I have a 3-cylinder Yanmar that doesn't crank every time I push the start button. If I let off the button and press again it starts just fine. Somestimes I have to press the start button 3 or 4 times before it cranks. I had the same exact problem on my previous Yanmar 2 cylinder. It must be either 1. a bad starter solenoid or 2. a bad spot in the starter motor windings or brushes. Anyone else had this probem and solved it?
Yanmar starting problem
- Thread starter agaliha
- Start date
- Status
Starter switch wiring...
This seems to be a common problem on Yanmars. I have it from time-to-time on my 4 cylinder 4JH-TE. I have done a whole bunch of research on it, and the general consensus is that the problem is caused by the wiring to the starter solenoid. Yanmar starter solenoids have two windings, a high current coil that pulls the solenoid in (and then is turned off), and a lower current "holding" coil that holds the plunger in place. The result is a brief high current spike that happens as you push the starter button. If the wiring to the starter button is too long, too smaller gage, or the starter switch has developed some contact resistance, the added resistance will not allow sufficient current through the solenoid to pull-in adequately during the initial current spike (Ohm's Law). The general consensus (which I have not yet adopted) is to install an automotive type relay close to the engine, and use heavier gage wire from the battery, through the relay contacts, to the starter solenoid. In other words, the starter switch merely closes the relay, which then supplies the initial current surge through a low resistance path. Whether this is your problem I can't say, but there are numerous threads around on various forums that indicate that this is the fix. It's on my "to-do" list...
This seems to be a common problem on Yanmars. I have it from time-to-time on my 4 cylinder 4JH-TE. I have done a whole bunch of research on it, and the general consensus is that the problem is caused by the wiring to the starter solenoid. Yanmar starter solenoids have two windings, a high current coil that pulls the solenoid in (and then is turned off), and a lower current "holding" coil that holds the plunger in place. The result is a brief high current spike that happens as you push the starter button. If the wiring to the starter button is too long, too smaller gage, or the starter switch has developed some contact resistance, the added resistance will not allow sufficient current through the solenoid to pull-in adequately during the initial current spike (Ohm's Law). The general consensus (which I have not yet adopted) is to install an automotive type relay close to the engine, and use heavier gage wire from the battery, through the relay contacts, to the starter solenoid. In other words, the starter switch merely closes the relay, which then supplies the initial current surge through a low resistance path. Whether this is your problem I can't say, but there are numerous threads around on various forums that indicate that this is the fix. It's on my "to-do" list...
Same problem
I have developed the same problem with my 3GM30F. Do an archive search and you will find this issue addressed in older threads. There is also some discussion on it on the Torreson Marine Diesel site which is linked in some of the earlier threads here. I have a friend with the same model boat/engine and he has also had this problem. He replaced the starter a few weeks ago and it DID NOT solve the problem. I did some poking around on my boat this past week and found at least three disconnects in the wire from the button to the starter (2 bullet type and 1 spade connector). I pulled each apart and cleaned them with emery cloth so there's a good clean connection. I also gently crimped the female end of the spade connector (this one is on the wire about 4 inches from the starter itself) so that it has a tight "grip" on the male end of the connector. I don't know if this solved the problem yet, but my boat is a '99 and this summer was the first time this has happened, suggesting to me that the problem happens with age, i.e., corrosion of the connectors. Another fix would be to run an uninterrupted wire from the button to the starter, and just disconnect the old wire in at least one place. Label the old wire and new one for future reference. FYI, there should be two wires coming out of the back of the button switch, one jumps over a short way to the key switch and this is the wire that supplies 12V+ to the button. The other wire (mine is white) weaves its way through the wiring harness and down to the starter. Just trace it from the button switch and you'll find all the connectors. Turn all BATT masters OFF before you start doing this. As a last resort if you can't get the button to work when out on the water, and IF you have enough space around your engine to SAFELY reach the starter, you can always start the engine by disconnecting the spade connector near the starter I mentioned earlier, and touch the short end (male end, wire coming from the starter's small terminal) to the large BATT terminal lug right on the starter. That applies 12V from the batt directly to the starter solenoid and will engage the starter. DO NOT DO THIS WITH LOOSE CLOTHING OR DANGLING OBJECTS ANYWHERE NEAR THE ENGINE! KEEP YOUR HANDS, FACE, AND BODY AWAY FROM THE BELTS AND PULLEYS!
I have developed the same problem with my 3GM30F. Do an archive search and you will find this issue addressed in older threads. There is also some discussion on it on the Torreson Marine Diesel site which is linked in some of the earlier threads here. I have a friend with the same model boat/engine and he has also had this problem. He replaced the starter a few weeks ago and it DID NOT solve the problem. I did some poking around on my boat this past week and found at least three disconnects in the wire from the button to the starter (2 bullet type and 1 spade connector). I pulled each apart and cleaned them with emery cloth so there's a good clean connection. I also gently crimped the female end of the spade connector (this one is on the wire about 4 inches from the starter itself) so that it has a tight "grip" on the male end of the connector. I don't know if this solved the problem yet, but my boat is a '99 and this summer was the first time this has happened, suggesting to me that the problem happens with age, i.e., corrosion of the connectors. Another fix would be to run an uninterrupted wire from the button to the starter, and just disconnect the old wire in at least one place. Label the old wire and new one for future reference. FYI, there should be two wires coming out of the back of the button switch, one jumps over a short way to the key switch and this is the wire that supplies 12V+ to the button. The other wire (mine is white) weaves its way through the wiring harness and down to the starter. Just trace it from the button switch and you'll find all the connectors. Turn all BATT masters OFF before you start doing this. As a last resort if you can't get the button to work when out on the water, and IF you have enough space around your engine to SAFELY reach the starter, you can always start the engine by disconnecting the spade connector near the starter I mentioned earlier, and touch the short end (male end, wire coming from the starter's small terminal) to the large BATT terminal lug right on the starter. That applies 12V from the batt directly to the starter solenoid and will engage the starter. DO NOT DO THIS WITH LOOSE CLOTHING OR DANGLING OBJECTS ANYWHERE NEAR THE ENGINE! KEEP YOUR HANDS, FACE, AND BODY AWAY FROM THE BELTS AND PULLEYS!
Correction
I should have said my friend replaced the STARTER BUTTON a few weeks ago and it did not solve the problem. He also replaced the solenoid a couple years ago on the advice of the dealer or Yanmar shop here, but that didn't solve it either as the problem came back.
I should have said my friend replaced the STARTER BUTTON a few weeks ago and it did not solve the problem. He also replaced the solenoid a couple years ago on the advice of the dealer or Yanmar shop here, but that didn't solve it either as the problem came back.
And I thought I was having battery problems!
Thanks, guys! My 13 year old three cylinder Yanmar (1300 hours) does the same thing....I thought it was low battery powereven though they read fine. Thanks for the answer!
Thanks, guys! My 13 year old three cylinder Yanmar (1300 hours) does the same thing....I thought it was low battery powereven though they read fine. Thanks for the answer!
This is a common problem
...with aging Yanmars. After replacing the starter button on my Yanmar, wondering if the starter or solenoid were going bad (they weren't) cleaning and/or replacing some connections in the wiring harness (worth doing in any event), and still having the same problem. I solved it by adding a 12vdc relay to the solenoid. I continue to believe the real culprit here is that as the entire wiring harness ages, impedence increases and the starter just can't get the necessary juice to work. I took a shortcut fix with a $12 relay. Others, like Fred Ficara, bit the bullet and replaced the whole wiring harness, a better but more expensive and time consuming fix. Whatever works, works.
...with aging Yanmars. After replacing the starter button on my Yanmar, wondering if the starter or solenoid were going bad (they weren't) cleaning and/or replacing some connections in the wiring harness (worth doing in any event), and still having the same problem. I solved it by adding a 12vdc relay to the solenoid. I continue to believe the real culprit here is that as the entire wiring harness ages, impedence increases and the starter just can't get the necessary juice to work. I took a shortcut fix with a $12 relay. Others, like Fred Ficara, bit the bullet and replaced the whole wiring harness, a better but more expensive and time consuming fix. Whatever works, works.
Great answers! I feel better already.
Thanks. Sometimes it's just good to know you are not crazy. Sounds like this is a very common problem. (Maybe Yanmar should read this). The archive thread is excellent, too. Happy sailing (and motoring). Agaliha (Cherokee for "Sunny Day")
Thanks. Sometimes it's just good to know you are not crazy. Sounds like this is a very common problem. (Maybe Yanmar should read this). The archive thread is excellent, too. Happy sailing (and motoring). Agaliha (Cherokee for "Sunny Day")
My Experience
I have a 1996 H376. Read all the postings about non-starting on all models but it had never happened to me - until - last weekend. I decided to fit a completely separate push button and wiring. This was to be down below and the wires were to be connected from the positive feed to the starter, via the button and then to the solenoid. Thus bypassing the ignition switch completely. This is why it was to be below deck and on the side of the engine casing in the aft cabin. The connections were VERY awkward to get to and whilst I was feeling around, blind, for the small connector to the solenoid it just fell off in my hand. All that had happened was that it was a very loose fit and it was not clamping properly onto the spade terminal. I just squeezed it up with pliers. Problem solved. Now I wonder how many starters and solenoids have been changed just because the Yanmar connector goes slack.
I have a 1996 H376. Read all the postings about non-starting on all models but it had never happened to me - until - last weekend. I decided to fit a completely separate push button and wiring. This was to be down below and the wires were to be connected from the positive feed to the starter, via the button and then to the solenoid. Thus bypassing the ignition switch completely. This is why it was to be below deck and on the side of the engine casing in the aft cabin. The connections were VERY awkward to get to and whilst I was feeling around, blind, for the small connector to the solenoid it just fell off in my hand. All that had happened was that it was a very loose fit and it was not clamping properly onto the spade terminal. I just squeezed it up with pliers. Problem solved. Now I wonder how many starters and solenoids have been changed just because the Yanmar connector goes slack.
Simple solution
Wire a second starter switch near the engine compartment. I put mine on the starboard side of the conpanyonway stairs. It is a little inconvenient but works every time and only cost $15 for the switch and wire. Took about a 1/2 hour to install. The problem is the number of connections between the battery terminal and the starter solenoid "start" terminal. I counted 12. You are usually allowed 0.2 volts drop per connection but that assumes you don't have a lot of connections also. So with 12 sucking up 0.2 each that is 2.4 volts drop right off the bat or 12.2-2.4=9.8 volts getting to the start terminal. Needles to say you have to have all the terminals in good working order to get the thing to operate at all. Add a little rust and it just will not work at all. Another solution is to "hot wire" the starter switch from the battery selector switch to the engine panel start switch and then to the solenoid start terminal. That gets your connections down to 5 total. But it is a real pain to do because of the routing of the wires. Roosa Family TRITIUM
Wire a second starter switch near the engine compartment. I put mine on the starboard side of the conpanyonway stairs. It is a little inconvenient but works every time and only cost $15 for the switch and wire. Took about a 1/2 hour to install. The problem is the number of connections between the battery terminal and the starter solenoid "start" terminal. I counted 12. You are usually allowed 0.2 volts drop per connection but that assumes you don't have a lot of connections also. So with 12 sucking up 0.2 each that is 2.4 volts drop right off the bat or 12.2-2.4=9.8 volts getting to the start terminal. Needles to say you have to have all the terminals in good working order to get the thing to operate at all. Add a little rust and it just will not work at all. Another solution is to "hot wire" the starter switch from the battery selector switch to the engine panel start switch and then to the solenoid start terminal. That gets your connections down to 5 total. But it is a real pain to do because of the routing of the wires. Roosa Family TRITIUM
Do the simple things first
Clean ALL the connections, my problem was just a dirty ground wire fitting on the engine end of the battery cable, where it fastends to the engine. Cleaned the cable and engine surface with a wire brush, cleaned the bolt, has been fine for 5 years! Always starts at first push of the button, on one battery. Before I needed both batteries, and several button pushes.
Clean ALL the connections, my problem was just a dirty ground wire fitting on the engine end of the battery cable, where it fastends to the engine. Cleaned the cable and engine surface with a wire brush, cleaned the bolt, has been fine for 5 years! Always starts at first push of the button, on one battery. Before I needed both batteries, and several button pushes.
Ignorence is Bliss!
I think I may have this problem. I just thought that I wasn't hitting the center of the start button. It always starts but it may be the second or third press. Now I guess I will have to find the clean the connections for he solonoid, switch, key, buzzer, warning lights, ground terminal and whatever else. Tim, can you elaborate about the disconnects. Why was anything in that circuit working at all? I'm not electrically inclined. And Bill - 12 connections?! Was this factory wiring? If an auxillary switch is wired in it would be in parallel with the existing switch? A heavier wire from the battery to the solonoid would lower resistance and increase amperage flow or voltage? If I were shopping for a auxillary switch what should be the amperage and voltage ratings. What gauge wire? Drew H 356
I think I may have this problem. I just thought that I wasn't hitting the center of the start button. It always starts but it may be the second or third press. Now I guess I will have to find the clean the connections for he solonoid, switch, key, buzzer, warning lights, ground terminal and whatever else. Tim, can you elaborate about the disconnects. Why was anything in that circuit working at all? I'm not electrically inclined. And Bill - 12 connections?! Was this factory wiring? If an auxillary switch is wired in it would be in parallel with the existing switch? A heavier wire from the battery to the solonoid would lower resistance and increase amperage flow or voltage? If I were shopping for a auxillary switch what should be the amperage and voltage ratings. What gauge wire? Drew H 356
Another Suggestion
When you turn the key on my boat, the fans kick on as they are connected to the start switch. In the past, when totally frustrated, I pulled the fan wires off, hit the push button and it started every time. I plan to run a new, larger AWG wire and add a toggle switch for the fans ( to turn them off when starting).
When you turn the key on my boat, the fans kick on as they are connected to the start switch. In the past, when totally frustrated, I pulled the fan wires off, hit the push button and it started every time. I plan to run a new, larger AWG wire and add a toggle switch for the fans ( to turn them off when starting).
Yacht & Tractor Club
May not work on your boats, But it damn sure did cure my Yanmar tractor! Every time the battery got a little low, it burned the commutator. I have armatures here with gaps melted out of the copper commutator because of my hard headedness, thinking "it's gonna start". It didn't. And I got to pull the starter again. At least it's easier on a tractor than a boat, but I've done this 8 or 10 times. Do not crank these engines with low batteries. And if you suspect a "dead spot", it's probably worn brushes. A very light tap on the outer end of the motor housing will often times cause contact to be re-established an get you out of trouble. Don't depend on it always and if it doesn't work after a couple of tries, give it up- it's an emergency measure. And now back to curing my main problem. I also have Nissan pick-up trucks. Which means I have Nissan pick-up truck starters. Imagine my great surprise and joy when I discovered that my $180.00 Nissan pick-up truck starters would replace my $400.00 Yanmar tractor starters and last longer and crank faster. One man's experience, your mileage may vary in the bilge. Danny - of recent myopia frustration. Anybody know what that tattoo is ?
May not work on your boats, But it damn sure did cure my Yanmar tractor! Every time the battery got a little low, it burned the commutator. I have armatures here with gaps melted out of the copper commutator because of my hard headedness, thinking "it's gonna start". It didn't. And I got to pull the starter again. At least it's easier on a tractor than a boat, but I've done this 8 or 10 times. Do not crank these engines with low batteries. And if you suspect a "dead spot", it's probably worn brushes. A very light tap on the outer end of the motor housing will often times cause contact to be re-established an get you out of trouble. Don't depend on it always and if it doesn't work after a couple of tries, give it up- it's an emergency measure. And now back to curing my main problem. I also have Nissan pick-up trucks. Which means I have Nissan pick-up truck starters. Imagine my great surprise and joy when I discovered that my $180.00 Nissan pick-up truck starters would replace my $400.00 Yanmar tractor starters and last longer and crank faster. One man's experience, your mileage may vary in the bilge. Danny - of recent myopia frustration. Anybody know what that tattoo is ?
Common Yanmar problem ....
.... especially with those that have an in-line fuse in the starter-solenoid circuit. The fuse holder is usually mounted ON the engine at the 'aft end' and can develop corrosion (hence high resistance) IN the connectors of the fuse holder since the OEM wiring is usually non-tinned wire. The fuse is in-line with the start button and the primary lead (small wire) to the starter solenoid. If the engine has such a fuse, doesnt start when pushing the start button, run a temporary jumper from the HOT (BIG) cable of the starter and 'momentarily' touch to the (small) screw connector on the solenoid (use a screwdriver, etc.). If the engine (solenoid/starter) now starts easily ..... replace the whole fuse holder with a proper marine grade (tinned) fuse holder. You may want to rewire the whole pushbutton to solenoid circuit with 'tinned' wire.
.... especially with those that have an in-line fuse in the starter-solenoid circuit. The fuse holder is usually mounted ON the engine at the 'aft end' and can develop corrosion (hence high resistance) IN the connectors of the fuse holder since the OEM wiring is usually non-tinned wire. The fuse is in-line with the start button and the primary lead (small wire) to the starter solenoid. If the engine has such a fuse, doesnt start when pushing the start button, run a temporary jumper from the HOT (BIG) cable of the starter and 'momentarily' touch to the (small) screw connector on the solenoid (use a screwdriver, etc.). If the engine (solenoid/starter) now starts easily ..... replace the whole fuse holder with a proper marine grade (tinned) fuse holder. You may want to rewire the whole pushbutton to solenoid circuit with 'tinned' wire.
- Status