Starter Switch problem?

[armandolio]

Starting my 1989 C30 can be inconsistent. Sometimes I warm the glow plug for 45 seconds and it starts, other times I have warmed it repeatedly for a total of 2 minutes + to get going, in Florida climate.

This weekend after 45 minutes of trying different things, I ended up having to be towed-in because it would not start. As soon as I entered the slip......it started. Three days later, I visited the boat, no luck. 10 minutes later it started repeatedly.

I opened the instrument panel and everything looked normal, except the small black component wired to the starter button which was just dangling. Thinking of replacing the started button, perhaps its too old. What about the dangling piece, what is that?







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[JohnVTX]

Sounds like an issue with your glow plugs. I only hold mine 10 seconds in summer and 15 seconds in winter.

 

[Jongleur]

17.5 seconds for mine.
I give it high throttle.

 

[Skipper]

12 seconds. Universal diesel same era.
Holding them too long will burn them out.
Although it might not be the glow plugs. In warm weather the engine can start without them, even though your panel probably requires holding the glow button.
Where do you set the throttle for starting? Any smoke?

 

[Captn Scotty]

You might be getting intermittent connection. Those terminals on the back of your panel look mostly green and black. Cleaning up all the contacts and then coating them with dielectric grease would be my first step. And what looks like the hanging bit with the small plastic box on the end looks like an alarm module?

 

[jssailem]

Looks like the Spaghetti wiring on my panel. Suggest you look for a ground wire not connected or partially connected. Replace the connectors with proper sized ring terminals and follow Capt Scotty's suggestion about dielectric grease. Perhaps it is time to rewire the boat.

 

[AXEL]

I will also ask where do you set the throttle? I have owned 2 diesel engines, Westerbeke and Universal and both likes to be started at full throttle.

 

[Donnybrook]

Does the engine turn over when you push the starter button?

 

[JohnVTX]

Mine starts great at idle, and so should any motor. I don't have any motor anywhere that I start at full throttle.

 

[Capt jgw]

Well, not full throttle, but the manuals for some engines including Universal say to give it some throttle, maybe 1/4. Mine starts quicker that way. I have a single lever control and have to pull a button out to give it throttle in neutral so I usually don't bother.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

Do you have the "relay" fix in there for your glow plugs?? Have you replaced the trailer plug for terminal strips -- both of these dramatically help with the cold start (and help prevent your boat from burning up).

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/universal_wiring_harness_upgrade
http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/2411_386/engine-wiring-harness-upgrade-kit.cfm

 

[Jim 5757]

One important question... does the engine crank OK and no start or not cranking at all? Very different scenarios depending on this information.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Intermittent anything means a loose wire connection.

You might be interested in this:

Engines 101 - The BIGGEST & BEST collection of M25 Series Universal Engine Information on the Internet, plus some M35, too

http://www.c34.org/wiki/index.php?title=Diesel_Engine

 

[armandolio]

Friends,
I have not done any of the fixes mentioned above. I don't think the setting of the throttle is the issue since I am referring to what happens before the engine starts turning. If I activated my glow plug for 15 seconds and then pushed the start button, nothing will happen. This where the issue lies. Usually it is north of 45 seconds, and most recently as I mentioned in the original posting, it didn't matter how long I held it, the engine did not turn.

If what Skipper said above that in warm weather the engine should start without the glow plug is true, then clearly the issue is electric. Does anyone think it's the switch itself, or should I start by simply cleaning and lubricating he connectors as suggested by Captn Scotty?

 

[jssailem]

Simplest path is to start with Scotty's suggested cleaning. Second is to check all wire connections as you clean. Third examine starter ground and starter relay connections.
Stu is spot on. "Intermittent anything means a loose wire connection."
And of course the starter switch may be bad.
I always favor "Ockham's razor" (Among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected.)

 

[armandolio]

Thank you all. I think I have enough to go on for now. Stay tuned.

 

[Skipper]

Friends,
I have not done any of the fixes mentioned above. I don't think the setting of the throttle is the issue since I am referring to what happens before the engine starts turning. If I activated my glow plug for 15 seconds and then pushed the start button, nothing will happen.

Ooooohh I get it. Sorry I thought it was turning over but not starting.
Ok this is a common issue with your motor. Check the inline fuse holders for corrosion. Also check the wiring harness connectors between the engine and control panel. They look like the attached picture. Except hopefully not melted.
One question: if you jog the starter button, is there a clicking noise? Try rapidly jogging the starter button with the glow button held, and see if the starter catches.
There's no need to hold the glow button longer. There's no timer or anything that would help the engine start. The only connection is that it's electrically required that you hold the glow button in order for the start button to work. Probably.

 

[Stu Jackson]

and then pushed the start button, nothing will happen. This where the issue lies. Usually it is north of 45 seconds, and most recently as I mentioned in the original posting, it didn't matter how long I held it, the engine did not turn.

You really need to stop, take a deep breath and read the links I sent to you.

This one in particular:

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5078.msg32211.html#msg32211

99% of the time it is NOT the switch, it's the bloody stupid fuse & holder hidden under the alternator.

Good luck, but please, read a lot more.

 

[kimelmore]

First of all, none of the wiring on the back of that panel looks satisfactory to me. The connectors are all obviously non marine grade and look like something one gets at the discount auto store. Marine connectors with shrink wrap and coated in a dielectric is something sorely needed. I would also suspect based on the portions I can see that the wire is corroded as well. Good Luck with your project. Make sure you use a professional grade ratcheting wire crimper tool. The ones you buy at Harbor Freight don't do a complete job and will leave you with unsatisfactory crimps. I know the marine grade connectors are more expensive but it is a true case of "pay me now or pay me later". I will add that I would agree with those that are suggesting that it might be a bad ground wire. FYI, you can find the wiring diagrams for the panel online in various places. I would suggest an internet search. Again, Good Luck. Don't be afraid to ask for help here. Lots of good folks here. I might add, watch out for the Frog.

 

[armandolio]

One question: if you jog the starter button, is there a clicking noise? Try rapidly jogging the starter button with the glow button held, and see if the starter catches.

Skipper - when I'm pressing the starter button nothing happens, no clicking, nothing.