, please, please, please STAY PUT! You don't absolutely need radar, though more so today than in the 70's or 80's because inexperienced people did not go out in the fog as they do today, but you DO need some other items to communicate and let others know of your presence.

If you can afford a boat, and to risk your life and the life of others, in 100 foot visibility, you can certainly afford a VHF, a fog horn/signal, running lights and a radar reflector. Are these items too much to ask for? Apparently they are for far too many boat owners these days..D'oh....

Things to do when in fog to be a good boater and to be courteous to others.

Radar Reflector
= BUY ONE AND USE IT!!!! Just because you choose not to have radar does not mean you should choose to be invisible or nearly invisible to the rest of the world who may be practicing good collision avoidance. Even the supposed "worst performing" radar reflectors work better than none at all. I almost always run my radar in clear weather, not just in fog, so I do see the differences.

Radar = If you have radar it should not just be reserved not just for foggy days. Please get in the habit of running your radar on clear days and tuning it for what you can see around you. Most owners are shocked when they run their radar in clear weather and realize how poorly they have it tuned. If you can't see the targets on a clear day you can't see them in the fog.

VHF = Use it, and by that I mean turn the darn thing on and monitor VHF 16. PLEASE! Others don't have your cell number on speed dial. Beyond that it is also Federal law that you monitor VHF 16 if your boat has a VHF.

Running Lights = When the visibility drops use them! They do help and can add another 50-100 feet of warning.

Fog Signals = For Christ sake Wal*Mart sells sports air horns for $6.00. Please get one and use it properly. Many VHF's also have built in fog hailers and the FogMate is inexpensive.

Slow Down = A single sailboat traveling at 6 knots is covering 10.1 feet per second. In 100 feet of visibility the collision time to a fixed object is roughly 11 seconds from your first physical sighting. Now take two sailboats converging, each traveling at 6 knots, your collision time in 100 feet of visibility, from your first physical sighting, becomes just 5 seconds.

A power boat traveling 30 knots, on a collision course, will collide with a sailboat doing six knots, at 100 feet of visibility, in under two seconds from the first sighting! You will NOT have enough reaction time to avoid a collision with a clown like this other than to have radar and been tracking him. Think people don't go fast in the fog? Think again..

Some photo examples of what these reckless boaters look like:

There really is a boat here a few hundred feet off my stern. No radar, no reflector, no running lights, no horn signals and not even a VHF response. "Dumb dee dumb, sailing awayyyy, dumb dee dumb, doh', a boat, how'd that get there?":confused::confused::eek:

Here's a radar shot of that boat when it was actually showing up. It's the red spec just above the 18 foot spot off my stbd stern quarter. The two targets ahead and to port and stbd were two J Boats traveling together both of which had reflectors when they went by. SOME BOATS JUST DO NOT SHOW UP ON RADAR!!! The guy behind me owns one!


1st class clown (see speed above), no radar, no lights, no horn signals, no reflector and also not showing up well, and not monitoring VHF!


For reference this is 400 feet of visibility from yesterday morning (400 feet is generally fairly good vis for Maine fog):


And here's the screen shot with the cursor just over the closest radar image at 411 feet (upper left corner measures distance).:




It scares me how many people are just plain dangerous and have no clue they are being so reckless. If they succeed once they do it again only this time with a greater level of bravado and confidence..

Rant off...
 
Jun 14, 2010
2,190
Robertson & Caine 2017 Leopard 40 CT
If you don't sail in the fog in Maine you're not going to do much sailing...;) Having been a commercial lobsterman fog is like any other day to me, except for the new breed "digital captains" who know nothing about fog and never boated or worked in it before Loran, radar, plotters etc.....
I boated in it before radar, CP, etc. and now I‘m happy to be a “digital captain”. I’ll take all the help I can get.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,689
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
I boated in it before radar, CP, etc. and now I‘m happy to be a “digital captain”. I’ll take all the help I can get.
That was not my point. The point is that most of these people doing 30 knots in pea soup, no VHF etc. etc. never, ever boated in the fog before the world of digital. I love my digital toys but my first line when in the fog is not a 100% self reliance on the plotter.
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,325
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
If you find you travel in fog a lot, I wonder if it would be wise to invest in an orange flashing or spinning beacon. Not sure what the legality is for using them on the water, but when the issue is safety, I'll take a fine over a crash any day.
One of the problems I have found with navigation lights is the surface area is too small to be very visable. This is especially true with LEDs. I've seen boats at night where the navigation lights were so small, you could not see them until you were right up on the boat.
 
May 25, 2012
4,338
john alden caravelle 42 sturgeon bay, wis
radar reflector up. running lights on. sail over power. blow horn. ring bell. autopilot off, hand steer. lookout posted. radar observer posted. ........
i've run many, many many miles in fog, which we always logged as 'light haze'. i always prefer a crew when sailing. the above are too many hats to wear when short handed i think. i have good skills. i'm well trained. still scared. why, it's the other guy. seen way to many times. near misses from others of low skill.
they are out there and they scare me big time :yikes:
 

jssailem

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Oct 22, 2014
22,002
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
Not a RANT>.. An excellent discussion of the issues around FOG @Maine Sail :clap:
 

TomY

Alden Forum Moderator
Jun 22, 2004
2,767
Alden 38' Challenger yawl Rockport Harbor
I've spent time looking online for collisions, especially on our coast. I couldn't find much. As I recall, the only incident I found on record was two fishing boats running into each other far offshore, several years ago. I'd guess they both had radar.

The thing that gets boats around here are the rocks, usually in broad daylight.

Beware the rocks on the coast of Maine.

Archangel wreck Goose Rocks 2013.jpg
 

jssailem

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Oct 22, 2014
22,002
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
Sounds like a good warning.

Kind of like “Beware the Ides of March”.
 
  • Like
Likes: jon hansen

DArcy

.
Feb 11, 2017
1,731
Islander Freeport 36 Ottawa
@walt great story, thanks for posting. There are lessons in there for all of us.