Wire gauge for DC wiring lights on 1983 H31

[SFS]

I'm preparing for the replacement of all the cabin lights in my H31. I've read Mainesail's articles, and have found fixtures and tools, now I need to order heatshrink butt connectors to connect new light fixtures to existing wiring. So that I order the right size heat shrink connections, my question is:
What is the gauge wire used for the light fixtures on a 1983 H31?

The wiring appears to be original. I don't have calipers to physically measure the wire, so I'm hoping someone knows, or can offer a suggestion on how to learn, short of buying another tool.

I can call the supplier to get the gauge of the wires leading off the new fixtures, which is the second piece of info I need to order the correct connectors.

 

[jssailem]

Typically your connectors from Ancor Marine come in 3 sizes with matching colors

1. 12 to 10-Gauge yellow
2. 16 to 14-Gauge blue
3. 22 to 18-Gauge pink

I load my electrical repair box with some of each. Repair/Install selection is based on wires I have in front of me while on my back in some confined boat compartment.

Without specific knowledge of your boat or it's wiring (be it original or previous owner installed) My swag (scientific wild a$$ guess) your looking at blue or pink connectors.

Prices vary. Shop on line with SBO. Somewhere $3.70 to $5.00 per pack of 3.

 

[pateco]

Here is a picture of the inside of one of the ceiling dome lights in my 1983 H31.

It looks like blue connectors were used, and the lines were paralleled with decent gauge wire.

 

[SFS]

I'll be using step down butt connectors, and I know where to get them. Just need the specs on the wires themselves. Anyone know? Crazy Dave? Anyone? Is MH likely to have kept records?

 

[kloudie1]

Original spec is for 16 gauge for the lighting.

 

[kloudie1]

A couple of things for the H-31 ('84-87?) files. Looks like ya have to "Open in new window" then zoom in.

 

[SFS]

Thanks kloudie, and everyone. Now I just need the fixture manufacturer to get back to me.

 

[Ron20324]

Get some of each size for future use. If my eyes do not fail me, it looks like both bulbs are common at both ends, and would come on together?

 

[SFS]

Get some of each size for future use...

Well, they are not cheap, and I'm investing in tools at the same time, so I'd like to get just what is appropriate, with extras for those "learning moments".

However, I am aware that someone makes inserts that can be used on "regular" butt connectors for stepdown purposes. That would be the way to go, but I can't seem to find those references again.

 

[jssailem]

Here you go SFS. A plethora of connectors.
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/cat.php?18968

 

[jssailem]

I bought a Titan ratchet tool to crimp the connectors. Using adhesive heat shrink ring connections on my boat as a primary method. So far very pleased.

 

[pateco]

SF,

From the picture I took, and Kloudie1's diagram, It looks like these lights are wired in parallel. so your boat side connectors need to be able to handle doubled #16 Blue and black wires. The fixture side is most likely different on your new lights.

 

[SFS]

Good point, I'll need to open up some of the old fixtures and verify. If memory serves though, I have checked one, and it had only one pair of wires coming in to the fixture. Your picture did look odd to me.

This information makes it even more important to find a standard (same size on both sides) butt connector of proper diameter, and use inserts to "size down" one end to the proper size for the wires coming off the fixture.

 

[jssailem]

SF. You are installing new lights? LED or Halogen?
Your concern has been the right connector to wire in the boat based on the correct gauge, as I understand it.

Here is a simple calculator for your wire size to voltage demand. http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html
I tested it with a typical load for LED lights. You could run a wire twice around the boat 62 feet with 16AWG and get only Voltage drop percentage: 2.08% .indicating plenty of power capacity to drive LED lights with 16AWG wire. The blue wire appears to be 16AWG. So I would buy blue connectors designed for 14-16 AWG wire. If you want to connect/disconnect the wires you use the quick disconnect connectors. If you want a semi-permanent connection use butt connectors and cut the wire if you need to install a new fixture. Or you can go the ring connector route, more cost in parts (terminal blocks, ring connectors on all wires - solid connections).

Either the wiring is 14 or 16 AWG as they are a common size used in boat wiring. Most likely it is 16 AWG as that is what appears to be the wire used in the image of the light (Blue wire). It is a few cents cheaper, boat manufactures are known to save pennies in mass production.

Then you can complete the project and get back to what we all love. Sailing... Fair winds and success on your project.

 

[Bill Roosa]

Use your crimping tool. It has a wire insulation striping part that is labeled in wire gauge. One of the small holes will be the same size as the wire without the insulation. Start big and work down to prevent cutting the individual wire strands

 

[SFS]

All, I appreciate the tips. The problem arises on the fixture side, where I have much smaller wires than 16 AWG. Hence the need for stepdown connectors. And with multiple styles of fixtures, I have multiple different sizes of smaller wires compounding the problem.

JSSail: I'm using the existing wiring already connected to the original incandescent fixtures. I'm not replacing any wire, and am confident that the existing wire will power the LED fixtures fine, as they draw less current than the originals. All connections will be heat shrink (polyolefin) butt connectors, but as you can see from the previous paragraph, I don't have the luxury of buying plain 16AWG butt connectors - one end would be fine (exclusive of pateco's warning) but the other end would be WAY too large. I had already looked through the options on the SBO store pages, and am also researching AMP, Molex, Ancor, etc.

Bill Roosa - Excellent idea. I could go cut and strip one wire in a random fixture that is awaiting replacement and confirm its size. Thanks for the tip.

 

[jssailem]

Ok That helps.
Are these new fixtures or old fixtures that you want to put LED bulbs in?
Can you take a picture of the small wire? Is the small wire on the fixture?
Some electronics use fine wire internally 18-22AWG but have not seen that in lighting.

The PO of my boat (miss wired) a LED strip with 22AWG wire. It is on my project list to replace. Some wiring is done leading 16AWG to a central sight and a buss bar using ring connectors to power the buss bar, then they use thinner wire to the LED fixtures ( not sure it is an ABYC recommended method). Remember your fuses are there to protect the wire not the fixture or electronics from melting and fire. It is why you match the wire size from the battery to the fixture and back. Going from a large wire to a small wire is like attaching your garden hose to a straw.

 

[SFS]

The new fixtures are truly new. Small wires are on the fixtures, and my guess is they are 22 AWG, but I can measure them, thanks to Bill's tip, as they are already stripped from the factory. However, my cheap stripper doesn't go that small. I've ordered the proper tools, some of them from MaineSail, so I will have what I need on that front. My worry is the connectors, and I really want to go with the heat shrink connectors over any other choices. I also suspect that for some of the fixtures being removed there will not be an abundance of wire to work with coming out of the ceiling, so I want to get it right the first time - not cutting off a lot of length, trying twice, etc.

I agree with the garden hose to drinking straw analogy, but I don't control the gauge of the pigtails coming of the fixtures. I would have replaced bulbs rather than fixtures, but the admiral really wanted new fixtures, so that's what she gets. Luckily, we are not replacing every fixture on the boat right away.

 

[jssailem]

You are so right about the Admiral. She wants what she wants. I am constantly reminded, "Happy wife, happy life".

So these new fixtures came with a box that specifies the fixture amperage specification?
If so then you want to use that number for the fuse you locate near the power source (within 7 inches of battery ABYC) Not good running a 20 amp fuse with a 1 amp wire. (hose analogy).

Check your primary wires (ones running from power to light fixture) most have the AWG size printed on them. May have to look at the wires in the electrical panel area (great way to explore your boat) or where the wires run exposed through a storage area. Mine are 2 wires running through a cover. Printed on the wire is 16AWG just like house wiring from Home Depot (but you do not want to buy HD wire for your boat. Not marine grade wire).

Went on line and found the following at Grainger - https://www.grainger.com/product/PO...m/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/5UGV1_AS01?$smthumb$

They are a step down from 14-16 one side to 18-22 other side. These should work for your challenge.

 

[pateco]

How about these.

3M™ Scotchlok™ Electrical IDC 316IR, Pigtail, Self-Stripping, Black/White, 22-16 AWG

Use 3M™ Scotchlok™ Electrical IDCs 316IR to electrically connect two or three wire ends, insulate the connection and provide a moisture resistant seal. Recommended for use with low energy underground circuit wires, sprinkler systems, landscape lighting or other moisture resistance wires for applications of less than 30 volts. Sealant is a mineral oil-based grease. Maximum insulation O.D.diameter of 0.155 inches (3,9 mm) and a operating temperature of 221(deg)F (105(deg)C).

Found them here Crescent Electrical Supply for $.84/each