Relay needed

capta

.
Jun 4, 2009
5,072
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
I've been searching online for a relay to add to my alternator charging circuit, but have been unable to sort through the myriad of choices available and find the best one for that application. I will be putting it in the B+ line with the key activating it.
It is a 12 volt, 105 amp alternator. I'm running #6 cable. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
 
Feb 26, 2004
23,336
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
I will be putting it in the B+ line with the key activating it.
It is a 12 volt, 105 amp alternator. I'm running #6 cable.
In order to even begin to answer, it would be helpful to understand what you are trying to do with this relay.

If I understand correctly, you are using the key switch to activate the relay which would either connect or disconnect (i.e., interrupt) the B+. This appears to indicate that there would be the possibility of interrupting the AO (alternator output) when the alternator is operating. This is not a good thing.

The only thing that comes to mind as to why you may be doing this is to de-energize the AO circuit from the house bank to the alternator when the engine is off, automatically.

If that guess is correct, you would be much better off by placing a manual switch in that wire, as Maine Sail and I have been suggesting for many years. Trying to "automate" that function makes little sense, since a shutoff is only needed when you're working on the engine anyway. It is so rarely used on my boat that I simply remove the fuse, while I have a switch I never installed it! :)

You would also have to consider whether it would be a NO or NC relay, and it would most likely need to be continuous duty. NO if power failed to it means like the key switch off. But then, if a wire to it failed, it would open and interrupt your AO. Not so good. NC would alleviate the AO issue, but not work for my guessed intention.

If my guess as to why you want to do this is right, I think it's a bad idea.

Also, a #6 wire for a 105 alternator sounds awfully small.
 
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capta

.
Jun 4, 2009
5,072
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
Thanks, Stu.
You are absolutely right in assuming I wanted an automatic shut off on the B+ line. It is a self exciting alternator that is attached directly to the house bank, with a Blue Seas circuit breaker at the battery. Probably because it has a bad diode, it leaks back into the house bank @ around 5 amps when the engine isn't running. However, it charges quite well (50+ amps so far) and down here getting it repaired isn't a possibility, and getting the parts down takes some time.
We've been manually stopping this by opening the breaker and I was considering a relay to do this automatically w/the key. My thought was that should we forget to reset the breaker if we needed the engine in an emergency, the relay would save the alt. However, being a self exciting alternator, would an open B+ line actually cause the alternator harm, if there was no excitation at start up because the breaker was open?
Anyway, as it may be a problem either way, we can certainly go on as is until I can rebuild the alt, and save myself the trouble of finding, shipping and installing a relay. #6 is larger than recommended by my chart (6' run).
Thanks again.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,759
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
If you shut off B+ when that alt is running, or if that relay were to fail, it is bye bye alternator diodes. The best option is to tap into the field wire circuit and interrupt that... A safer "Band-Aid" would be to insert a diode isolator on the alt B+ no you'll have no back feed but also a 0.6V to 1V drop depending upon output current and it will impact charging performance.

You'd be amazed at how many emails I am getting these days from guys attempting to Mickey Mouse LiFePO4 installations and their BMS relay has opened alt B+ and destroyed their alternators...
 
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Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
If the max is around 50 amps you might be able to find a car one like this...

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/dak-rly3/overview/

.... down there. Not marine but listed for 70 amps and might be easier to find until you could go with something else. Some of the car ones that I've used are only rated 20-30 amps.

As Stu suggested you will have to check to see if it is continuous duty or not,

Sumner
========================================================
1300 miles to The Bahamas and Back in the Mac...
Endeavour 37 Mods...

MacGregor 26-S Mods...http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/endeavour-main/endeavour-index.html
Mac Trips to Utah, Idaho, Wyoming, Canada, Florida, Bahamas
 
Jun 6, 2006
6,990
currently boatless wishing Harrington Harbor North, MD
Take the alternator apart, dissemble the diode pack, find the bad one and replace it. $5.00
reassemble the alternator and if you still feel the need install an ON-OFF manual switch between the engine and the battery banks. I find that it is a great security enhancement if the ON-OFF switch is in the engine compartment and not assessable from outside the cabin.
Note: reassembling the alternator is easier if you note that the brush holders have a small hole that a paper clip can be inserter through to hold the brushes in during assembly. The hole should be assessable from the outside of the alternator case BTW
good luck
 

capta

.
Jun 4, 2009
5,072
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
Take the alternator apart, dissemble the diode pack, find the bad one and replace it. $5.00
reassemble the alternator and if you still feel the need install an ON-OFF manual switch between the engine and the battery banks. I find that it is a great security enhancement if the ON-OFF switch is in the engine compartment and not assessable from outside the cabin.
Note: reassembling the alternator is easier if you note that the brush holders have a small hole that a paper clip can be inserter through to hold the brushes in during assembly. The hole should be assessable from the outside of the alternator case BTW
good luck
Note to self, hop in the car (we don't own) tomorrow and run down the street to purchase the necessary diode. Wait a minute, self says to I, you are in the West Indies. How about you order it online and have it sent to someone in the USA. Then they can ship it down to you when they have a moment. By Fedex it was about us$50.00 to send in our absentee ballots, so a little diode could be about the same. Then it's got to clear customs, with the appropriate fees, which include taxing the freight (us$50.00 or so in this case) plus the item and a broker's fee ranging from ec$150.00 to ec$300.00. Of course, self reminds me, this IS the West Indies, so overnight at these exorbitant rates really means a week, plus a few days. That means I'll be without an alternator for at least a week and with the generator down, that is a wee bit of a problem.
But hey Bill, thanks for the great advice!
 

capta

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Jun 4, 2009
5,072
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
I'm just going to stick with what we are doing for now, as Stu suggested. Thanks all.