Lubrication for Marelon Ball Valve

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May 1, 2013
2
Catalina 36 Mk 1 Valleyfield
Hi, I am new to this site and have a question for you guys.
My Ball valves are Marelon and original from Catalina and are getting stiff to open and close.
I was thinking to lubricate them with a seringe and mineral oil.
What do you think, any suggestions.
Thanks,
Rusty36
 
Mar 26, 2011
3,670
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
Hi, I am new to this site and have a question for you guys.
My Ball valves are Marelon and original from Catalina and are getting stiff to open and close.
I was thinking to lubricate them with a seringe and mineral oil.
What do you think, any suggestions.
Thanks,
Rusty36
Mineral oil won't last.

Water proof grease. Some folks like to take the hose off so they can get inside and outside. However, if that is not practical, you can do it from underneath on a 1/3 open valve with a screwdriver and patience.

It is also quite possible the problem is growth, particularly if not used much. Scrape out what you can first. Exercise them every few weeks if possible.
 
May 1, 2013
2
Catalina 36 Mk 1 Valleyfield
Thanks, I have some waterproof grease for my propeller, I will try that.
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Be very careful with those older marelon valve handles. Water proof grease and exercise of thevalves is a good start.
 
Mar 1, 2012
2,182
1961 Rhodes Meridian 25 Texas coast
Ya know- you CAN stick an old fashioned toilet bowl plunger over the opening from the outside if the boat is in the water. Then you can pull the hose, lube the fitting and replace the hose. Of course, you gotta get wet to do it- nicer in warm water-grin
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Can't you lube the valve closed, reinstall the hose and then exercise? Seems the plunger may not be necessary?
 
Nov 18, 2010
2,441
Catalina 310 Hingham, MA
Hi, I am new to this site and have a question for you guys.
My Ball valves are Marelon and original from Catalina and are getting stiff to open and close.
I was thinking to lubricate them with a seringe and mineral oil.
What do you think, any suggestions.
Thanks,
Rusty36
I would advise against lubricating them. These thru-hulls/Sea valves are not supposed to be lubricated, just exercised frequently.

I attached the product literature from Forespar that came with my manual.

Jesse
 

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Feb 6, 1998
11,701
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
I would advise against lubricating them. These thru-hulls/Sea valves are not supposed to be lubricated, just exercised frequently.

I attached the product literature from Forespar that came with my manual.

Jesse
That was their take in about 1990 somthing....... Many broken handles later........ Sadly they were wrong on this..... :cussing: Today they suggest lubricating the valves yearly or even bi-yearly and invested a lot of money in developing a proprietary grease for their valves. It is a great grease....

Forespar: "All marine valves require regular lubrication and regular activation of the handle. This application of MareLube should ideally occur and the beginning and end of every boating season. Apply liberally to valves seals, balls and any other moving parts."


Quite a change from the 90's....;)
 
Nov 18, 2010
2,441
Catalina 310 Hingham, MA
That was their take in about 1990 somthing....... Many broken handles later........ Sadly they were wrong on this..... :cussing: Today they suggest lubricating the valves yearly or even bi-yearly and invested a lot of money in developing a proprietary grease for their valves. It is a great grease....

Forespar: "All marine valves require regular lubrication and regular activation of the handle. This application of MareLube should ideally occur and the beginning and end of every boating season. Apply liberally to valves seals, balls and any other moving parts."

Quite a change from the 90's....;)
So I take it you recommend using this purpose made lubricant rather than a general purpose lubricant?

Can this be done in the water?
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,701
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
So I take it you recommend using this purpose made lubricant rather than a general purpose lubricant?

Can this be done in the water?
I like it because it is a lot thicker than regular synthetic grease. I even have it on my prop this year, as an experiment. (I fully expect it will fail, but I try something every year) It is just like the purpose made Spartan grease for tapered cone seacocks, purpose made. You can use another synthetic, non-petroleum base grease too. A can of Marelube will likely last you until you're 80 and I don't find it very expensive.... I have been using it since it came out and done about 50+ seacocks with it and it is still pretty full..
 
Jan 15, 2012
20
Dyer Dhow, Cats Paw 10 ft, 12 ft Montpelier, VT
I would go with maine Sails recommendation.

However, here are a few thoughts for you to consider regarding Forespar's Marelon seacocks.

First, Forespar calls Marelon a “polymer composite” and a 21st century material. The fact is Marelon is simply a Forespar trade name for Dupont Zytel 70G13L – BK 13% glass-filled carbon blacked 6/6 nylon (that’s not carbon fiber). The nylon 6/6 resin used in Marelon has been around for over 70 years. And the 70G13L – BK can be purchased by anyone. It’s an off the shelf material, nothing exotic.

It has a tensile strength (TS) of 17,000psi and a flexural modulus (FM) of 750,000psi. Both these values are measured “Dry as Molded” (DAM). The DAM measurement is important to remember, especially with nylon. Nylon is great in rode because in water it looses strength and elongates.

Many people have used Forespar’s Marelon Comparison table to show its strength as compared to bronze. This table has been on Forespar’s website for some 8 to 10 years, and in all that time it’s been in error, or so they claim.

Look at the following Forespar sites:

http://www.forespar.com/pdf/930136-m...-standards.pdf
http://www.forespar.com/pdf/930136-m...comparison.pdf

Besides the obvious mPa “error”, it should be psi, Forespar has provided us with two different values for Marelon. There’s a significant difference in values. Why? Dupont Zytel 70 series comes in several flavors, the 70G13L (13% glass) has a TS of 17,000psi and a FM of 750,000psi (DAM). The 70G33L (33% glass) has a TS of 27,000psi and a FM of 1,300,000psi. The 33% glass material makes a better comparison to bronze than the 13% glass don’t you think.

Third, “Marelon doesn't corrode.” This is an absolutely correct and totally useless statement by Forespar or anyone else. Metals corrode, plastics degrade, sadly we simply give Marelon a pass on corrosion and ignore degradation. Put your boat in the water with a properly installed bronze seacock and a Marelon seacock for 6 months what will happen, a 60% overall loss in TS and FM values of the Marelon.

The bronze seacock will still have a TS of 35,000psi and a FM of 15,000,000psi. The Marelon seacock and thru-hull will have a TS of 7,500psi and a TS of 250,000psi. This is a average 60% loss of strength. These figures are directly from the Dupont data tables. These Dupont/Marelon values are lower than good grade PVC.

Main Sail has done an excellent job testing these seacocks and putting some substance to this long running discussion. Even he will admit that his testing is less than perfect, however, they are a good representation of the facts. I wish Mainsail would explain about why he decided to do his tests, it’s all about impact.

The ABYC in H-27 and corresponding UL 1121 Seacocks and thru-hulls standards have a static load test but no test for impact. Yet impact is the issue of concern of all the marine experts, as Mainsail will attest.

I’ve done some impact testing on marine fittings and Forespar does not fair well at all. A 15 lb alternator or a 150 lb person hitting a thru-hull can do many more times the damage than a 500 lb hanging weight.

When it comes to the fact that some people have never had a problem with Marelon seacocks and thru-hulls is nice anecdotal information, but it’s not something you want to base your decision on. And Forespar seacocks have had a lot of problems that relate both to design and materials. Most people know about the problems with the Forespar 849 seacocks and the stem/handle breaking off. Forespar relegates that to a maintenance problem, that might be part of the issue, the real issue, I believe is a material and design problem. As for the 93 series they have two basic issues.

1. The thru-hulls are non-standard in ID and OD. On most of the units the OD is too big and the ID is too small.

2. The redesign creates a serious hazard. I’ll just say read the following:

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5078.15.html

http://www.c36ia.com/forums/showthread.php?t=868&page=3
 
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