I would like to get some insights about watermakers. I find nothing of value in the archives. I keep throwing money into my "whole in the water" and, after radar, auto-pilot, refrigeration, a new inverter, solar panels, more batteries, it seems time to think WATERMAKER. However, these suckers are pricey.There is the PUR 160E, 6.7 GPH, at $3500 from JSI. (PUR 40E, 1.5 GPH, at $2200 from JSI, but 1.5 GPH is not enough to do much). And, the superior I am sure, Spectra 200C, 8 GPH, at $4726 from JSI. Are there alternatives? Are there pitfalls that I should know about? I have never been on a boat that has a watermaker. Am I going to be able to leave it unattended for months at a time? ( I have a guy who starts my boat every couple of weeks, checks the fulid, runs the engine under load, and all that stuff. Will he have to do more?) Insights are needed for sure. I know there was a Practical Sailor article in Jan. 98 but I do not have that issue. Are back issues available on the WEB? I cannot find them if they are. Thanks for any info. Rodney S/V Avanti
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LaDonna Bubak - CatalinaOwners
Do you need it?
I don't know where "Burnt Store" is but do you *need* a watermaker? How often do you go out? Is there not a sufficient water supply near you? Are you planning on going cruising and thought it would be a good thing to have? Here's my take: Don't buy it till you need it. If you only go to your boat every few months for a short period, it's doubtful that you really need it. You could spend that money on something else more useful or necessary (how long since you replaced your standing rigging, for example). If you're planning on going cruising in, say 5 years, wait till just before you leave cuz guaranteed the prices will be lower & selection better. Sometimes we get so caught up in doing stuff to the boat, we just keep buying & buying when we could be putting that money in the cruising kitty, etc. Anyway, just some thoughts. LaDonna
I don't know where "Burnt Store" is but do you *need* a watermaker? How often do you go out? Is there not a sufficient water supply near you? Are you planning on going cruising and thought it would be a good thing to have? Here's my take: Don't buy it till you need it. If you only go to your boat every few months for a short period, it's doubtful that you really need it. You could spend that money on something else more useful or necessary (how long since you replaced your standing rigging, for example). If you're planning on going cruising in, say 5 years, wait till just before you leave cuz guaranteed the prices will be lower & selection better. Sometimes we get so caught up in doing stuff to the boat, we just keep buying & buying when we could be putting that money in the cruising kitty, etc. Anyway, just some thoughts. LaDonna
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Jim Cook
manual RO watermaker
I saw a news article (I think it was on the Discovery channel) last night about survival. It showed a hand-operated reverse osmosis device, but didn't give any brand or other info. I thought I would look into it. The output is probably limited, but it should require little maintenance when not in use. Jim Cook "Dream Chaser"
I saw a news article (I think it was on the Discovery channel) last night about survival. It showed a hand-operated reverse osmosis device, but didn't give any brand or other info. I thought I would look into it. The output is probably limited, but it should require little maintenance when not in use. Jim Cook "Dream Chaser"
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bp
h2o
The seven seas cruising association does an equipment survey of all of its members. The PUR watermakers consistently got the worst ratings for failures from the ssca members who had been on long cruises. I guess that's why they're cheapest. Spectra got the highest ratings for reliability and low energy use. If you don't use a watermaker about every other day, you have to "pickle" it in order to prevent the growth of microbes in the pressure vessel. This takes 30-60 minutes. Once pickled, they can stay dormant indefinitely. Installation can be complicated and time consuming. Watermakers come in modular form and self enclosed form. Cruising World magazine always has lots of ads for them. Using a web search engine with "watermakers" will give you the urls of a few manufacturers.
The seven seas cruising association does an equipment survey of all of its members. The PUR watermakers consistently got the worst ratings for failures from the ssca members who had been on long cruises. I guess that's why they're cheapest. Spectra got the highest ratings for reliability and low energy use. If you don't use a watermaker about every other day, you have to "pickle" it in order to prevent the growth of microbes in the pressure vessel. This takes 30-60 minutes. Once pickled, they can stay dormant indefinitely. Installation can be complicated and time consuming. Watermakers come in modular form and self enclosed form. Cruising World magazine always has lots of ads for them. Using a web search engine with "watermakers" will give you the urls of a few manufacturers.
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Gene Gruender
I've used a PUR
A few comments: >If you don't use a watermaker about every other day, you have to "pickle" it in order to prevent the growth of microbes in the pressure vessel. < It's closer to a week, really. At least that is what PUR recommends, and what we did without problems. However, the watermaker itself will do better if you use it more often. One of the harder things on it is sitting idle. >This takes 30-60 minutes.< On my PUR, it's more like 10 minutes, including mixing the solution, digging out the hold to get to the tube to inject the solution and all. That, in itself, is not really a big deal. > Once pickled, they can stay dormant indefinitely. < PUR says 1 year. If you haven't used it in a year, they recommend going through the pickling process again. By the way, this includes the little hand held model you might have in your liferaft or stashed away. Don't forget that one. I would guess that is the same with all manufacturers, but I'd check with them. I can't comment on any others, as I haven't used them, but we have used our PUR Power survivor 36 for all our daily needs for one year. (2 - 6 month cruises) with only one problem, and that was a piece of crud that got through a damaged filter. We found that our 1.6 GPH was adaquate for all our needs, daily showers, dishes, all of it. Of course, we ran it quite a bit (I'd say about 40% of the time) and some people find the sound of it running abjectionable. However, the noise can be cut down a lot by how and where it's installed. I strongly recommend a watermaker (Powered, not hand operated) if you're planning to get off the beaten path. It really frees you to go where you want and stay as long as you want. However, I agree that it shouldn't be bought until just before you leave.
A few comments: >If you don't use a watermaker about every other day, you have to "pickle" it in order to prevent the growth of microbes in the pressure vessel. < It's closer to a week, really. At least that is what PUR recommends, and what we did without problems. However, the watermaker itself will do better if you use it more often. One of the harder things on it is sitting idle. >This takes 30-60 minutes.< On my PUR, it's more like 10 minutes, including mixing the solution, digging out the hold to get to the tube to inject the solution and all. That, in itself, is not really a big deal. > Once pickled, they can stay dormant indefinitely. < PUR says 1 year. If you haven't used it in a year, they recommend going through the pickling process again. By the way, this includes the little hand held model you might have in your liferaft or stashed away. Don't forget that one. I would guess that is the same with all manufacturers, but I'd check with them. I can't comment on any others, as I haven't used them, but we have used our PUR Power survivor 36 for all our daily needs for one year. (2 - 6 month cruises) with only one problem, and that was a piece of crud that got through a damaged filter. We found that our 1.6 GPH was adaquate for all our needs, daily showers, dishes, all of it. Of course, we ran it quite a bit (I'd say about 40% of the time) and some people find the sound of it running abjectionable. However, the noise can be cut down a lot by how and where it's installed. I strongly recommend a watermaker (Powered, not hand operated) if you're planning to get off the beaten path. It really frees you to go where you want and stay as long as you want. However, I agree that it shouldn't be bought until just before you leave.
Have you thought about additional tanks?
Rodney: Have you thought about just adding some tankage to the boat to begin with? Even if you have a water maker, you would want to be able to store water in seperate tanks. This would be a start. If you are going to make an extended cruise you could consider a watermaker in the time leading up to your departure. From everything that I have read, they are a pain-in-the-ass unless you need them.
Rodney: Have you thought about just adding some tankage to the boat to begin with? Even if you have a water maker, you would want to be able to store water in seperate tanks. This would be a start. If you are going to make an extended cruise you could consider a watermaker in the time leading up to your departure. From everything that I have read, they are a pain-in-the-ass unless you need them.
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Justin - O'day Owners' Web
Another anecdotal vote for 'they can be a PITA'
The boat we chartered last August has a Pur aboard, not sure which capacity model, but it was not functional at that time. The owners of the boat commented that they had repaired it a handfull of times but that it had b broken quickly each time. They were planning to install a Spectra. YMMV, Justin - O'day Owners' Web
The boat we chartered last August has a Pur aboard, not sure which capacity model, but it was not functional at that time. The owners of the boat commented that they had repaired it a handfull of times but that it had b broken quickly each time. They were planning to install a Spectra. YMMV, Justin - O'day Owners' Web
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Jim Ewing
Have a PUR
Rodney, Our 37.5 came with a PUR PowerSurvivor 35, the predecessor to the 40E. It didn't work due to lack of maintenance so we sent it back to PUR for reconditioning ($200). Put it back in the boat and tested it (not long marina water yecch) then pickled the membrane. Got to the Bahamas and tried to start it, no pumping action (the previous owner installed it a bit too high in the boat I think) mucked around with it and finally got it to work. OK that's all the bad news you get with this story. The thing is great. Ours puts out about 1.25 GPH at an average of 4 amps. In the islands that means I can turn 16 amp hours into 2 showers and washup water every day. We spent 12 days away from water and still came back with a half tank. Back from the trip I pickled the membrane (takes about 10 minutes) and left it. We only use it in really clean water as we don't have the optional filter & pump kit. Last weekend we took the boat out to make sure it still worked. Stared pumping right away. Changed the filter and it pumped the air through no problem. The maintenance varies on these things (the PUR does not require a fresh water backflush but does require you pickle the membrane if it's gonna sit for more than a few days). I think a lot depends on how and where you're going to cruise. If you're in the intracoastal, water's free and you'll be passing marinas every couple days (at least!). If you're in the Bahamas water costs 30 cents a gallon and is of varying quality. If you're cruising the Gulf Coast you'll want the filter kit for sure. If I were going to buy one I think I'd get the Spectra because of its low power per gallon. But I'm real happy with our PUR. Jim "Prospect"
Rodney, Our 37.5 came with a PUR PowerSurvivor 35, the predecessor to the 40E. It didn't work due to lack of maintenance so we sent it back to PUR for reconditioning ($200). Put it back in the boat and tested it (not long marina water yecch) then pickled the membrane. Got to the Bahamas and tried to start it, no pumping action (the previous owner installed it a bit too high in the boat I think) mucked around with it and finally got it to work. OK that's all the bad news you get with this story. The thing is great. Ours puts out about 1.25 GPH at an average of 4 amps. In the islands that means I can turn 16 amp hours into 2 showers and washup water every day. We spent 12 days away from water and still came back with a half tank. Back from the trip I pickled the membrane (takes about 10 minutes) and left it. We only use it in really clean water as we don't have the optional filter & pump kit. Last weekend we took the boat out to make sure it still worked. Stared pumping right away. Changed the filter and it pumped the air through no problem. The maintenance varies on these things (the PUR does not require a fresh water backflush but does require you pickle the membrane if it's gonna sit for more than a few days). I think a lot depends on how and where you're going to cruise. If you're in the intracoastal, water's free and you'll be passing marinas every couple days (at least!). If you're in the Bahamas water costs 30 cents a gallon and is of varying quality. If you're cruising the Gulf Coast you'll want the filter kit for sure. If I were going to buy one I think I'd get the Spectra because of its low power per gallon. But I'm real happy with our PUR. Jim "Prospect"
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Tim Schaaf
depends....
My experience is based upon 10 years of experience with various PUR's, 3 years of a commercial 40,000 per day (you read that right) unit that serves the marina I mmanage, and anecdotal experience with many of those in between. I personally have installed the PUR 35 and 40 on my boat and have maintained these and many others. First: It is GREAT to have a plentiful supply of excellent water, but yes, they are maintenance-heavy. There is NOTHING complicated about the maintenance, but you HAVE to do it or you will have a nightmare.....kind of like putting gas in your car's tank, changing its oil and filters.Don't do it and you will be sorry. I remember when Seven Seas Cruising Association did a survey which, after absolutely panning the PUR units, allowed as to how "those few who had managed to keep their's working had done the following"...all of which "discoveries" were thoroughly covered in the manual.....so READ IT AND FOLLOW IT! But, even a rebuild, yes, even a total. rebuild of a 40,000 GPD unit, is not a complicated task. My advice would be to read the manual, do the maintenance rigorously and without fear, and enjoy the water! Generally, the more frequently the unit is used the better.Run it in clean sea water. Daily to weekly, depending on salinity (not all sea water is equally salty) humidity, and temperature.Run it briefly on clean, non-chlorinated, fresh water occasionally if you are going to be in a marina for a little longer. Pickle it when you should. It is a very easy and quick process. The membrane will keep fine for months or even a year or so, depending on the manufacturer.Sometimes, you will need to do a partial or complete rebuild after a LONG period of inactivity as the seals, springs, etc., may have suffered. The handheld one you saw on TV is for emergencies, but PUR makes (or made) a unit that would put out a gallon per hour. A friend cruised with one and pumped for an hour daily and got his workout, as well! I bought PUR and have been happy with the units and delighted with their service. DC units like PUR and Spectra have the advantage that their energy does not necessarily require running the engine or using AC. Larger units pretty much have to run off of an engine. Although I have used PUR quite happily, I must say that if I actually needed higher output, I would think hard about Spectra. It has gained raves among real-life cruisers. It is more expensive however. A cruiser named Gary Albers has written a very good general manual on watermakers. I know you can get one from PUR, but it is not their book, so I imagine it might be available elsewhere. If you can't get it, I can get you his email address. I strongly suggest you read it. I am inclined to agree with the comments that you not buy until you are really thinking of needing it. Although the technology is not "high" (basically pumps and filters by other names), improvements are made. But, I would not leave it till last, as installation can require some planning and thinking. Plus, I happen to think that everything you use while cruising should be onboard, tested, and ready for some months before departure. By the way, I am based in Cabo San Lucas, Baja California, Mexico, and have done most of my cruising in California and in Mexico.And, in the Sea or Cortez, where water is hard to come by, my watermaker was near the top of the list of "musts"! Good luck, enjoy the water, and don't be afraid of the maintenace.
My experience is based upon 10 years of experience with various PUR's, 3 years of a commercial 40,000 per day (you read that right) unit that serves the marina I mmanage, and anecdotal experience with many of those in between. I personally have installed the PUR 35 and 40 on my boat and have maintained these and many others. First: It is GREAT to have a plentiful supply of excellent water, but yes, they are maintenance-heavy. There is NOTHING complicated about the maintenance, but you HAVE to do it or you will have a nightmare.....kind of like putting gas in your car's tank, changing its oil and filters.Don't do it and you will be sorry. I remember when Seven Seas Cruising Association did a survey which, after absolutely panning the PUR units, allowed as to how "those few who had managed to keep their's working had done the following"...all of which "discoveries" were thoroughly covered in the manual.....so READ IT AND FOLLOW IT! But, even a rebuild, yes, even a total. rebuild of a 40,000 GPD unit, is not a complicated task. My advice would be to read the manual, do the maintenance rigorously and without fear, and enjoy the water! Generally, the more frequently the unit is used the better.Run it in clean sea water. Daily to weekly, depending on salinity (not all sea water is equally salty) humidity, and temperature.Run it briefly on clean, non-chlorinated, fresh water occasionally if you are going to be in a marina for a little longer. Pickle it when you should. It is a very easy and quick process. The membrane will keep fine for months or even a year or so, depending on the manufacturer.Sometimes, you will need to do a partial or complete rebuild after a LONG period of inactivity as the seals, springs, etc., may have suffered. The handheld one you saw on TV is for emergencies, but PUR makes (or made) a unit that would put out a gallon per hour. A friend cruised with one and pumped for an hour daily and got his workout, as well! I bought PUR and have been happy with the units and delighted with their service. DC units like PUR and Spectra have the advantage that their energy does not necessarily require running the engine or using AC. Larger units pretty much have to run off of an engine. Although I have used PUR quite happily, I must say that if I actually needed higher output, I would think hard about Spectra. It has gained raves among real-life cruisers. It is more expensive however. A cruiser named Gary Albers has written a very good general manual on watermakers. I know you can get one from PUR, but it is not their book, so I imagine it might be available elsewhere. If you can't get it, I can get you his email address. I strongly suggest you read it. I am inclined to agree with the comments that you not buy until you are really thinking of needing it. Although the technology is not "high" (basically pumps and filters by other names), improvements are made. But, I would not leave it till last, as installation can require some planning and thinking. Plus, I happen to think that everything you use while cruising should be onboard, tested, and ready for some months before departure. By the way, I am based in Cabo San Lucas, Baja California, Mexico, and have done most of my cruising in California and in Mexico.And, in the Sea or Cortez, where water is hard to come by, my watermaker was near the top of the list of "musts"! Good luck, enjoy the water, and don't be afraid of the maintenace.
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