Inspected my first Catalina 22

[thetailwind]

Hello, this is my first post, please go easy.

I am interested in purchasing a Catalina 22 with trailer and I took a look at my first one (If you now someone selling in the Maryland region :dance. I used a buyers guide found on one of the forums to give me some guidance and I would like to hear some of your opinions on what I should run from or what is not a big deal. The boat was a 1975 model swing keel.

Full Gallery: http://imgur.com/a/PNSnO

First off I noticed no soft spots on the deck but I did see a good bit of gelcoat cracking. More than I would have expected, but this is based off of my no experience, just reading

The pictures below are of the top of the cabin as the bump meets the deck. I am standing on the bow looking towards the mast.

The cockpit floor looks like it had an impact crack on it.

The previous owner installed a solar panel and electric motor in a manner which I would suspect is a no-no. Drilling holes and using some kind of adhesive to seal it, the one for the motor is not even sealed

motor

The interior seemed decent. There was some leaking from above, which I suspect was a result of collecting water evaporation. I saw water in the window seals as well as retreating/shrinking seals.

The Keel cable seemed to be in good shape and the crank functioned reasonably well. The keel itself looked ok and I tried to get a good look at the bar that goes through it since the guide said it was important to inspect that as well. It had a little rust but looked ok.

The sails seemed to be in good condition, the stitching did not break and they felt pretty clean. One had a rip in it and was patched. I am curious to hear opinions of the reliability of running a patched sail.

He did not have a separate battery to test the cabin electrics so I could reasonably assume, I may have to rewire the cabin.

The trailer was not in good shape and probably is the biggest hang up on the whole deal. Rust in the brake reservoir, Mixed metal usage (galvanized and non-galvanized)

I'm interested in hearing your opinion and which issues I saw were deal breakers or common maintenance tasks. She looks good for her age? Offer less (how much?) Look for another boat? Run!?

Dont forget that there are many more pictures in the gallery: http://imgur.com/a/PNSnO

Plug: If you have a 22 and trailer in the DELMARVA area for sale, PM me

 

[CloudDiver]

Everything I see in those pictures is a HACK job. I would offer that guy $500 for that boat, that is to say he would have to pay ME $500 to take it off his hands to avoid landfill fees.

First hint, the chain plate eye bolts in the first pic are in the wrong orientation. This causes un-due stress on the rig and can cause shrouds/stays/turnbuckles to fail and dismasting. Maybe one reason why there is so much gelcoat crazing (the cracks) is because of excess stress from the rig if the boat was always sailed like that.

The solar panel and electric motor wire holes... obvious signs of horrible workmanship and with everything together you'd have a full restoration on your hands. Are you prepared for that? Take a look at my resto thread and think about what you want to o for the next 12 to 18 months... would you rather sail or join my club? LOL

I'm not busting your chops, you did a good job inspecting this boat and pointing out some major issues. Very good observations for someone who is new. I am busting the chops of the previous owner who was responsible for that mess!

I'll take a peek at the rest of the pics and let you know what else I find wrong, lol!

 

[thetailwind]

Thanks for the fast reply. I did find many of those cracks to be in odd places given how I would suspect the hull to distribute torque load.

 

[CloudDiver]

I just looked at the pictures... Uggh. the list is LOOOOONG. Before I type it out, RUN. Run like that boat is on fire!

Seriously, I'd give the guy $150 to let me salvage some of the hardware, winches, and Mast. I would be doing him a favor by doing the labor to take the parts, then he can junk the hull. The only way I'd ever take that hull to do a restoration was if it were given to me FREE and oh, he just happens to have 4 gallons of WEST epoxy and hardeners just laying around that he will throw in and oh yeah, he also has all these new parts and hardware from Catalina Direct that go with boat he just doesn't have time to install... please just take it all, get this boat out of my yard.... yeah, wishful thinking.

 

[CloudDiver]

I'm not sure what you are willing to spend, but here is a good 1986 C22 that is far more 'ready to sail' just for comparison;

Asking $6400 but I'm fairly certain you could talk them down a bit:
http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/boa/5216258966.html

When shopping for a C22 be flexible and be willing to drive up a certain radius, maybe 1/2 day or more if possible. You are in a good area, there will always be C22 for sale. Be patient, if you miss one deal then another will always pop up.

 

[CloudDiver]

Another for comparison... This is a 'new design' wing keel. Asking only a little more than the previous ad I posted, but room to talk him down since it has an older outboard. Overall this boat looks to be in even better condition... I'd jump on a chance to get a wing keel in this shape if I could;

http://fredericksburg.craigslist.org/boa/5217982002.html

 

[thetailwind]

Thanks for showing me those. I am looking to spend around 3K on one. There are two in the area that I am planning to take a look at that meet the criteria. The Swing keel appeals to me because it will be a trailer sailor for at least the first season until we are more invested in the sport or have lost our minds setting her up each time. It looks a lot easier to launch from a trailer with the swing. In your opinion, did I miss anything in my inspection?

 

[CloudDiver]

I think your inspection was great.... you easily pointed out major issues. 3K is a good goal number for finding a boat in good condition. For that price you should find a hull that is an 82 to 85 model that is in much better condition than the subject boat in this post. Sometimes I see ads for boats in similar condition and owners are asking between 3500 and 4500 dollars... it is hilarious.

Don't count out a wing keel. Yes, they are a little more of a pain to launch because they sit higher on the trailer... But the huge advantage is the keel is made of lead so you wont have future rust problems like you can with a cast iron swing keel. Also, you don't have to deal with the maintenance issues of the keel pivot pin, keel hangers (broken mounting bolts!), or the keel winch/cable... and you don't have that big hole in the hull either, lol! So, if you see yourself getting sick of rigging the mast every time and renting a slip in the future you may want the wing keel. You will probably only haul out once a year for winter storage and your marina might have a crane anyway.

 

[thetailwind]

Great, what do you think happened to that sail? Also, other than CL what are some good resources for finding these 22s?

 

[CloudDiver]

Not really sure how it might of happened, but the repair was obviously not professionally done.

Great, what do you think happened to that sail? Also, other than CL what are some good resources for finding these 22s?

 

[CloudDiver]

I looked at the pics in the Imagur link, these are my thoughts as brief as possible, somewhat in the order of the pics top down;

The under deck of the bow - there is no reinforcement here, this a weak area.
I see mold all over the interior shots and a big crack in the liner.
That Keel winch is shot, even if it 'works' it is an accident waiting to happen.
Keel cable is no good either.
The Volcano tube has a PVC extension, nothing wrong with that but it appears the rubber part of the tube is too short.
The cockpit drain tubes are a mess and there is an obvious and dangerous eye-sore, the valve to the right in the pic is a non-marine use brass valve (ala Home Depot) and is corroded shut.
The wiring I can see is a hack job, there is probably an even greater mess I can't see.
The keel itself may have a descent shape, but it appears the hole for the pivot pin to pass through is a train wreck, rusted so bad chunks are gone making a large hole that the keel will bounce around on. This will require a major repair.
On the mast you have the old style cast aluminum spreader brackets. These will fail a break without notice, no to mention the spreaders themselves are probably corroded solid into the sockets. The replacement brackets from CD are $120 and a new set of spreader tubes is $110.

I say again, this boat is junk... barley worth a few parts that can be salvaged.

 

[Gene Neill]

I say again, this boat is junk... barley worth a few parts that can be salvaged.

I'm afraid I'd have to agree.

 

[Bino]

Oh boy! We bought one that looked like that and it is now on Mt. Baseline, which is another name for 'the dumb' around here. Run!!

 

[atrometer]

In FL and guess I paid way too much for my '76. Mine was in better shape BUT needed keel work, bottom job, some canvas, upholstery; and came with no motor or trailer for a mere $2500. But I wanted one - if you're willing to wait maybe 1/2 years, I'm sure you can find a great deal, but while you're looking I'm sailing (what's that worth?)

 

[RJD]

Part of the fun of owning a boat is fixing it up the way you want it, but yikes... If your goal is to sail rather than spending your time and money restoring, you should probably pass on this one.

 

[C22BC]

I bought my '74 6 hours south of where Iive for $3500.00 , came with a nice '94 ez loader galv trailer and a 2005 Honda 5hp 4 strk . Put her in the lake as soon as I got home , came out in the morning and there was at least 16 inches of water in it . Apparently the fibreglass around the keel lock bolt had delaminated over the winter , moisture had got in and froze . I let the guy I bought it from know via email and he paid for the repairs without question I have had no issues sense ... Integrity is indeed alive and well

 

[bushav]

Please don't buy that disaster. We want you here on the forum posting happy pictures of sunsets, margaritas, and almost naked women.

If you buy that boat you will be speaking venomous phrases about how sailing is the worst hobby ever.

I just bought a 1988 project for $1400 and we sailed her two weeks later. A lot of work done and "to be done" but at least the bones are excellent. That boat you posted pictures of is bad, bad, bad.

Lane
Hoosier Daddy fundraising chairman!

 

[tpenfield]

That boat has issues and with lots and lots of Catalina 22's in the market, there is really no need to pursue this one . . . so run

 

[DJM]

Keep looking there are good deals to be had, I paid $2,500 for a stock 1982 C-22 swing keel with nice galvanizes trailer after looking at them in my area for 3 years. You will find that there are a wide selection at the docks with no trailers. Look on (Sailing Texas boats for sale) to get a good idea of what's available. If your going to pay more then $1,500 there should be good sails and some replacement items needed, over $2,500 boat and trailer in good shape but will still need to be cleaned up/updated. NOTE; Be ready to change the wheel bearings and secure everything before you try to take the boat home it's no fun doing that on the side of the road. If your not a DIY kind of person you will want to save up and find a nice finished boat. If there is anything that you don't feel you can do (be careful), paying to have major work done will be more then what the boats worth if you ever decide to sell it.

 

[thetailwind]

Please don't buy that disaster. We want you here on the forum posting happy pictures of sunsets, margaritas, and almost naked women.

If you buy that boat you will be speaking venomous phrases about how sailing is the worst hobby ever.

I just bought a 1988 project for $1400 and we sailed her two weeks later. A lot of work done and "to be done" but at least the bones are excellent. That boat you posted pictures of is bad, bad, bad.

Lane
Hoosier Daddy fundraising chairman!

Wow, id love to find a new design for that price. I do not mind getting my hands dirty on the boat at all.