What are these lines for?

R

Ritdog

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Jul 18, 2011
184
Oday 25 Portland, ME
This is a sail off a Cal 22 , I think (box logo red on top, blue on bottom, "C22" in box).

It has different length lines coming off the leech, with rings on the ends of the lines. The leech has grommets all along it for the lines.

Any ideas? Never seen anything like it.... I'm thinking a shade of some sort.
 

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DougM

DougM

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Jul 24, 2005
2,242
Beneteau 323 Manistee, MI
It appears that those lines are positioned to attach to the topping lift, to assist in containing the sail when it is dropped. It seems though like they should be progressively longer At the head of the sail than at the clew. just a guess on my part. My neighbor has a similar setup on his O Day 34.
 
kito

kito

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Sep 13, 2012
2,011
1979 Hunter Cherubini 30 Clemmons
They are longer at the head. Seems like they would flop around beating the sail when it's raised.
 
HEINZIR

HEINZIR

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Jan 22, 2008
198
Montgomery 17, Venture of Newport, Mirror sailing dinghy, El Toro sailing dinghy Mound, MN -- Lake Minnetonka
They are indeed a sail containment system that works much better than lazy jacks. North Sails marketed it for a while as the Lazymate system. I have copied it on my boat and would never go back to lazy jacks. I did not find it necessary to use the top three or four lines. If the topping lift is adjusted correctly it will be loose when the sail is up and will tighten as it takes the weight of the boom when the sail is dropped. The lines on the leech keep the folds of the sail from dropping off the top of the boom. They should be adjusted so that the lines are quite tight when the sail is down. They will loosen up automatically (because of the geometry) when the sail is raised. I have never had a problem with the lines flopping in the wind or chafing.

Anyone can try out this system by simply tying a line between your reefing grommets and the topping lift. Use shackles or rings at the topping lift end so they will slide easily. The lines will hold the aft part of the sail on the boom. If you like how it works you can add additional grommets at the sail folds for additional lines.
 

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kito

kito

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Sep 13, 2012
2,011
1979 Hunter Cherubini 30 Clemmons
I wonder why it didn't catch on? People wanting to replace their topping lift and went with lazyjacks? It's got me thinking though. Like you, I don't feel the need for lines on the top half of the sail...just the bottom to get it flaking.
 
Jackdaw

Jackdaw

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Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
There is a reason why Harken no longer sells these. If you play with your mainsail shape AT ALL, they are a total PITA.
 
HEINZIR

HEINZIR

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Jan 22, 2008
198
Montgomery 17, Venture of Newport, Mirror sailing dinghy, El Toro sailing dinghy Mound, MN -- Lake Minnetonka
Jackdaw said:
There is a reason why Harken no longer sells these. If you play with your mainsail shape AT ALL, they are a total PITA.
Click to expand
Not so in my experience. I have a full complement of go-fast sail controls and can pretty much achieve any shape I want.
 
Scott T-Bird

Scott T-Bird

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Oct 26, 2008
6,368
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
How so?

Jackdaw said:
There is a reason why Harken no longer sells these. If you play with your mainsail shape AT ALL, they are a total PITA.
Click to expand
With the length of ties at the top, I can't see how they would affect twist. If the ties are too short at the bottom 1/3 I can see how draft might be affected, but not necessarily so if the ties are lengthened appropriately. Angle of attack? ... no issue. Draft position? ... only if the draft depth is affected, but not necessarily so. I'd have to see how it might affect reefing.

If they slap around, I can see how they might be annoying. I'm thinking that many folks might think they look silly, sort of like sailing with fenders hanging over the side. That may be the biggest objection.
 
Sprega

Sprega

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Sep 12, 2012
115
O,day 27 Brownsville Marina
I'm with Jackdaw on this one. Just spent a lot of money for a new main sail. I don't see myself hanging a bunch of lines off the leach. The leach of a main is the least controllable edge of the sail. It is also where most sails fail first. I will continue to use lazy jacks which I can get totally out of the way while sailing. Why spend big bucks for a performance sail and then compromise it's shape and shorten its life.
 
HEINZIR

HEINZIR

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Jan 22, 2008
198
Montgomery 17, Venture of Newport, Mirror sailing dinghy, El Toro sailing dinghy Mound, MN -- Lake Minnetonka
Your call. I wouldn't put additional grommets in my main either unless I was absolutely sure the benefits outweighed the (so-called) drawbacks. As I've mentioned, I don't think it's necessary to have the long lines at the top of the sail. I have about five lines on my main. Two of them use the reef grommets. So that's only three additional ones. There has been absolutely no wear on the leach and I've used this system for over 20 years. I am not crossing oceans, though. I am a lake sailor that goes out two or three times a week on my 23' boat. I'm in no position to argue with the big boys in their big boats. But I do ask that you keep an open mind.

You can try it without adding any additional grommets. Just use the reef grommets, assuming you have two. What have you got to lose?

The lines themselves don't have to be very thick or strong. 3/16 is plenty big. I'm using 1/8 inch Dyneema just because I had some laying around.
 
Sprega

Sprega

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Sep 12, 2012
115
O,day 27 Brownsville Marina
Even though I'm not likely to do this. I can see a place for it. As I get older (much older) I appreciate things that make sailing easier. And, everything has it's compromises.
 
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