Just uncovered the boat (Hunter 27 1981)from winter storage and once again found the bilge full of water up to floor level. Have no idea where this is coming from. I cover the boat with tarps fore and aft. This is not a complete enclosure but only a small area around the mast is exposed. This ocurrs "almost" every year. Occasionally I get lucky and find it relatively dry in the Spring. Anyone out there had this problem? If so what is it and is there a fix???? Looking forward to any insight you can offer. Three week to launch....happy sailing!!! Tom....sweetstuff646@sbcglobal.net
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The bilge on an H27 is much...
deeper than the shallow pan you are looking at. You can suck that pan dry and the following day you will probably have water back in it. A couple of years ago over a period of 3 0r 4 days I got between 5 and 10 gallons of water that had seeped in from them hidden compartments. Of course these are old boats that may leak from the hatches and portholes, the pulpit, the rail, interior water tank and hoses, deck scuppers, chainplates, ETC. Next season, before you put the boat away, try getting out as much of the water as you can until it stays dry for a couple of days. Also taste the water to see if its salty (from down the bilge) or fresh (from rain or the water tank.) Good hunting.
deeper than the shallow pan you are looking at. You can suck that pan dry and the following day you will probably have water back in it. A couple of years ago over a period of 3 0r 4 days I got between 5 and 10 gallons of water that had seeped in from them hidden compartments. Of course these are old boats that may leak from the hatches and portholes, the pulpit, the rail, interior water tank and hoses, deck scuppers, chainplates, ETC. Next season, before you put the boat away, try getting out as much of the water as you can until it stays dry for a couple of days. Also taste the water to see if its salty (from down the bilge) or fresh (from rain or the water tank.) Good hunting.
Back to Benny
Thanks Benny. I got well over 10 gallons out the other day. And I did get all the water out before I stored it (std procedure). As for tasting the bilge water, I'll pass on that one!! That wouldn't be a meaningful test anyway since mine is a fresh water boat. Guess I just have to accept the fact that I've got the advantages and disadvantages of an old vessel. Sail on.
Thanks Benny. I got well over 10 gallons out the other day. And I did get all the water out before I stored it (std procedure). As for tasting the bilge water, I'll pass on that one!! That wouldn't be a meaningful test anyway since mine is a fresh water boat. Guess I just have to accept the fact that I've got the advantages and disadvantages of an old vessel. Sail on.
Same problem,
Our 82 suffers from the same thing and Benny is right about the bilge. I believe there is a secret water tank manned by elves that have a great time messing with my mind. Anyway, I just pull a transducer so the level is never over the two or so inches of the housing and add antifreeze. Don't worry, be happy, go sailing. Andy Baroque
Our 82 suffers from the same thing and Benny is right about the bilge. I believe there is a secret water tank manned by elves that have a great time messing with my mind. Anyway, I just pull a transducer so the level is never over the two or so inches of the housing and add antifreeze. Don't worry, be happy, go sailing. Andy Baroque
Back to Andy
Thanks Andy. Pulling the transducer is a good idea and would control the water level. It would keep the water below the floor boards which are now delaminating. Still a few "ice bergs" on the bay so sailing is a week or two away!!!!
Thanks Andy. Pulling the transducer is a good idea and would control the water level. It would keep the water below the floor boards which are now delaminating. Still a few "ice bergs" on the bay so sailing is a week or two away!!!!
I had water in my bilge every spring and could not find the sourse. I found a clamp lose on a scuper on port side and drain hose was almost off made the repair to the hose and have not had any water. it is tough too get at.good luck
Back to Tom and Les
I had that problem. What we think happened is that the cockpit drains froze and the cockpit flooded to flow into the cabin. It was the year I did not pull the transducer. Now, to cover the cockpit I "fish" a 2X4 to the boom (releasing the topping lift) and secure it to the stern rail (actually swim ladder. Then a big tarp can be tented over this ridge and runs from the mast to over the stern. It is still a problem with the back stays but the cockpit has been dry for two winters. Also, I lived in Marquette (MI) so I understand the patience needed where you are even if we referred to it as the banana republics. And back to Les. If you are talking about the hoses for the cockpit drains. We had one come loose while sailing and Lake Erie came rushing in to the point the water was 6 inches deep in the cabin. Completely unrelated was a battery connection problem so the engine would not start, much less the bilge pump. It was not a good day. Andy
I had that problem. What we think happened is that the cockpit drains froze and the cockpit flooded to flow into the cabin. It was the year I did not pull the transducer. Now, to cover the cockpit I "fish" a 2X4 to the boom (releasing the topping lift) and secure it to the stern rail (actually swim ladder. Then a big tarp can be tented over this ridge and runs from the mast to over the stern. It is still a problem with the back stays but the cockpit has been dry for two winters. Also, I lived in Marquette (MI) so I understand the patience needed where you are even if we referred to it as the banana republics. And back to Les. If you are talking about the hoses for the cockpit drains. We had one come loose while sailing and Lake Erie came rushing in to the point the water was 6 inches deep in the cabin. Completely unrelated was a battery connection problem so the engine would not start, much less the bilge pump. It was not a good day. Andy
Back to Andy & Les
The scupper idea is intriquing. I must admit I thought of that and now will check those out if I can squeez my fat butt in those tight spots. I also thought of the frozen cockpit drains Andy and then the resulting overflow into the cabin but I always covered the cockpit similar to what you do and don't suspect I got that much water in there. But after hearing of your experience (Yuk) I'd better check those out real good. Do you guys have 27's? On another subject: the boat seems to be exceptionally damp inside. Anything either of you have done for that, or is the problem only me? Our interior cushions are also getting pretty ratty looking and we need to replace them. Have you any idea where I might get a similar patterned fabric? Been look'n around at the local upholstrys and can't find anything I like. Appreciate all your comments, been fun chatting with you two.
The scupper idea is intriquing. I must admit I thought of that and now will check those out if I can squeez my fat butt in those tight spots. I also thought of the frozen cockpit drains Andy and then the resulting overflow into the cabin but I always covered the cockpit similar to what you do and don't suspect I got that much water in there. But after hearing of your experience (Yuk) I'd better check those out real good. Do you guys have 27's? On another subject: the boat seems to be exceptionally damp inside. Anything either of you have done for that, or is the problem only me? Our interior cushions are also getting pretty ratty looking and we need to replace them. Have you any idea where I might get a similar patterned fabric? Been look'n around at the local upholstrys and can't find anything I like. Appreciate all your comments, been fun chatting with you two.
Back to Tom, Again
I trust all responding have Cherub 27. Ours is an 82, ALTHOUGH, the model years have differences, I am beginning to believe that each boat is individual and standardization was not the watchword when these critters were built. Then add 20 plus years of juryrigging. The cockpit drains are not necessarily a fit yourself into tight spaces, at least on our boat. Reconnecting the hose was done by braille on your knees wedged in by the wheel with your head in the aft locker. These may be accessable from the starboard laz and the quarterberth. The port drain, where we had a problem has very little material at the outlet to connect the hose, barely the width of the clamp. Now I check these often, especially if we have had a hard pounding. As for the cushion fabric, I would keep hunting until you find something you like. If you are having them built, they should have lots of fabric books to look through. As we have a hairy dog, we bought a painter's canvas, cut it in half and cover both settees. Then these go home for washing. Our cushions were recovered just before we bought the boat 6 years ago. If I ever have to do it I will probably just make tough canvas slipcovers. Yet, everyone's tastes and wear are different. As for damp, we do nothing more than vent. We do have a solar fan in the forward hatch cover. We have some mildew/mold but just try to keep things clean. Does not add much to the normal maintenance. I may try some commercial things if I can get a good recommendation. Andy
I trust all responding have Cherub 27. Ours is an 82, ALTHOUGH, the model years have differences, I am beginning to believe that each boat is individual and standardization was not the watchword when these critters were built. Then add 20 plus years of juryrigging. The cockpit drains are not necessarily a fit yourself into tight spaces, at least on our boat. Reconnecting the hose was done by braille on your knees wedged in by the wheel with your head in the aft locker. These may be accessable from the starboard laz and the quarterberth. The port drain, where we had a problem has very little material at the outlet to connect the hose, barely the width of the clamp. Now I check these often, especially if we have had a hard pounding. As for the cushion fabric, I would keep hunting until you find something you like. If you are having them built, they should have lots of fabric books to look through. As we have a hairy dog, we bought a painter's canvas, cut it in half and cover both settees. Then these go home for washing. Our cushions were recovered just before we bought the boat 6 years ago. If I ever have to do it I will probably just make tough canvas slipcovers. Yet, everyone's tastes and wear are different. As for damp, we do nothing more than vent. We do have a solar fan in the forward hatch cover. We have some mildew/mold but just try to keep things clean. Does not add much to the normal maintenance. I may try some commercial things if I can get a good recommendation. Andy
Once More Andy
After discussions like this I realize why I've fallen in love with the game of golf!!!! It is alot less work. Now if I can get my wife to give up sailing (she loves everything about when I do the hard labor) and take up the game life will be good.
After discussions like this I realize why I've fallen in love with the game of golf!!!! It is alot less work. Now if I can get my wife to give up sailing (she loves everything about when I do the hard labor) and take up the game life will be good.
Usual Suspects
Since you are covering the deck with tarps, it sounds like the deck scuppers are worth checking. I just discovered a thru hull that was broken (hiden break) and leaking. Water getting to most parts of deck will eventually lead here, so if other areas are covered with tarp, seems like a good place to check. I believe this was source of water in my engine compartment. Look for wood delamination on vertical plywood storage area by navigation table. Bow pulpit is also worth checking, but leaks here should flow to area below v-birth. Other likely culprits should leave signs - deck rail bolts are over wood forward, in salon and galley, so leaks here should show stains on fiberglass below the various shelves, as well as stained/delaminated wood below the rail. I always suspect hatches. I have been living with leaking hatches for years. I plan to attack them on my boat soon, Since I have not found an exact replacement for the forward hatch, I intend to reseal or reseat the existing hatches. Any advice would be appreciated. Look for salon bulkhead discolored about foot up from bottom if salon hatch is leaking. Drips splash on the wood. Forward hatch leaks will also flow into well below v birth. Obviously, an assistant spraying the various areas with a garden hose while you are below should confirm any leaks. That is how I confirmed these leaks on my boat. Hope this helps!
Since you are covering the deck with tarps, it sounds like the deck scuppers are worth checking. I just discovered a thru hull that was broken (hiden break) and leaking. Water getting to most parts of deck will eventually lead here, so if other areas are covered with tarp, seems like a good place to check. I believe this was source of water in my engine compartment. Look for wood delamination on vertical plywood storage area by navigation table. Bow pulpit is also worth checking, but leaks here should flow to area below v-birth. Other likely culprits should leave signs - deck rail bolts are over wood forward, in salon and galley, so leaks here should show stains on fiberglass below the various shelves, as well as stained/delaminated wood below the rail. I always suspect hatches. I have been living with leaking hatches for years. I plan to attack them on my boat soon, Since I have not found an exact replacement for the forward hatch, I intend to reseal or reseat the existing hatches. Any advice would be appreciated. Look for salon bulkhead discolored about foot up from bottom if salon hatch is leaking. Drips splash on the wood. Forward hatch leaks will also flow into well below v birth. Obviously, an assistant spraying the various areas with a garden hose while you are below should confirm any leaks. That is how I confirmed these leaks on my boat. Hope this helps!
Back to Frank
Thanks for the info Frank. I do believe the scuppers and deck rail bolts need close inspection. One year along time ago I did do a re-tightening of the deck rail bolts (what a pain getting to them...lots of skinned knuckles). I also get too many general leaks and some are stained as you mentioned from the wood. This staining occurs at the wall by the chart table and near the forward end of the starboard salon seat. What did you do about the leaking deck rail bolts? Just tighten or re-seal. Many many times we've tried the hose bath to find leaks and never have any success. I have removed and re-bedded the hatches several times since I owned the boat and it's not a difficult job. Last time I did the hatch over the salon I had to glass in the screw holes because the wood was rotted. The most difficult part is getting the hatch broken free of the sealant. I used a wire stuck thru the sealant joint and then pulled it around like a garot. On another subject: Does the mast on your boat ever shimmy when you're at the dock. We experience this very annoying noise quite often and can't find the source of the problem. Have added additional tie offs at various points at different times with no success. We spend almost every weekend during the summer sleeping aboard.I spend most of my nights chasing around searching for these mysterious noises!!!
Thanks for the info Frank. I do believe the scuppers and deck rail bolts need close inspection. One year along time ago I did do a re-tightening of the deck rail bolts (what a pain getting to them...lots of skinned knuckles). I also get too many general leaks and some are stained as you mentioned from the wood. This staining occurs at the wall by the chart table and near the forward end of the starboard salon seat. What did you do about the leaking deck rail bolts? Just tighten or re-seal. Many many times we've tried the hose bath to find leaks and never have any success. I have removed and re-bedded the hatches several times since I owned the boat and it's not a difficult job. Last time I did the hatch over the salon I had to glass in the screw holes because the wood was rotted. The most difficult part is getting the hatch broken free of the sealant. I used a wire stuck thru the sealant joint and then pulled it around like a garot. On another subject: Does the mast on your boat ever shimmy when you're at the dock. We experience this very annoying noise quite often and can't find the source of the problem. Have added additional tie offs at various points at different times with no success. We spend almost every weekend during the summer sleeping aboard.I spend most of my nights chasing around searching for these mysterious noises!!!
Shimmy?
I'm not sure what you mean by a shimmy in the mast, but if you have your haylards pulled back and the noise still occurs, it could have something to do with the wiring in the mast. The best way I've heard so far to stop this is to put four zip ties every couple of feet on the wires and leave the tails on. Spread the four ends out to make a cross pattern inside the mast and then fish the wires back up the mast. It will keep them from banging around in the mast.
I'm not sure what you mean by a shimmy in the mast, but if you have your haylards pulled back and the noise still occurs, it could have something to do with the wiring in the mast. The best way I've heard so far to stop this is to put four zip ties every couple of feet on the wires and leave the tails on. Spread the four ends out to make a cross pattern inside the mast and then fish the wires back up the mast. It will keep them from banging around in the mast.
Back to Tom
Thanks for the information on hatch reseating. The wire idea sounds perfect! On the rail bolts, I have had leaks in the same locations. I have tightened the rail bolts, the mounting bolts for the connection on standing rigging, and mounting bolts for the lifeline stantions that are visible. Three diffent sizes of bolts, as I recall: 1/2" socket for the rail bolts, 9/16" for the stay connections and maybe 7/16" for the stantions. Extended sockets, a drive extension, and a universal joint adaptor on the socket make this job MUCH EASIER. I have never re-sealed the rail or bolts, just tightened the bolts. I did this once about a decade ago and again this season. The sealant under the rail is still plyable after more than 20 years. I do not know if there is a recommended tension on these bolts, or a procedure for re-sealing them. I'd be interested to know if there is one. On the mast shimmy, I don't recall ever having the same problem. I have felt some vibration in some winds - but it was felt more than heard. Is the noise caused by halyards or electrical wires in the mast? If the electrical lines are the suspect, the zip tie idea sounds good to me. I lead the main halyard to a loop on the lifeline stantions and and put some tension on the line. This solves any noise from halyard in port. If the shimmy is pronounced, maybe the tension on your standing rigging needs to be checked. I used the loos tensioning guage to check and ajust all stays about a decade ago. It may sound like I spend a lot of time working on the boat, but I have had her for 14 years, so these projects are spread over a long time. I think these are great boats, stable, fast for a cruiser, and fun. I hope you are having as much fun with yours. Thanks again for the info on the hatch.
Thanks for the information on hatch reseating. The wire idea sounds perfect! On the rail bolts, I have had leaks in the same locations. I have tightened the rail bolts, the mounting bolts for the connection on standing rigging, and mounting bolts for the lifeline stantions that are visible. Three diffent sizes of bolts, as I recall: 1/2" socket for the rail bolts, 9/16" for the stay connections and maybe 7/16" for the stantions. Extended sockets, a drive extension, and a universal joint adaptor on the socket make this job MUCH EASIER. I have never re-sealed the rail or bolts, just tightened the bolts. I did this once about a decade ago and again this season. The sealant under the rail is still plyable after more than 20 years. I do not know if there is a recommended tension on these bolts, or a procedure for re-sealing them. I'd be interested to know if there is one. On the mast shimmy, I don't recall ever having the same problem. I have felt some vibration in some winds - but it was felt more than heard. Is the noise caused by halyards or electrical wires in the mast? If the electrical lines are the suspect, the zip tie idea sounds good to me. I lead the main halyard to a loop on the lifeline stantions and and put some tension on the line. This solves any noise from halyard in port. If the shimmy is pronounced, maybe the tension on your standing rigging needs to be checked. I used the loos tensioning guage to check and ajust all stays about a decade ago. It may sound like I spend a lot of time working on the boat, but I have had her for 14 years, so these projects are spread over a long time. I think these are great boats, stable, fast for a cruiser, and fun. I hope you are having as much fun with yours. Thanks again for the info on the hatch.
I was plagued by water in my bilge for two years, I thought it was the keel bolts, but finally found the prop shaft was leaking to the point of filling the bilge when the engine was not running. after adjusting the tightness of the bearing nut, it slowed down to a managable drip. No problem for the last year.
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