Lubricating Manual Head

BayMan

.
Sep 12, 2012
203
Hunter 450 Unspecified
Peggy's book says I should lubricate the head valve with either silicone or Teflon grease. All I can find at my local stores is the spray silicone lubrication but I do not believe that is what I need. Am I correct that I should be using the stuff in a jar or tube rather than the stuff in a spray can?
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
Am I correct that I should be using the stuff in a jar or tube rather than the stuff in a spray can?
You're correct, but the thick teflon grease you want comes in a tube, not a jar. You want SuperLube...Ace Hardware carries it.

And you need to grease the whole toilet PUMP, not just a valve. If your toilet is a Jabsco, take the top off the pump...if your toilet is a Raritan PHII or PHC, remove the pump from the base (just remove the four screws)...stick the nozzle on the tube into the pump and give it a healthy squeeze...about a tablespoon. Replace the top or put the pump back on the base, pump the toilet a few times to spread it all over the inside of the pump cylinder...you're done with lubricating for the season.
 

BayMan

.
Sep 12, 2012
203
Hunter 450 Unspecified
ACE. Just about the only store I haven't looked in yet.
I want that lube all around the plunger right?
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
I want that lube all around the plunger right?
No....you want that lube all over the inside of the pump cylinder. Follow the instructions in my previous reply!
It's the inside of the pump cylinder that needs lubrication because all the stuff on in the pump--seals, o-rings etc--rub against it when the toilet is pumped. The piston rod "plunger") doesn't need lubrication because it doesn't rub against anything. If you put a healthy glob of grease into it, pumping the toilet is gonna spread it all over the inside of the pump cylinder and everything else in the pump/

And btw...the SuperLube grease is also the perfect lubricant for winches, y-valves, seacocks and anything with moving parts that needs a lubricant that won't wash out as soon as it gets wet.
 
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DaveJ

.
Apr 2, 2013
526
Catalina 310 Niagara-on-the-Lake
What about the product called 'Head Lube'? Not at my boat so not sure who makes it.

Cheers
 

bshock

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Jan 18, 2013
126
Beneteau 361 Sandusky Harbor Marina
I found it at Walmart too. It was in their "hardware" section, maybe plumbing, don't remember exactly.
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
What about the product called 'Head Lube'? Not at my boat so not sure who makes it. Cheers
West Marine has/had? a product called Head Lube--one of several similar products that you pour into the bowl and flush to get it into the toilet pump. The problem with anything that's thin enough to be added to the pump via the bowl is that it washes out in just a few flushes....so using one of 'em to keep the toilet pumping smoothly is a never-ending job every week or two. If you're ok with that, a tablespoon of vegetable oil works just as well and is a lot cheaper than "Head Lube" or any similar product sold by marine retailers.

Where did the idea of pouring vegetable oil down the toilet to lubricate the pump originate? The first manual toilets had leather seals, o-rings etc...the high priced bronze "thrones"--the Groco Model K and the discontinued Wilcox-Crittenden Imperial and Skipper--still do...and leather absorbs oil. So half a cup of vegetable oil down the toilet keeps the pump lubricated for months or even longer. So when rubber, and nitril etc replaced leather in more affordable production toilets, people just continued doing what they'd always done...pouring oil down the toilet. But rubber and nitril etc don't absorb oil...flushing the toilet just washes it right back out again. So toilet mfrs had to come up with a lubricant that hangs around a while...and they did. Ever noticed that brand new toilets don't need any lubrication for a least a year, maybe longer depending upon how much the toilet is used? That's because every new toilet pump leaves the factory liberally slathered with thick teflon or silcon grease--grease that doesn't damage the rubber parts in the pump--that doesn't wash out easily. Replacing it annually as part of spring recommissioning is only a 10-15 minute job....and that tube of grease costs a lot less than any "head lube."
 
Jan 25, 2013
22
tartan 3700 northport NY
I have been using mineral oil purchased from a drug store to lubricate the head for a couple of years. It is safe to swallow so I doubt it can do any damage, and is probably less likely to get digested by bacteria than vegetable oil. A couple of tablespoons last quite a while. I paid eight dollars for a pint and haven't used even a quarter of the bottle.
 
Jun 25, 2005
72
Hunter 31 Carlyle IL
I have a Jabsco manual toilet that was rebuilt last season with and new twist and lock pump and all new seals and gaskets. I installed a new Jabsco joker valve at the beginning of this season because I used pink antifreeze over the winter. The only liquid that was put thru the system this season has been fresh water from the sink hose, odorlos, cleans potties, and a cup of vinegar. The vinegar was overkill cause there is no smell at all. I am the only one on the boat so I know that no human waste solid or liquid has gone into the toilet. I pump thru a bowl fresh water each time I use the boat to keep the system lubed and operational. The vent is clear and I can hear the flush water splash into the holding tank. There is probably a 4 foot rise from the toilet base to the top of the tank. Recently about a pint of water is flowing back into the tank in about 5 minutes. The bowl use to complete dry when I would return to the boat after a week or more. Is it possible the vinegar attacked the Joker valve? I can pump 50 times but it seems that I can't get the final pint of so of flush water over the top of the discharge line and into the holding tank. I suppose that is normal or what else would be the need for the joker valve. I can't figure out what caused the backfilling other than the Joker valve being distorted.
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
I can pump 50 times but it seems that I can't get the final pint of so of flush water over the top of the discharge line and into the holding tank.
Are you pumping in the dry mode? If you aren't, you're bringing more water in at the same rate you're pumping it out. If you are, something's pushing back...most likely a blocked or partially blocked tank vent that's pressurizing the system, creating back pressure. That you're hearing waste fall into the tank does not rule out a vent blockage, especially if enough time has elapsed since the last use to allow any pressure to dissipate.

...I suppose that is normal or what else would be the need for the joker valve. I can't figure out what caused the backfilling other than the Joker valve being distorted.
If you left vinegar sitting in the bowl or didn't rinse behind it after about 30 minutes with about a quart of fresh water, it very well could be....which would also be the reason your toilet can't move the last of the water over the top of the loop. But even a brand new joker valve will only block slow seepage for very short time...only until enough flushes have gone through it to let even a little daylight show through the slit. The more you use the toilet, the wider the slit becomes and the less efficient your toilet becomes at moving waste to its destination.

You asked "what else could a joker valve be for?" But that's a joker valve's LEAST important function. It's actually is THE single most important replaceable part in a manual toilet.

Here’s why: On the upstroke of the piston, a vacuum is created in the area beneath the piston. This causes the joker valve to close tightly, and the flapper valve beneath the pump to open, allowing some of the bowl contents to be drawn into the bottom half of the pump. Then, on the down stroke of the piston, the flapper valve is slammed shut, and the effluent is forced out of the bottom of the pump, through the joker valve, and off down the line. But when the joker valve becomes worn and/or there's a buildup of sea water minerals on it, it can no longer seal tightly on the upstroke of the piston...less vacuum is created when you pump it. And as the joker valve becomes more worn, less and less vacuum... till finally the bowl contents simply move up and down a bit, but don't go anywhere. Sometimes the flapper valve needs to be replaced too, which is why toilets should also be rebuilt at least every 5-6 years (or a Jabsco pump replaced at least every two years) as PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE
You prob'ly won't notice the loss of efficiency at first because it's so gradual...But I guarantee you that if it's been two years or longer since you replaced the joker valve, you need to pump the toilet at least 50% more times to move the bowl contents all the way to the tank or out the thru-hull....IF they're getting there at all any more.

I pump thru a bowl fresh water each time I use the boat to keep the system lubed and operational.
Water does not lubricate a pump. That requires grease. There are two ways to keep a toilet lubed....
1) the never-ending job of flushing a tablespoon of oil (any more won't last any longer and just is a waste of oil) every week or two...and btw, mineral oil is ok in an emergency (baby oil is mineral oil that smells nice), but it's a petroleum product that's not all that good for rubber.
2) Spend about 15 minutes once every year as part of spring recommissioning replacing the thick teflon or silicon grease that was in the pump when it left the factory. Complete instructions earlier in this thread.

Y'all really ought to check out the link in my signature...it goes to a comprehensive "marine toilets and holding tanks 101" manual that will help you prevent 99% of problems instead of having to solve 'em.
 
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Jul 27, 2011
5,180
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
I have been using mineral oil purchased from a drug store to lubricate the head for a couple of years. It is safe to swallow so I doubt it can do any damage, and is probably less likely to get digested by bacteria than vegetable oil. A couple of tablespoons last quite a while. I paid eight dollars for a pint and haven't used even a quarter of the bottle.
I keep on the boat a big tube (a better buy than small ones) of silicon grease that I got from a hardware store. Use it for lots of things. Lubing the plunger on the Jabsco, as dieletic grease, to temporarily seal leaky port lights or hatches, to lightly lube o-rings, etc. Very handy.
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
I keep on the boat a big tube (a better buy than small ones) of silicon grease that I got from a hardware store. Use it for lots of things. Lubing the plunger on the Jabsco....
...Winches, seacocks, y-valves.. But why are you only lubing the PLUNGER (by which I'm assuming you mean the piston rod)? Lubrication protects things that rub against each other from friction wear...the piston rod doesn't rub against anything. It's the stuff ON the rod that rubs against the inside of the pump cylinder that needs lubrication!

1. Remove the top from the pump. (PHII/PHC owners, remove the pump from the base. It's just screws, no need to remove any hoses) 2. Stick the nozzle on the tube into the pump and give the tube a healthy squirt--about tablespoon. 3. Put the top back on the pump. 4. Pump the toilet a few times to spread the grease all over the inside of the pump cylinder...you're done.
 
Jul 27, 2011
5,180
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
...Winches, seacocks, y-valves.. But why are you only lubing the PLUNGER (by which I'm assuming you mean the piston rod)? Lubrication protects things that rub against each other from friction wear...the piston rod doesn't rub against anything. It's the stuff ON the rod that rubs against the inside of the pump cylinder that needs lubrication!

1. Remove the top from the pump. (PHII/PHC owners, remove the pump from the base. It's just screws, no need to remove any hoses) 2. Stick the nozzle on the tube into the pump and give the tube a healthy squirt--about tablespoon. 3. Put the top back on the pump. 4. Pump the toilet a few times to spread the grease all over the inside of the pump cylinder...you're done.
I think what happens is that when I lube the piston rod some of it gets inside the cylinder and spreads around that way. It takes several strokes for the "squeaky" sounds to stop.
 

BayMan

.
Sep 12, 2012
203
Hunter 450 Unspecified
Peggy- in the dry mode I pump and can feel the pressure in the handle and can hear the pressure build and then slowly release. I usually wait with the plunher held down until the pressure goes down until I pump the next stroke. Is that correct procedure?
 
Dec 2, 1997
9,011
- - LIttle Rock
No...something isn't working right. Flushing shouldn't be loose, but there shouldn't be any pressure buildup either...it should be a nice "firm" stroke both up and down that steadily moves bowl contents. A pressure buildup is a BIG indication that the system is pressurized, most likely from either a blocked tank vent or sea water mineral buildup in the toilet discharge hose that's so severe it's all but blocked the discharge line.