So I went sailing in the small craft advisory weather...

Admiral · Jun 17, 2014

Thumbs up to your son for knowing the limits of that vessel and the ability of the crew. But in all seriousness glad you made it back in safely. That must been a blast healing at that angle.

dfrancis23 · Jun 17, 2014

You took a complete newcomer out in an advisory?
Really not sure what to say other than glad you brought him back

THECUSCUS · Jun 17, 2014

I would have turned around and gone back in once I saw the sea state. I have found my boat to be stable with just the reefed main in those winds. Also, bringing the keel up alittle helps. You didn't say what your point of sail was? In heavy wind, a loose, luffing sail can be worse than a properly trimmed tight sail.

MrBill_FLL · Jun 18, 2014

other than not going out at all... which would have been the smart decision considering the crew.

Sail with reefed main only.

-but you have to have some speed to tack... easy to stall with only the main. you still need to spill air, but main doesn't flog as much.

also sail higher than normal.

25knts is plenty, but 2-3' is not that bad.

Justin_NSA · Jun 18, 2014

THECUSCUS said:
I would have turned around and gone back in once I saw the sea state. I have found my boat to be stable with just the reefed main in those winds. Also, bringing the keel up alittle helps. You didn't say what your point of sail was? In heavy wind, a loose, luffing sail can be worse than a properly trimmed tight sail.

I agree. The wind wouldn't bother me, we get that a lot, but the waves would bring me in with a small boat.
Reef early. The flatter and tighter the sail the better. Outhaul tight. Vang tight. Probably asking too much for the kids to be rail meat

Jackdaw · Jun 18, 2014

Get you all got back safely. Really.

You heard that there was a Small Craft Warning AFTER you got back? Didn't check beforehand?? You do understand you own a Small Craft, right??

The fact that other boats were out is NOT an indication that it is safe for your boat. That call has to be based on boat age/type/condition. And crew age and capability. I think you were wrong to go out at all.

There is nothing fun, sexy, safe or fast about a sailboat heeling 45 degrees. Its an indication that one or more things are totally wrong.

You should let you son be the skipper. At least he saw what was going on and made the safe call.

Chief RA · Jun 18, 2014

I agree with you Jackdaw. Chief

Tsatzsue · Jun 18, 2014

Turning around was good. I did the same this weekend leaving Westport. Two large rivers leave this port and discharge parallel to the beach. The kicker is you have to turn right after clearing the rocks right into the wind and seas. The outgoing current at 2-3 knts into the wind and incoming seas create a .5 mi rip that had my boat launching out of the water. It would land. crash down and ride, surf down the wave and into the next. The seas were just breaking so you had to power up the wave or it would push you backwards till you crested. I had just enough wind from the port to fill the sails which helped stabilize the boat. I didn't think the boat could withstand the pounding(3/4 of the hull was completely out of the water) so we timed the turn and surfed back. I was really humbled. We gave it two hours and pushed through again. That time we made it out. It wasn't the wave height. It was the combination of current wind direction and velocity as well as surf. To the right the waves were breaking on the shoal just 100 feet from us. It was hard to hear over the waves. Losing power would have been bad. I would never have done this if my family was on board. Just the guys last weekend and a big cooler. Believe it or not once we were clear I released the reef and flew the genoa due to the subsiding wind. There were swells but nothing like the mouth.

oldiesrocker2001 · Jun 18, 2014

Your son made the right call. Although there were no small craft advisorys in my area last weekend, I expected winds 5-10 knots. Since we only wanted a leisurely sail, I left with a reefed main and only unfurled 2/3 of my already smallish jib. Occasionally hit doldrums (just made it easier to hear cd player), and sailed into the less-protected area. There we found gusts over 20, and played around out there for a little while to see if my reef was more efficiently tuned than the last time I used it. While the reef line was set up better and sail point was more efficient, I suggested we head back into the protected area to relax before heading home. The boat's tougher than me, but my crew is not.

willsnow · Jun 18, 2014

i actually had sustained 20 kt winds last week blowing directly at our ramp as i was trying to come in from a night at anchor. i knew my outboard would have a hard time fighting that breeze to keep the boat from getting blown straight into my truck - or worse, a neighboring boat. so we sailed into the lee of a spit of land, threw out an anchor and waited till it died down... here in the mountains we say "if you dont like the weather, wait 15 minutes"
good - safe - sailing is all about smart decision making. glad you guys got in safe.
oh, and my boat had 2" of snow this morning. yuck

justsomeguy · Jun 18, 2014

willsnow said:
snip- here in the mountains we say "if you dont like the weather, wait 15 minutes"
-snip

I think that phrase is used just about everywhere!

To the OP, glad everything worked out.

How will you ever know your limits, if you don't push the envelope every now and then?

topcat0399 · Jun 18, 2014

So how does a person get heavy weather experience if they don't take the chance and navigate in heavy weather?

I agree that perhaps the newb shouldn't have been on board in those winds but - if you never take the opportunity to experience such conditions how can you gain confidence in yourself and your equipment?

Last weekend we experienced extreme conditions on our home lake like I have never seen before - but we went out anyway and I'm glad (so is the admiral) that we did. We learned a lot about how our craft handles in largish waves of short duration.

We want to be prepared for when we decide to take on bigger waters when we might get caught in something really nasty and there might not be a shoreline within timely reach.

I'm not saying that anyone should be foolish (Bounty Captain comes to mind) but even a new skydiver has to take his first solo leap and then continue to leap if they want to continue in the craft. You can't learn to do it by watching it on TV.

Jackdaw · Jun 18, 2014

topcat0399 said:
So how does a person get heavy weather experience if they don't take the chance and navigate in heavy weather?

Start out by knowing your limitations, and minimizing variables.

Make sure your boat is ready for the expected conditions, both in condition and type. Make sure your sails are up to the task. This means that they are sized for the conditions, ARE NOT BLOWN OUT, and are double reef-able on the main. Old blown out sails are terrible in big air, even when reefed you cannot de-power them.

PICK YOUR CREW WISELY. You should ideally be the least experienced person on the boat. No 13 never-sailed-before kids. People that can help and teach you, and not panic and do things wrong.

Baby steps. Start out double reefed and jib. Have someone calling puffs. Main should never be cleated. Sail close-hauled or bigger than a beam reach; easier on the boat. Boats hate to close reach in big air, so avoid that. Chicken gibe rather then risk a real gibe. Have a good MOB plan, including if the MOB is YOU.

walt · Jun 18, 2014

also depends on your "panic" threshold somewhat. My two kids have way different panic response. In the same situation, one kid is having a great time, the other kid is panicing a little. My opinion is that someone who has a high panic threshold is generally going to be safer in a given situation.

Also, most of the folks here are very much do it your self and tend to know the boats. I think this also helps.

Wilsnow, I dont know what elevation you are sailing (was that Bear Lake - I lived in Logan for a couple years) but my experinece is that the higher you go, the faster things change. Im usually sailing between over 5000 to over 9000 ft elevation and tend to sail a fair amount - so also get stuck in those wild conditions. I think a good anchor that is easy to deploy is a good thing - what comes up fast often goes back down fast - just drop an anchor and wait a half hour.

I probably would have done the same as the OP..

Nom De Guerre · Jun 18, 2014

I wouldn't have taken that crew out in those conditions.

I have sailed during SCAs, and would do it again by myself, or with crew who could manage if I became incapacitated.