Windlass Failure: 2008 Beneteau 43

[DPW]

Recently my windless failed, had to manually pull up the anchor from 110ft! I replaced the soelnoid and the switch but still no luck. I have power to the high voltage side of the solenoid but not sure what voltage geadings I should be seeing on the low voltage side of the solenoid. My thinking is that the problem is with the signal from the engine to the solenoid, which likely involves the solenoid in the engine. Any suggestions about how to trouble shoot this are welcome.

Thanks,
DW

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

I have power to the high voltage side of the solenoid but not sure what voltage geadings I should be seeing on the low voltage side of the solenoid.

1. Get the manual for your windlass and READ IT ! ! ! ! !
2. How did you come up with the idea to replace the solenoid ? This would be the last thing to fail.
3. There is no such thing as the high voltage side and the low voltage side. It's all 12V. See what I mean when I said to READ THE MANUAL.
4. Speaking of manuals, what is your windlass ? A 2008 Bene could have had any make of windlass installed during production.

Download the manual, invest in a voltmeter and then you will understand the questions to ask. Such as :

1. What is the signal voltage to the solenoid when you push the DOWN button.

2. What is the power voltage from the downstream side of the relay when you push the down button.

You will need the wiring diagram in front of you in order to create these questions. Place the windlass installation manual in your lap, hold the voltmeter in the other hand and start formulating questions. We'll be here and ready to answer.

 

[rgranger]

Damn @Ralph Johnstone

that is the third person today you barked at. Do you need a hug

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

that is the third person today you barked at. Do you need a hug

Wouldn't help one little bit !

I just get ticked when I see people who do things with boat equipment without making the effort to first read the manufacturer's manual. Every manual for everything ever made is most likely available on the net. In this case, the OP is getting nowhere with his problem. In other cases, an OP has damaged equipment or knocked said equipment out of calibration by not reading the manual first.

I think it was @Tally Ho who put it so eloquently when he quoted those famous letters "RTFM."

No, not too neighbourly I admit, but if he's willing to put in the effort read and understand the manual, and then ask informed questions, others and I will try to answer his questions and very likely save him several hundred $$$ by avoiding a visit from a marine electrician.

 

[Ken13559]

DPW, could it be the Windlass motor failed?

 

[dlochner]

Without knowing the type of windlass, it is hard to provide any relevant advice. Likewise, just saying it failed doesn't provide any information that would lead to knowing why it might have failed. When did it fail? What were doing when it failed? Were you anchored in 110 feet of water or just have 110' of chain out? What is your normal anchoring practice, i.e., how do you launch and retrieve the anchor? Are you using a remote? Or foot buttons?

As @Ralph Johnstone rather bluntly stated (ahem), do you have the manual and have you referred to it?

Unless you have a 24v or 48v system is it unlikely that you have a "low voltage" and "high voltage" side of the solenoid, there is usually a high current and low current sides to the solenoid. I've never heard of a windlass solenoid on the engine?

Provide us with more information and you will receive useful information on how to return the windlass to working order.

 

[jviss]

I think the OP is hinting that some Beneteaus that I have heard about have a solenoid interlock so you cannot operate the windlass unless the motor is running. Maybe that's why he suspected the solenoid, and says "My thinking is that the problem is with the signal from the engine to the solenoid, which likely involves the solenoid in the engine."

 

[jssailem]

No Hugs.. But a real strong LIKE... @Ralph Johnstone

 

[DPW]

Well I kinda walked right into that;-( I have used the RTFM acronym myself over the years and while it stings a bit to have it turned back on me, it's good advice. I will RTFM and see what I can figure out. Per JVISS, yes, I was referring to the interlock.

A challenge in testing voltage is that I am solo, need to get someone topside to operate the hand-held whilst I measure the voltage. The reason I jumped in and replaced the solenoid was that this happened a few years ago and that resolved it, that and being a bit lazy;-)

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

need to get someone topside to operate the hand-held whilst I measure the voltage.

Is the handheld controller you refer to a remote or a cabled connection to the UP and DOWN switches ?

Is it possible to use this controller from down below where you are taking V measurement ?

And a PS here : do you know the make of the windlass ?

 

[BigEasy]

Well I kinda walked right into that;-( I have used the RTFM acronym myself over the years and while it stings a bit to have it turned back on me, it's good advice. I will RTFM and see what I can figure out. Per JVISS, yes, I was referring to the interlock

After you read the manual, can provide more info including manufacturer & model, as well as appropriate photos, get back with theses guys. They can provide a lot of insight and help you troubleshoot & fix.

 

[DPW]

Its a Lewmar windless. The hand-held is cabled and does not have enough length to reach thru the hatch to the V-berth, tried that already. My son visits this weekend and I'll get him to earn his keep;-)

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

Now, we've almost solved the problem. Attached is the latest manual on everything from V1 to V6 with reasonable wiring diagrams. IMO, my V1 install manual from 2010 has a better wiring diagram which seems to be applicable to everything except the V4 and V6.

My son visits this weekend and I'll get him to earn his keep;-)

Good luck with that. Been trying for decades now with little success. Will look forward to your results.

 

[DPW]

V-1 looks right. I believe I have the original manual but it's in storage as we are just getting ready to move. Thanks, I will review and think thru viable trouble shooting process.

 

[DPW]

Ok: I took the advice, RTFM, and ran tests. First, it's not a Lewmar, it's a Quick "High Performance" S/N: 101408. With engine running and no switch activated, minimal voltage, 1.2 volts, on the low amp side (wires not cables). Three wire spade connections, when witch is activated 14.55 volts at all three wire connections regardless of whether I push the "Up" or "Down" switch. For the three cable connections, the center post reads 14.55 volts and the posts on left and right show 0 volts, with or without activating the switch. Maybe Ken (above) was right, it's the motor? It's a 2008 Beneteau and the windlass is original equipment.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

1.2 volts, on the low amp side (wires not cables).

Please tell me the 1.2 volts is really 12 volts. There is no 1.2V in the windlass system.

Three wire spade connections, when witch is activated 14.55 volts

This is what I expect to see for your 12V system. Your alternator is adding the extra voltage that you are seeing. Sorry but without the wiring diagram, I can't tell you anything as to what's happening. I'm not familiar with the Quick line but I see there are quite a few models available and you are going to have to come up with the correct model before we can look at the voltage of specific "contact points" before we can determine what's going on.

 

[DPW]

I founf it strange that there was any voltage at all, but should clarify I was testing for voltage between the posts: A (left side) B (Middle); C (Right side): A - C = 0 Volts; A - B = 1.8 Volts; B - C = 1.9 Volts. Attached is the only wiring diagram I have.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

You're just a little bit closer but not close enough to diagnose the problem you are dealing with. Your boat wiring diagram is not detailed enough to trouble shoot your problem. Notice there are no control wires shown in the Bene manufacturer's drawing. It just shows power wiring (+) connected to the relay and windlass motor and a negative return which is all you would expect if the final windlass make was not known.

Before we can work through your problem, you will have to identify the model of your Quick High Performance windlass and then download the installation manual from the net. Once we have the Quick manufacturer's wiring diagram in hand, we can then make some headway.

 

[DPW]

Well I finally tracked it down! On the Quick website they had a place to "Ask a Question" which I did, not expecting any response as it's in Italy. Much to my surprise I received a reply that included the manual for my windlass as well as replacement model number for the motor if needed. Attached is the wiring diagram.

 

[dlochner]

Turn off the power with the switch. Now measure the resistance, not the voltage, between the M1 and the negative post on the motor, do the same for M2. You should get an open circuit. If you get any resistance at all, then the problem is in the contactor.

If you get open circuits there, measure the resistance between the pins on the remote and the socket for the remote.

The low voltage readings you were getting suggest a high resistance short that is allowing some current to flow where it shouldn't. There should be no voltage between the negative and either of the two positives on the motor.