Wonder Where The Boats Went?

[Gunni]

Doesn't the State of California have an abandoned boat program? The word was they would require that the boat be cut up to prevent future abandonment.

Years ago I lived in a "hanger queen" in the marina, way cheaper than dirt living, but the boat was not seaworthy. In fact it was an eyesore. The yachties hated it, and I suspect now it would be condemned and ordered out.

 

[LANCE ON CLOUD NINE]

loss of boats related to loss of interested sailors?

Anymore it is interesting how few people will entertain having any hobby that requires focus beyond a single day of participation. Probably related to the ease of the internet, but many see maintaining an ongoing "to-do" list as a major hassle.
For me, a long term relationship with a boat it part of the fun!

 

[Gunni]

I bought my boat from a guy who gave up on sailing because his kids hated it. First thing I did was remove the TeeVee and game console. Tossed the framed pictures hanging on the bulkheads, rolled up the carpeting and unfurled the like-new sails.

 

[25yearslater]

I received an Email this week informing me that after experiencing the thrill of sailing this family of four is looking at learning to sail. Perhaps if more folks would take the time to expose more people to the fun the population of sailors would increase. How many of us just decided to sail? I would wager someone took the time to let us in on the secret.

 

[FastOlson]

Thinking about Rick's original question...
It seems hard to believe that the numbers of parted-out boats mentioned could even make a dent in the vast quantities in SoCal.
Given that there are more vacancies in the large private marinas here than there were before the recession, I am not convinced that they came to Oregon. But then my opinion is not like any sort of "proof" of anything!

FWIW, our little YC here, with its 150 boat moorage, has about 3 to 8 boats on the moorage waiting list all the time, for the last 6 or 7 years.

Different topic - California Property taxes and the complaints about being billing directly for 'em. I wonder if there's some business reason for putting them on the moorage billing as a separate line item?
Since everyone is paying, it would seem like it's just a normal part of the overhead that goes into the slip billing, like maintenance, most utilities, security, and debt service.

Or, maybe it's kinda sorta like the olden days before we built our house and were renters -- we knew other renters that were somehow sure that when we had our own house we would have to pay property taxes and that they preferred renting because they did not pay that tax.
I tried to explain that their landlord was getting the tax $$ from them, but some of 'em did not seem to understand it.
(sigh)

Quite a topic, with many facets.

Cheers,
Loren

 

[wufibugs]

It is probably a combination of many factors. First, the character of beach/water recreation has changed. Everyone is aware that exposure to the sun is dangerous; the young are less inclined to let that influence them, but once a person turns 30, that becomes a factor in how they view this kind of recreation. Similarly, the character of water recreation among those willing to ignore the risks of skin cancer has also changed. Kids seem to feel that surfing and parasailing are more thrilling, cheaper, and easier than dealing with a Hobie. You just pop the board on the roof rack any time you have the yen and head to a beach where like minded gather. The jet ski is cheaper and more thrilling than a small power boat.
More than likely, if you were not brought up with boating, few will not be attracted to it when they can finally afford it. If you have a large home or large lot [not a condo], you may have room for a trailerable boat. However in most urban areas new tract homes really don't have backyards big enough even for a small trailerable boat. To afford most homes, both spouses/parents have to be wage earners. This cuts down on recreation time. Families spending 60% of their income on shelter have little discretionary money.
The fact is that boating is expensive and will only be pursued by those with a passion for it such that the desire to be on the water far outdistances the competition for my limited recreation time and money.
I came pitifully late to sailing though my kids grew up on the sand. As grown children they love to be out on Windmistress, but I pretty sure they will never buy a boat or become either avid or even part-time sailors. My daughter, who did a Caribbean boat charter with her boyfriend was glad she did it ... once. Boating cannot compete for her recreational or travel dollar.
Finally, there is always a lag in the supply-demand system. Marinas do not reduce slip fees just because they find themselves with vacancies. It would probably have to be a long term trend to have that effect. Even then, they probably realize it is unlikely reducing slip fees will increase occupancy. I just don't think that factors into whether people buy a boat or not. My guess is that an awful lot of people buy the boat and then suffer sticker shock when they find out how much it will cost them every month to put it somewhere. And for those who do consider the slip fee, it probably influences how big, but not whether they buy.

 

[Old Skool Neil]

I think more to the original question, just a little bit ago boats were here, now they're not and for the most part we're not talking trailer sailors.

I've seen it too. About three years ago we had an extensive but run down marina complex across the channel from us. Everybody was evicted for redevelopment but to where? There were hundreds of boats involved. The redevelopment is now complete and some have moved back but there are plenty of vacancies. About the same time a marina deep inside L.A. Harbor closed (Colonial) due to unpaid harbor lease fees. Maybe another 50 boats evicted and a ton more vacancies across the road. Where did the boats go?

 

[Skipper]

Different topic - California Property taxes and the complaints about being billing directly for 'em. I wonder if there's some business reason for putting them on the moorage billing as a separate line item?
Since everyone is paying, it would seem like it's just a normal part of the overhead that goes into the slip billing, like maintenance, most utilities, security, and debt service.

Nope. It was every bit as odd as it sounds. They charged us a quoted slip fee for years, even decades for others, with the associated periodic increases for inflation. Then, Orange County (which owns the harbor) suddenly came up with the idea that we should pay property tax too. I can't recall if it was "the" property tax or some invention of a new property tax. Dana Point boaters actually formed some sort of association to fight it; they were making progress I think, but we left, so I don't know what the status is now. It's just a point of reference as to one of the many ways CA targets boaters.

Edit: Here is the website for the association: http://www.boaters4dph.com
The tax is called the "Possessory Interest Tax".

 

[Old Skool Neil]

I knew a member of the Orange County Grand Jury and they were looking into the questionable practices of both Dana Point and Newport Harbors a few years ago. Don't know the outcome though.

I wouldn't paint all California marina operations with a broad brush. Dana Point is if not unique at least a rare situation that as stated above attracted unwanted attention. I'm in Cabrillo Marina in outer Los Angeles Harbor. The marina operator's fees and taxes are built into the slip rent with the single exception of electricity, it's separately metered. My slip rent has increased once in 10 years and it was less than 10 bucks a month. I pay separate personal property tax to the County of Los Angeles annually, about $30.

My point is what goes on in Dana Point doesn't elsewhere, at least not where I've been for the past decade.

 

[zeehag]

wow..colonial is closed?' where did lupe·s crane go..he was a good haulout option for many ....
i was in lighthouse, just next door, for a year or so --my first marina and first boat, in 1990..lol
in kali all have to pay property tax. for long time many of us got away without paying that. now we are all accountable for our lil piece of unsecured muck under our boats...someone has to pày for the schools and police and .......

 

[Old Skool Neil]

If you mean the WW2 crane with "Eddie's" crudely hand painted on the side it's still where it was - East of Lighthouse at Cerritos Anchorage (just a name, not really an anchorage). Colonial was next door to Lighthouse on the West side, had a nice little store and the coldest ice in town. The boatyard was known as "Augie's" with actual ways cars. Augie passed, his kids tried running it and well, you know the outcome.

I was at Lighthouse a year or so before you with my just finished Westsail 32, first slip in front of the parking lot.

 

[zeehag]

othatsright,,augies yard where the awesome light blue trimmed olympian 34 and the biiig black hulled hulk of a ct 48...stood so long.....lol

what happened to the kids of augie who were running yard and marina and haul yard..it even ad a railway..old and decrepit, but it worked when i left

and stu the cocatoo or wtf large white talking bird in the lil chandlery...

 

[Old Skool Neil]

andwhat happened to the kids of augie who were running yard and marina and haul yard..it even ad a railway..old and decrepit, but it worked when i left

I cannot answer with any real details or perhaps even accuracy but the 'kids', for whatever reason, ran afoul of the Port Authority over fees and guess who won that one? I know it went on for quite a while.

The other side of Cerritos Channel where Matson shipping is currently was a major WW2 shipyard (California Shipbuilding) run by Henry Kaiser where they produced something like 300 Liberty ships (10 or so each month, incredible!). Yep, lotta history in the area.

Here's a Los Angeles Times article I found from 6 years ago, before the ultimate demise. BTW, it's pertinent to this thread too.
http://www.yachtauctions.com/files/articles/2009-boating-LATimes.pdf

 

[Kestle]

I knew a member of the Orange County Grand Jury and they were looking into the questionable practices of both Dana Point and Newport Harbors a few years ago. Don't know the outcome though. I wouldn't paint all California marina operations with a broad brush. Dana Point is if not unique at least a rare situation that as stated above attracted unwanted attention. I'm in Cabrillo Marina in outer Los Angeles Harbor. The marina operator's fees and taxes are built into the slip rent with the single exception of electricity, it's separately metered. My slip rent has increased once in 10 years and it was less than 10 bucks a month. I pay separate personal property tax to the County of Los Angeles annually, about $30. My point is what goes on in Dana Point doesn't elsewhere, at least not where I've been for the past decade.

I' there, on aMacGregor 25 in mast up at CBYC. Say hello if you see me by the cranes there.



Jeff

 

[zeehag]

dayummmm they were an institution there.. forever, even.. wow....