Hi all, I'm thinking of moving up from my Catalina 320 (a great boat) to something bigger for more comfortable cruising and am eyeing at this point both a Hunter 38 and a Catalina 387 (as well as the older Catalina 380). The owner reviews on this site have been very helpful, but I'm wondering if any of you has also compared these boats and has any thoughts on why you made one choice or the other.
Hunter 38 vs Catalina 387
- Thread starter mlynch66
- Start date
I will give this a shot. To me the main difference between the two makers is Hunter takes a bit more risk in it's designs than Catalina does. Hunter tries new things out, where as Catalina is more traditional follow the market type of builder. Catalina is stronger but Hunter is strong enough.
The main difference is the rig. Hunter is a fractional rig with large main and small headsail and Catalina is masthead rig with large headsail. The fractional rig is considered easier to handle and Hunter does a great job of making it good for single handlers and it is better going upwind, but Catalina is better downwind, especially due to the 30 degree swept back spreaders on the Hunter limiting the boom angles.
Hunter is my favorite boat maker because I love how they do their keels and there is nothing more important than the keel. I've had my H376 for 13 years and currently sailing her around the world. Been out cruising for 6 years in March.
The main difference is the rig. Hunter is a fractional rig with large main and small headsail and Catalina is masthead rig with large headsail. The fractional rig is considered easier to handle and Hunter does a great job of making it good for single handlers and it is better going upwind, but Catalina is better downwind, especially due to the 30 degree swept back spreaders on the Hunter limiting the boom angles.
Hunter is my favorite boat maker because I love how they do their keels and there is nothing more important than the keel. I've had my H376 for 13 years and currently sailing her around the world. Been out cruising for 6 years in March.
Quality wise they are probably about the same. You need to get in them and try them out for size, compare features, equipment and prices. If you know what you are looking for in a boat, where you are going to sail, etc. that should help in deciding on the boat. How many people do you need to sleep? If you are going to be in more extreme conditions, then engine size might matter. If you are going to do some longer distance cruising, then fuel and water capacity are important. How do the galleys compare? How do the cockpits compare? As stated before, the masthead foresail is more difficult to handle, while a fractional rig headsail is easier to tack. Does the mainsail furl inside the mast? If you are sailing short handed, these sort of things make a big difference. Then how are each of the boats equipped as far as electronics are concerned? If you are sailing in warm waters, air conditioning might be important. If you are sailing in the north or Great Lakes, a cabin heater might be more important. Many manufactures install the hoses and wiring for these items, but if they aren't included in the option list when first purchased, you then will only have to buy the unit itself and have it installed and not worry about the hoses that distribute the AC or heat. Then, of course the boat's condition, engine hours, and how she's cared for might help you make your decision. What about exterior canvas? Bimini, dodger or complete enclosed cockpit canvas over none or little might be important to you. Hope this helps.
Having represented Beneteau, Catalina and Hunter as a former dealer, I always told my customer what pleases you the most, you will keep that boat much longer. In addition to that secondly are the amenities that helped in that equation. @Barnacle Bill was right on in the perspective of questions and trying to go out on each one. Thank you Barnacle Bill for your good advice.
Hunter was the leader in innovations which one manufacture said to me, name withholding, was a bunch of bull BLANK. Mighty funny his boats had that innovation the following year and mighty funny I know every one in the industry who use to ask for my advice. Regardless, both Catalina and Hunter are good companies and that is the way it should be. Now if we could get Congress to work for America.
Hunter was the leader in innovations which one manufacture said to me, name withholding, was a bunch of bull BLANK. Mighty funny his boats had that innovation the following year and mighty funny I know every one in the industry who use to ask for my advice. Regardless, both Catalina and Hunter are good companies and that is the way it should be. Now if we could get Congress to work for America.
That's two.
I do not understand these comments.
On a mast head rig, the jib is "the driver," no issue there.
But ease of sailing? Better going upwind? Easier to tack?
C'mon, ya gotta be kidding.
I have been sailing my masthead rigged Catalinas, sometimes on just the jib, upwind and down, for the past 35 years.
Don't know what could be easier: ONE sail.
Honest question: do people with B&R rigs do that? Can you?
I also, aha
, sail with both sails, too. And having a comparatively "smaller" main sail could be it makes it easier to raise, but that's trifling.Comparatively, unless the masthead rig has a huge oversized genoa in light air, there is no difference between rigs in handling the sails when tacking. (And if the wind is light usually genoas are too heavy in cloth weight. THAT is a whole 'nother discussion though, having nothing to do with rigs, but rather foresail size and cloth weight.)
These comments are not about differences in builders, but misconceptions, repeated altogether too often, about handling between the two types of rigs that simply do not exist. When you tack boats of these sizes you switch jib sheets. I don't see much difference.
But saying one's harder because of the type of rig is IMHO misleading and incorrect.
Actually a fractional non-overlapping rig like Hunter uses IS easier to tack. No question about it.That's two.
I do not understand these comments.
On a mast head rig, the jib is "the driver," no issue there.
But ease of sailing? Better going upwind? Easier to tack?
C'mon, ya gotta be kidding.
I have been sailing my masthead rigged Catalinas, sometimes on just the jib, upwind and down, for the past 35 years.
Don't know what could be easier: ONE sail.
Honest question: do people with B&R rigs do that? Can you?
I also, aha
Comparatively, unless the masthead rig has a huge oversized genoa in light air, there is no difference between rigs in handling the sails when tacking. (And if the wind is light usually genoas are too heavy in cloth weight. THAT is a whole 'nother discussion though, having nothing to do with rigs, but rather foresail size and cloth weight.)
These comments are not about differences in builders, but misconceptions, repeated altogether too often, about handling between the two types of rigs that simply do not exist. When you tack boats of these sizes you switch jib sheets. I don't see much difference.
But saying one's harder because of the type of rig is IMHO misleading and incorrect.
The clew of the jib only moves about 4 feet, compared to 12+ of a masthead genoa. Often this can be done so fast and quick that a winch is not needed. The sail is over and clear well before the tack is completed. On a masthead boat the clew has to be pulled around all the rigging, and winched into place. The jib will also flog less during the operation, and is not damaged by repeated contact with the rig and stanchions.
And that's NOT what I said.
Any genoa is larger and will take more time. No disagreement there.
My 85 and 110 jibs take no more time than a comparable jib on a Hunter.
That's why I discounted genoas.
My jibs are raised above the pulpit - no rubbing involved. And neither gets anywhere near the spreaders.
Let's NOT compare apples and oranges.
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For a completely separate discussion about jib size choices:
A very illuminating and interesting discussion on co.com for those of you who might be in the market for a new jib.
http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=155362
Please read all three pages. Enjoy.
I chose the use smaller jibs. Even after moving to Vancouver Island I haven't changed my headsails. I admit I do not race anymore, and while I raced on SF Bay for a decade I did just fine with my 110.
But that's a separate discussion.
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As a former Catalina 30 owner I was naturally biased already. The simple answer is what Barnacle Bill stated: You need to decide what is important and what your needs / desires are. My wife and I decided on an older Catalina 380 (hull #8) since the price was right. We enjoyed how it handled and she LOVES the aft cabin stateroom. It's easy enough for us to handle, the autopilot makes single handed sailing relatively easy and since it was older with only a few hundred engine hours we could budget (based on the low purchase price) all the upgrades and electronics that were new without the price of a new boat. These boats simply don't really wear out. Write down how you plan on using the boat and what you want/need to have. Then start looking. Good luck and don't forget to check in here. There are so many talented and experienced people that frequent this forum.
The vast majority of masthead boats fly genoas. This is done (as you know) because the relative smallness of the mainsail area vs a fractional boat. You might be an exception with your jib, but the generalization is valid.
Its not a comment about builders. But most Catalinas are masthead, most Hunters are fractional.
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Even fractional boats fly overlapping headsails though. On my masthead Beneteau 361 with a 140 RF genoa, it's the same (when scaled down) as tacking on my friend's fractional Ranger 2-26 with a RF 150 genoa. We still sometimes have to walk the Ranger's 150 around the mast, and it still sometimes gets hung up when we tack if we DON'T help it around.
Look at your 320.
The fantastically stout rig.
The race-worthy speed and pointing.
The great layout. Wide decks. Nice lines. Quality construction.
Catalinas resell well. This is my perception, not stated fact.
As a buyer on multiple occasions, I've seen Catalinas move, while others linger. Even on my dock, a Catalina 30 late version went on the market, had numerous lookers first 2 weeks, sold in 3. This was through a broker so I'm sure the price was not a major factor for the buyer.
I've always liked the 380. Huge aft stateroom while still being an aft cockpit with appropriate lines.
RE tacking: Anybody can tack a masthead rig. That a fractional rig might be slightly easier should not weigh in the decision. Edit: unless you're racing competitively, and consider this an advantage.
The fantastically stout rig.
The race-worthy speed and pointing.
The great layout. Wide decks. Nice lines. Quality construction.
Catalinas resell well. This is my perception, not stated fact.
As a buyer on multiple occasions, I've seen Catalinas move, while others linger. Even on my dock, a Catalina 30 late version went on the market, had numerous lookers first 2 weeks, sold in 3. This was through a broker so I'm sure the price was not a major factor for the buyer.
I've always liked the 380. Huge aft stateroom while still being an aft cockpit with appropriate lines.
RE tacking: Anybody can tack a masthead rig. That a fractional rig might be slightly easier should not weigh in the decision. Edit: unless you're racing competitively, and consider this an advantage.
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You're right, the older ones do. But they are generally smaller than a similar masthead boat would have. New designs (Like the Hunter 38) typically do not use genoas.
Did not know that, Jack. From the viewpoint of a learning racer, I would think a larger headsail, no matter what rig type, could be a big benefit, particularly going downwind. Of course, it just occurred to me, you race spin fleet. I only race JAM. don't mean to hijack the thread.
From the viewpoint of a learning racer, I would think a larger headsail, no matter what rig type, could be a big benefit, particularly going downwind. Of course, it just occurred to me, you race spin fleet. I only race JAM. don't mean to hijack the thread.
For sure downwind JAM a big headsail will help. I'd never ever race my non-overlapping boat without a spinnaker, it would be too painful. The jib would just bounce around, unable to fill behind the huge main.Did not know that, Jack.
It is all up to the buyer as to what he likes. Representing Beneteau, Catalina and Hunter I heard all but all good points. With that can we close out this thread gentlemen