Dock Line Decisions

centerline · Mar 3, 2013

I like the double braid.... as for strechability in the three strand, there really isnt too much due to its size and length of run between the cleats.
its more a matter of technique when routing the lines from the boat to the dock that will minimize the severe, sudden impacts on the lines and boat during wave/storm action....

I think the braided line is better for dock lines in every respect.....

Jackdaw · Mar 3, 2013

It's really a personal choice.

But it sounds like you are a good candidate for snubbers, or mooring line compensators. Good for both the boat, and the dock.

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|10391|296895|321828&id=149568

Warren Milberg · Mar 3, 2013

I personally don't think it makes much difference as long as the lines chosen are the right size for your boat, have chafe protection where needed, and are in good condition.

tkanzler · Mar 3, 2013

I prefer three-strand for a number of reasons, including slip resistance on skinny stainless 'yacht' cleats. I've found my braided lines slowly getting longer, so I've had to terminate the bitter end on something not already occupied, like a winch drum (just a large loop plopped over the drum 'just in case'). Three-strand doesn't do that. It wasn't a problem on other boats, with different shaped cleats, though.

Three-strand is also cheaper, and yes, I've had my permanent braided lines stolen while I was out.

I can also splice three-strand very quickly, so I can customize them to any need.

I also use very long lines for transient work, as I never know what I'm going to need to do. I have some giant (3/4" or larger, 50 ft long or more) megabraid that came with another boat that I use for launching and hauling my bitty trailer boat, as it's real easy on the hands, and I already own it. But I like to use lengths of raw three-strand for transient dock lines, and I often use a single long length for stern and forward spring and even bow, all in one line, depending on the dock arrangements.

I don't bother with colors, as they're more likely to be stolen, and I just don't care about color anyway. Dock lines are utility lines, dirty and hardworking, and it gets expensive replacing them every so many years as it is.

Ron20324 · Mar 3, 2013

centerline said:
.... as for strechability in the three strand, there really isnt too much due to its size and length of run.....

Doesn't stretch much? I had a spring line on my O222 that served as an "emergency brake" for coming into the slip. Once I came in with a tailwind, and faster than I normally do. I didn't panic, because I had the "emergency brake" spring line on. That 3-strand stretched enough that the bow hit the dock. With my B323, I started my engine in the slip. I put it in gear to rev up, and it plowed into the dock in spite of a (previously) well laid out spring line. Lesson learned. West Marine shows the braided stretch at 6 to 10 percent, the 3-strand at 10 to 16 percent. The stretch is what you need, to lessen shock loads to your boat/cleats. I'm sure the dock can handle it.

centerline · Mar 3, 2013

Ron20324 said:
Doesn't stretch much? I had a spring line on my O222 that served as an "emergency brake" for coming into the slip. Once I came in with a tailwind, and faster than I normally do. I didn't panic, because I had the "emergency brake" spring line on. That 3-strand stretched enough that the bow hit the dock. With my B323, I started my engine in the slip. I put it in gear to rev up, and it plowed into the dock in spite of a (previously) well laid out spring line. Lesson learned. West Marine shows the braided stretch at 6 to 10 percent, the 3-strand at 10 to 16 percent. The stretch is what you need, to lessen shock loads to your boat/cleats. I'm sure the dock can handle it.

yes, the longer the line, the more inches it will strech, but my comment was made in relation to securing the boat to the dock.....

even a chain will strech if you overload it enough

although it wont return to its previous length

jimmcgee · Mar 3, 2013

I like braided. It's easier on the hands and doesn't "harden up" the way three strand will in salt water. I haven't had the problem that TKanzler has had with braided slipping on cleats, though by the end of the season the wraps around my pilings will be pretty stiff.

I used snubbers when we were in a marina with a lot of wave/wind action and they did the job.

Braided will stretch in storm conditions. You'd be surprised how much. 10% stretch means a 25' line will stretch two and a half feet! When a strong fall storm is forecast I'll double up my 1/2" lines with 5/8" braided storm lines. I tie the 5/8 a little slack compared to the 1/2", so as they start to stretch the heavier lines take up some of the load, working like a snubber that increases the line strength.

I also think braided looks better. Three strand can get pretty grotty looking.

Jerry Clark H356 SV Persi · Mar 3, 2013

I use braided for the floating docks I am on in Kentucky Lake. I am on my second set and starting year 11. I started with 3 strand, changed to braided and will replace with braided in a year or two.. Unless you are in a mighty rough marina, you won't have too much shock load, most wear is chafe from constant motion. Brided doesn't get as stiff as three strand and when it does, just dip it in the water and it is easy to handle. I don't think the technical and strength issues mean much on such short lengths. My longest line is probably 15 to 20 feet as I spring from the center cleat on the boat to the front and rear dock cleat and from each of those to either the rear boat cleat or the front boat cleat respectively making a W if looked down on. The difference in stretch from the longest line from braided to nylon would be less than 1/2" on my H356. If you have a much longer boat or different scenerio, then maybe it would matter, but I doubt it.

Don S/V ILLusion · Mar 3, 2013

Bad Obsession said:
Has anyone used chain to braided eyes on their dock lines to prevent chafe? West marine was talking about this in that video and I can't remember EVER seeing that on a dock.

It isn't a bad consideration at my dock, but I still like having a little play in the lines so I can adjust them a foot or two if a storm surge is coming. I guess you could make the chain adjustable but that may be an expensive pain in the butt!

If you can figure out a way to preclude simply moving the chafe problem from the cleats to the rope/chain joint, that would be a more popular method.

soldier1964 · Mar 3, 2013

I like the three strands better mainly because I splice my own eyes, and even spliced two seperate line together for a guy at the marina. I use the heavy three strands for making emergency bumpers . something I picked up working on the river barges. there is a length of braided below,about 25', that I use just for odds and ends.

Tom J · Mar 3, 2013

Don S/V ILLusion said:
If you can figure out a way to preclude simply moving the chafe problem from the cleats to the rope/chain joint, that would be a more popular method.

Running chains from the dock out to the mooring lines is common here at Maalaea Harbor on Maui. The swells coming from the ocean into this little man-made harbor are constant. Some of the larger boats use tires as snubbers. Others use large metal springs. Of course, all bets are off when a tsunami hits!

Joe · Mar 3, 2013

Three strand: Easy to splice; length of your choice; less chafe; doesn't pick up dirt as much;.... most important.... easier to flat coil on a nonskid concrete dock surface. (braided will get fuzzy and snag on any surface imperfection when you're squaring away your lines.)

Rick D · Mar 3, 2013

Just Went Through This...

...but I can't make up my mind. I have used three strand for a very long time, but I have had three sets of braided. I like that the three strand abraids little. The double braid chafes a lot. The braided looks better, coils well and hands better. However, sometimes it's nice having a stiff dock line for handing off. Double braid also collects dirt easier. I also use fore and aft spring lines on both sides.

Anyhow, I just ordered a new set of colored double braid. I am going to do chafe protection for the boat cleats by whipping the loop in 3/16 nylon cord. Works well. For the dock cleat, I have some flexible tubing I will place over the line.

These are my 'home' dock lines. They stay on the dock. For travel, I use a three-strand less expensive line. I keep six aboard, supplemented by an old 60' fifty-year old 'Gold 'N Braid' three strand poly 7/16 line that was once my jib sheet on a boat I owned 40 years ago. Talk about stretch! Good spring line tho.

rpwillia · Mar 3, 2013

Depends

Matt, I have travel lines that are braided line and I keep them on the boat. I have permanent lines that I use all the time and leave them on the dock when I go out. These are made out of 3 strand where I figured out approximately how much I needed, got a single length from West Marine and using my hot knife and skill

created custom lengths with an eye splice on each end so that each line just slips on over the cleats on the boat (Admiral does that). In that way the boat is exactly in the slip where I want it, and the Admiral does not have to try and figure anything out. :dance:

It is a little more work, but since I can do an eye splice with my eyes closed it is worth it. Also makes it faster getting out on the water and back in.

I recall you have fixed docks down there (we have floating docks in Quantico) so you may have to work it a little different and account for the tides. I did see in Alexandria where at Old Dominion Boat Club that a lot of boat slips have those metal rods and rings on their fixed docks that allow the boat to float up and down with the tide. Otherwise you could use your existing dock line lengths as guides to do what I did.

BTW, I will be down in CBYC for Memorial Day.

Benny17441 · Mar 5, 2013

I'm not one for splitting hairs. If replaced timely either will do the job. Chafe is the greater malady.

dehler25 · Mar 5, 2013

I like that small amount of give that the three strand has, it takes the jerkiness out of any movement. I guess i do it different as I use braid for my home springs and stranded for bow and stern.