Limit of responsibility to assist?

[Kings Gambit]

So, my wife and I were anchored in Landing Cove at Santa Barbara Island late one afternoon in August with a companion boat anchored some distance away from us. We were the only boats there. Conditions were hazy with less than 10 n.mi. visibility. It was less than an hour before dark when a 17' open sportfisher w/console and two souls (guy and gal) aboard sped past us heading south grinning ear to ear. Several minutes later it returned, slowed down, and putted by our stern. The guy shouts: "Is this San Clemente Island?" [San Clemente Island lies about 45 n.mi. SSE of Santa Barbara Island.] "No--Santa Barbara Island." "Where's that?" "About 46 n.mi. west of San Pedro." "Where's Catalina Island from here?" I tell the guy that Two Harbors at the Isthmus is 25 n.mi. east, bearing approx. 90 deg [T]. The two chat a few minutes and conclude that they cannot make it that far by dark. So the guy asks if it would be safe to spend the night. Turns out that on that particular day the wind was light and sea fairly calm, and no unhappy weather forecast except for a cool overnight low--I said I thought so. He asks where he should anchor. I inquired the amount of anchor rode he had aboard--about 100 ft--so I pointed to a spot about 150 ft away in 30 ft of depth and told him to pay it all out and secure well; he had no depth finder. As they had expected to reach Avalon to camp they had food, sleeping bags, and spare fuel aboad. For sleeping they made quarters in the bow forward of the console.

At this point I began to wonder about my responsibility "to assist" other mariners "in distress." The guy was anchored on short scope at a remote island, at night, in low visibility, in an open boat lacking navigation instruments and materials; he with an apparent inability to run a compass course to a distant destination. I told my wife I thought I might have a "legal" responsibility to look out for them overnight; even take them aboard if the conditions deteriorated. But did I??

The next morning at dawn they started hauling anchor. I motioned the guy over to inquire how he got into this situation. Apparently, they had left San Pedro for Avalon, so they thought, which explains why he thought he had missed that SE corner of Catalina Island and ended up at San Clemente Island. Instead, he had gone by the NW corner and found Santa Barbara Island by chance. The low visibility kept him from seeing the west end of Catalina as he sped by it more than 30 n.mi. off his true course. The next "stop" would have been San Nicolas Island, another 20 n.mi. west.

I gave him a compass (i.e., magnetic) heading to the west end of Catalina and told him to STAY ON IT, and after 10 n.mi. he should be able to see the island. I also coached him and the girlfriend on how to use the VHF, about which they evidently had no clue, and what to tell the Coast Guard about their location, etc., if they got into [more] trouble. I then monitored my VHF16 at anchor for the next two hours.

So my question--was there in fact a "legal" responsibility to "assist" beyond what I did; or even to do that much? It's not a matter of being a nice guy or not. What actually defines "a mariner in distress" when the mariner himself is not even aware of the trouble he is in?

 

[Rick486]

Personally, I never give advice on how to anchor, how to get someplace, how to fix broken gear, etc. I will tell people where they are if they are lost, and that has been required more than once. I will offer to show them a chart and let them figure out how to get somewhere. I will pull people out of the water, and that has happened, if they are in distress. I will tow a disabled boat if need be and if I can, or call a service to come get them and stand by until they arrive. I will give/lend spare parts if needed. You get the picture. Basically I avoid taking responsibility for their actions but am more than willing to lend a hand.

 

[Joe]

I don't think giving people directions is a problem in any language. Somebody asks you how to get to Catalina...you simply tell them.. watching out for their welfare so you won't have to rescue them later is entirely reasonable....

 

[woodster]

i am not a lawyer but think about what you described in your post put that guy and gal in your position with all they did not know would they have been legally responsible to assist

 

[SailorTom]

I can't imagine there is any law requiring us to help the stupid and clueless. I've heard of Good Samaritan laws about helping in distress. Where they, the clueless, in "distress"? But then there are more Laws in this free land then anyone could ever possibly know them all.

 

[woodster]

I can't imagine there is any law requiring us to help the stupid and clueless. I've heard of Good Samaritan laws about helping in distress. Where they, the clueless, in "distress"? But then there are more Laws in this free land then anyone could ever possibly know them all.

or live by 100 % of the time

 

[Paul Mermelstein]

First off, they were not in distress. No imminent danger of sinking, no fire aboard, no MOB, not grave illness or injury, etc. If there was a real distress issue, you would be obligated to help, of course. They were, however, shall we say, "needy". So, what you did is, in my opinion, entirely within the bounds of being a good guy who did what he thought he could to help another boater. I don't think you had any responsibility beyond what you did.

Here in the Chesapeake Bay, we get people like that too. I have participated in more than one rescue or response to a vessel actually in distress. On the VHF, we hear people call the CG that are having problems and they have no clue where they are. "I am out by this lighthouse" or something like that. (We have a lot of lighthouses on the Bay). I wish more people were better prepared, but that's life and we help where we can.

 

[RickSpil]

Assisting mariners in distress is part of all maritime law. The obligation appears in US admiralty law, as well as several international conventions. That being said, the powerboaters you described were not in "distress." They were unprepared, stupid and a risk to themselves and others. You acted reasonably and humanely in suggesting that they anchor for the night. You had no obligation to educate them or act as a parent, although it appeared that they could have used both. If you later saw the fisherman clinging to their overturned boat, you would have had an obligation to assist to the extent that you safely could.

 

[woodster]

i personally think that one just needs to be a good neighbor if at all possible...if you can help some one help them ...if you can't get out of there way

 

[frimi_captain]

I'd assist, If I can. I have done so often ashore. Why would I change my behavior afloat?

 

[Blue Pearl Captain]

While there is no duty, there certainly is something to be said for courtesy and good will.

 

[njlarry]

i personally think that one just needs to be a good neighbor if at all possible...if you can help some one help them ...if you can't get out of there way

Agreed. Legal laws aside, there is a higher moral obligation. Gambit, I think that you used the opportunity to educate them and decreased the chances of a disaster. We may not be our brothers keeper but that does not mean that we can not help each other, even those who appear ignorant. I know that I have been through my own learning curve. You did right.

 

[Jackdaw]

For me, the bar is at 'a clear and present danger to life'. Anything below that is at personal choice as to how to get involved.

Help, guide and assist when reasonably possible to do so. Personally, I tend to choose to outline options. I very rarely give advice to strangers

You are not required to anticipate stupidity.

 

[coolista]

The information you report was not in error. The information put them in a better way than before. Best part in this case, unless they got completely turned around, they would eventually smash into the mainland or a Huntington Beach surfer. Showing someone how to use a radio is always good. Did they repay you in any way? No transaction, little legal liability. Nonetheless, I sympathize with your conundrum: I often think, "Is there any way I said stuff that could be misinterpreted? Could lead them astray and toward risk?" This will never be completely satisfied. I often have them repeat back to me everything before sending someone on the path I have altered. It also permits questions for clarity as they rehash what they heard.

 

[MorningSong]

Legality and morality are two totally different questions. I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me that your boaters were not in distress, so you had no legal obligation to help them.

I believe however, that you did the right thing morally. Very often as humans, we find ourselves in positions where we don't know what we don't know. Sometimes we don't know we need to educate ourselves on a topic until we are in a situation where we realize the education is needed, even for the most intelligent of us. In these times, those of us who are not too proud to realize we need help or are willing to accept it, tend to welcome advice from those who plainly see the hazards we are placing ourselves into.

Someone at some point taught you the proper ratio of anchor rode to water depth. Somewhere you learned what minimum equipment you needed on a boat and what local knowledge was needed. Even if you read all that in a book, someone took the time to write it in a logical, easy to read format. We aren't born knowing these things, and assertions that kids like this are stupid and irresponsible are unfair at best.

These two were not, in my opinion stupid. Uneducated, yes. Unprepared, obviously. But they listened and learned from what you had to offer. This tells me that they simply weren't aware they had a gap in their knowledge, or that they simply had no way of knowing where to find the information they needed. So you did what I would have done, with one exception. I would have recommended that at minimum they take classes from The USCG Auxiliary or The Power Squadron.

I've known plenty stupid boaters. Those are the ones who already know everything there is to know about boating and refuse to accept advice from more experienced boaters. I've been around enough to realize that the more I know, the more I realize I have yet to learn. The Day I think I know it all, is the day I hang up my halyard and move back ashore.

It is to me one of the most endearing things about the boating community, that we look out for one another. That the more experienced boaters are more than willing to offer help and advice if asked. And when someone is in trouble, no one thinks twice about offering a helping hand.

 

[Sunday Sailor]

I think you did exactly as I would, except I probably would have written the instructions down and also told him to take some boating courses or get off the water.

 

[jleblanc31]

Down here in louisiana is easy to get lost in the bayou not uncommon at all for some one to stop and ask for directions .

 

[25yearslater]

Let's flip this on its' head for a minute. You do nothing and they continue on their merry way. The following morning the news is full with the search for two missing boaters after their craft was found floating upside down. Now only all but the most ardent sociopath would feel like dung knowing they could have at least attempted to alter the outcome. Good job KG. You have demonstrated what is best not only about sailing but humanity as well. It's called empathy and it is becoming extremely rare in a narcissistic world. Legal vs. moral or ethical often run contrary to one another.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Let's flip this on its' head for a minute. You do nothing and they continue on their merry way. The following morning the news is full with the search for two missing boaters after their craft was found floating upside down. Now only all but the most ardent sociopath would feel like dung knowing they could have at least attempted to alter the outcome. Good job KG. You have demonstrated what is best not only about sailing but humanity as well. It's called empathy and it is becoming extremely rare in a narcissistic world. Legal vs. moral or ethical often run contrary to one another.

Thanks for your post (and all of the others). Your alternative outcome scenario was, in fact, going through my mind at the time. It helps to know why seeing a chart of the region (attached). Tiny Santa Barbara Island (SBI) is on the boarder dividing two weather zones, one of the outer waters and the other of the inner waters. The outer waters are significantly rougher than the inner ones most of the time. NOAA zonal forecasts near SBI might actually go either way (the outer waters forecast or the inner waters forecast). If it blows up the anchorage at Landing Cove can be rough. A boat anchored on short scope might pull out and blow southeasterly toward the coast. So, yes, they might eventually end up back in LA or Orange county w/o any help from me. Of course, they might also get off a "MayDay" somehow; but, they would not know their location. I suppose if not disabled they might get close enough to shore to see lights and find their way home, or might even try to return to Landing Cove. It was their decision to anchor for the night; my decision to advise and effectively stand anchor watch that evening so I would not have to hear about that CG search!!

 

[Benny17441]

Would you be liable for having and withholding information that could keep them out of a possible distress situation? It could be that you would have the same liability as if you knowingly provided incorrect information. They approached you and established that they did not have the knowledge or the means to get to a safe destination. Can a mariner that does not have the knowledge or tools to navigate by and is at a deserted location can be considered a mariner in distress? It would be reasonable to assume so as the only means to return to safety without assistance would be based on pure chance. I believe you recognized your legal obligation and acted appropriately. Don't know if at any point they refused further assistance releasing you from further obligation or if it was by mutual understanding that the assistance provided was deemed adequate. It is reasonable to conclude that due to the speed differential of the vessels you were not going to enhance any safety by offering to lead them back to Catalina and that they would probably not acceded to abandon their vessel or accede to stay put until official help arrived so I would say you reasonably fulfilled your obligation.