This looks fun

rgranger · Mar 10, 2016

I find it interesting how different people approach sailing. To my eyes $92,000 dollars buys a really nice cruiser that is fully stocked with amenities, sails, new gear and electronics etc.... a

Jackdaw said:
Interesting and valid point. But here's a question then, for everybody.

First, how close are YOU to being a young family buyer (couple 30-42 + kids)?

Second, what CURRENT production boat best fits the 'family boat' bill?

Third, if none do describe it, and a REALISTIC price point.

Hey JackDaw... I'm not sure if you are agreeing or arguing against. Help me out...

From my perspective it is an unrealistic price point for a family cruiser. Mid career + kids means minivans, piano and karate lessons and 529 accounts to pay into... not a $100,000 toy that you are too busy at work and running kids around to ever play with... but hey... that might just be my world. Now if a racing crew went in together on a nice rig like that... and you belonged to a club that races regularly.... maybe.

Stu Jackson · Mar 10, 2016

cb32863 said:
This is more of a weekender, week or two type "cruiser". They are not talking about slowly sailing from island to island for months on end.

Fun topic.

Cruiser? The belowdecks "accommodations???" have all the warmth of a 1940s submarine. It's not just the pictures.

weinie · Mar 10, 2016

rgranger said:
I find it interesting how different people approach sailing. To my eyes $92,000 dollars buys a really nice cruiser that is fully stocked with amenities, sails, new gear and electronics etc.... a

Hey JackDaw... I'm not sure if you are agreeing or arguing against. Help me out...

From my perspective it is an unrealistic price point for a family cruiser. Mid career + kids means minivans, piano and karate lessons and 529 accounts to pay into... not a $100,000 toy that you are too busy at work and running kids around to ever play with... but hey... that might just be my world. Now if a racing crew went in together on a nice rig like that... and you belonged to a club that races regularly.... maybe.

Please let me know where I can by a really nice cruiser fully stocked with amenities, sails, new gear and electronics for $92,000 and is NEW?

rgranger · Mar 10, 2016

Yeah right.... not new....

Boats either go way down or way up in actual value within 10 to 15 years after they are new... depending upon how the owner takes care of it. You can find a nice 1990 something boat, that has had the gel coat waxed and buffed every year, every break repaired, new sails, new radar, new wind generator, new etc etc in the $60K range... you can find that same boat barely floating and a total mess for $2K. So I don't see myself buying a new boat.... EVER. I would shop for a 10 year old boat that has been well maintained and the P.O. has added a lot of nice upgrades... figure out where the weak spots are and fixed those and then sold it to me at a horrible loss.

But I also understand that I have a certain mindset that is not shared by everyone. I also buy musical instruments at pawn shops or on craigs list.... they sound just as good but at half price... but hey... that is me and for me the bargain is part of the experience.

weinie · Mar 10, 2016

Well, some idiot had to buy the boat first.

rgranger · Mar 10, 2016

weinie said:
Well, some idiot had to buy the boat first.

Well I did buy a new truck once... and I really do love it. So I get it... but I don't have that weakness when it comes to sailboats. They are toys to love and ride hard and I don't want to get my shorts in a knot every time I approach the dock for fear of scratching my toy.

weinie · Mar 10, 2016

That's why god made moorings.

Jackdaw · Mar 10, 2016

Rgranger,

I hear you. And there is no good answer. It's clear that the prices of new boats now hit numbers that make anyone take notice. Are they in the range of a 'family'? I guess it depends. Lots of families here in Minnestoa have 4 or 5 snow mobiles, one for every family member. That's gotta cost. Maybe because it's spread out over several buys? I don't know.

Beneteau targets the First 20 as the family boat, all in for $45K? The First 25 is marked for couples getting a new boat AFTER the kids leave, go figure.

As Weinie said, SOMEONE has to buy the new boats. Or we're all in trouble.

Meriachee · Mar 10, 2016

The Pogo 12.5 shows up on the Euro version of Yachtworld at 261k USd. Maybe I shoulda been a dentist.

rgranger · Mar 11, 2016

Jackdaw

I used to live in St. Paul and later in St. Peter... I also have a "camp" in Butternut WI... so I know how much fun snow mobiles are. I'm more into X-country skis myself but I'll accept a ride on a snowmobile and enjoy it. If I were buying a snowmobile I wouldn't want a used one. Unlike a boat, vehicles are very hard to add value to once you take them off the lot.

But... since this post was titled "This looks fun"... if I were to fantasize about a dream boat for me, it would be this one

http://www.seawardyachts.com/32rk/

But even a 10 year old one of these is coming in at $1000 on sailboat listings....

<sigh>

Jackdaw · Mar 11, 2016

Meriachee said:
The Pogo 12.5 shows up on the Euro version of Yachtworld at 261k USd. Maybe I shoulda been a dentist.

Trust me I've been watching that one. The price WAS over US$300k until the Euro took a dive vs the dollar. Go Greenback!

Scott T-Bird · Mar 11, 2016

Jackdaw said:
The price WAS over US$300k until the Euro took a dive vs the dollar. Go Greenback!

Not good for trade deficit. Too bad we don't seem to have the energy or desire to produce over here.

DougM · Mar 11, 2016

Every person who has a boat has their preferences, and for valid reasons.
When I raced scows there were classes with single tillers and deep rudders, and classes with twin tillers and short rudders. They were the best way to go for those boats.
When I moved up to a bigger boat though, my choice was a wheel. I just wish the one I have was a larger diameter, it would keep the rest of the crew out of my space.

rgranger · Mar 11, 2016

DougM said:
I just wish the one I have was a larger diameter,

Ahhhh to easy... I'll take a pass

I can see this devolving into a political thread....

Daveinet · Mar 11, 2016

Truthfully, if you are not a cruiser, I see no logic in buying a monohull, unless you are buying used and spending under 50K. When you start looking a Farrier tris, a monohull that is 8ft wide makes no sense. Even for my family, we spend 95% of our time above deck. The only time we go below deck, is to use the facilities, or to change clothes. So a functional below deck is all one needs unless they are a cruiser. A brand new F22 is under 50K, and above that length, I've seen a F9AXR (32 ft) listed for $120K and it was carbon fiber. Compared to any of the boats listed in this thread, I know which boat I would rather sail on.

BTY: I think it is a valid assumption that the average American family man can only afford a boat that is priced similarly to the price of a new car. If that demographic could afford more than that, new cars would be more expensive. The auto industry is targeting the max of what people can afford, so I think it is a good barometer of the average American discretionary income.

Roadking Larry · Mar 14, 2016

My boat is 40 years old this year. When I bought it 2 years ago it was just inside the "I can pay cash" range. For me it's really a high end toy. Albeit one that I really like but still a leisure activity (and an emergency crash pad if I seriously PO the wife). If I was in a position to actually live aboard and cruise regularly financing might be an option and at least be able to maybe get the 2nd home tax break.

Jackdaw · Mar 14, 2016

Daveinet said:
Truthfully, if you are not a cruiser, I see no logic in buying a monohull, unless you are buying used and spending under 50K. When you start looking a Farrier tris, a monohull that is 8ft wide makes no sense. Even for my family, we spend 95% of our time above deck. The only time we go below deck, is to use the facilities, or to change clothes. So a functional below deck is all one needs unless they are a cruiser. A brand new F22 is under 50K, and above that length, I've seen a F9AXR (32 ft) listed for $120K and it was carbon fiber. Compared to any of the boats listed in this thread, I know which boat I would rather sail on.

BTY: I think it is a valid assumption that the average American family man can only afford a boat that is priced similarly to the price of a new car. If that demographic could afford more than that, new cars would be more expensive. The auto industry is targeting the max of what people can afford, so I think it is a good barometer of the average American discretionary income.

Honestly Dave, that is the most complex and obtuse first sentence I've every seen! Two negatives followed by an unless then an and!

Expressed logicly, Einstein was simpler!

But I agree that the fashion of downstairs accomdarion is changing. Going are the acres of stick-built furniture, which adds cost and weight. Light is fast! This is true in monos as well as cats.

I do not see th percentage of people OWNING multi-hulls changing anytime soon. BUT, people will be switching to lighter, simpler, faster monohulls. It's already happening in Europe. Here in the USA with a much older, slower market for new boats, it will take longer.

I was out sailing yesterday on a light fast monohull. We were going Downwind jib and main, at 10.5 knots. Having a beer.

Light=fast.

Daveinet · Mar 14, 2016

Jackdaw said:
I was out sailing yesterday on a light fast monohull. We were going Downwind jib and main, at 10.5 knots. Having a beer.

Light=fast.

But wouldn't you rather be sailing upwind at 15 knots having your beer?

Jackdaw · Mar 14, 2016

Daveinet said:
But wouldn't you rather be sailing upwind at 15 knots having your beer?

10 knots I believe. 15, not so much!