In the near future I want to replace my one group 27 wet cell house battery and my wet cell house battery on my '85 H34. This was on the boat when I purchased it. I am thinking about replacing the house battery with an AGM or maybe two and still use a wet cell for starting. I will replace my old charger with a Truecharge 40+. I plan to keep the Off/Batt#1/Both/Batt#2 switch. I have an Adler Barbour refrigerator and an autopilot which would put the most strain on the system in addition to all the "normal" items. Has anyone done this and if so any suggestions? If you added extra batteries where did you put them?
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Dan
Don't mix
the battery types. If you go AGM go all AGM. We have two 4d's and one Group 27 agm's in our 356. Runs everything. Dan Jonas (S/V Feije II)
the battery types. If you go AGM go all AGM. We have two 4d's and one Group 27 agm's in our 356. Runs everything. Dan Jonas (S/V Feije II)
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Barry
My Plan
This year I plan a 3000 mile trip in my h34 and will install two 6 volt golf cart batteries for the house bank / refrigerator and a new #27 starting battery. No bigger bang for the buck that available. I have a Freedom 10 charger / inverter.
This year I plan a 3000 mile trip in my h34 and will install two 6 volt golf cart batteries for the house bank / refrigerator and a new #27 starting battery. No bigger bang for the buck that available. I have a Freedom 10 charger / inverter.
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Rich Wallace
6 Volt Golf Cart Batteries
Go to Sam's Club. You can usually buy 6 volt golf cart batteries for $49 each. For a couple hundred you can have a strong house battery bank. Also, because they are individual, they are much easier to move around. The big thing to remember is to use heavy cables so the resistance is low. I have used a set of two for my house battery bank and have yet to run them down over night with TV's in the evening and a refrigerator and anchor light running all night.
Go to Sam's Club. You can usually buy 6 volt golf cart batteries for $49 each. For a couple hundred you can have a strong house battery bank. Also, because they are individual, they are much easier to move around. The big thing to remember is to use heavy cables so the resistance is low. I have used a set of two for my house battery bank and have yet to run them down over night with TV's in the evening and a refrigerator and anchor light running all night.
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bob
why 6 volt
Why would 6 volt golf cart battries be better than deep cycle 12 volts. I have a 40.5 and plan to use 4 180 amp deep cycles for a extended cruise. SHould I consider 6 volts and if so why?
Why would 6 volt golf cart battries be better than deep cycle 12 volts. I have a 40.5 and plan to use 4 180 amp deep cycles for a extended cruise. SHould I consider 6 volts and if so why?
different charging characteristics
Ron: Flooded batteries have totally different characteristics than AGM and GEL batteries. It is never a good idea to mix any of them on a system. If you needed to mix the AGM and GEL batteries are more similar and can work together. What is your reason for wanting AGM? If it because you are not on your boat all the time and you are not the best about maintenance, then that is really a good choice. You also do not need to worry about gassing and spilled acid. If you do the maintenance then you really cannot beat 6v batteries. You can get about 325-350 amps for a couple large 6v batteries. If you get the Truecharger the maintenance is minimal. I am not familiar with your layout but you may want to look at the Optima battery for your starting battery and then regular AGM's for the house bank. The optima is very small and powerful. They can be placed almost anywhere so that makes then a good choice.
Ron: Flooded batteries have totally different characteristics than AGM and GEL batteries. It is never a good idea to mix any of them on a system. If you needed to mix the AGM and GEL batteries are more similar and can work together. What is your reason for wanting AGM? If it because you are not on your boat all the time and you are not the best about maintenance, then that is really a good choice. You also do not need to worry about gassing and spilled acid. If you do the maintenance then you really cannot beat 6v batteries. You can get about 325-350 amps for a couple large 6v batteries. If you get the Truecharger the maintenance is minimal. I am not familiar with your layout but you may want to look at the Optima battery for your starting battery and then regular AGM's for the house bank. The optima is very small and powerful. They can be placed almost anywhere so that makes then a good choice.
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Les Blackwell
We use 6 volt batteries
For most of my sailing life I've had problems with boat batteries both starting and house batteries. When Nigel Calder's book, Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical Manual, 2nd edition came on the market, I read and re-read the first 6 chapters. Most of it is still over my head but I learned enough to change my system. Niigel's writings in this book and in his articles in sailing magazines pushed me toward the 6 Volt wet cell batteries. I now use 4 six volt batteries for the house giving me 440 amps and I use one group 27 deep discharge for the engine. I have a smart regulator in the engine room, a combiner near the batteries, a 20 amp Statpower battery charger and a Link 20 monitor. I've not had a problem since installing this system and we can hang on the hook for three to four days running my refrig and freezer but not the engine. My only maintainance is to be sure they have water. I figured if those 6 volt batteries can get bounced around everyday at the golf course, theyll do perfectly well on my boat. It's all in Nigel's book.
For most of my sailing life I've had problems with boat batteries both starting and house batteries. When Nigel Calder's book, Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical Manual, 2nd edition came on the market, I read and re-read the first 6 chapters. Most of it is still over my head but I learned enough to change my system. Niigel's writings in this book and in his articles in sailing magazines pushed me toward the 6 Volt wet cell batteries. I now use 4 six volt batteries for the house giving me 440 amps and I use one group 27 deep discharge for the engine. I have a smart regulator in the engine room, a combiner near the batteries, a 20 amp Statpower battery charger and a Link 20 monitor. I've not had a problem since installing this system and we can hang on the hook for three to four days running my refrig and freezer but not the engine. My only maintainance is to be sure they have water. I figured if those 6 volt batteries can get bounced around everyday at the golf course, theyll do perfectly well on my boat. It's all in Nigel's book.
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Steve
6-Volt Answer
Typically, you get a little more Amp-Hours out of two 6-volts in series (to get 12 volts) than two 12-volts in parallel (to increase the amps-hours). The two 6-volts will generally cost less than the 2 12-volts also. Steve
Typically, you get a little more Amp-Hours out of two 6-volts in series (to get 12 volts) than two 12-volts in parallel (to increase the amps-hours). The two 6-volts will generally cost less than the 2 12-volts also. Steve
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David
Batteries
The following is an interesting site that provides some good info on battery types. www.windsun.com/Batteries/AgmTech.htm
The following is an interesting site that provides some good info on battery types. www.windsun.com/Batteries/AgmTech.htm
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John Miller
I added AGM Batteries
to my H34 this past summer. I put two Group 31 AGM house cells and one Group 27 AGM starting battery. One of the house batteries is beside the fuel tank. the other two batteries are end to end in the normal H34 battery location. I installed the True Charge 40 + in the battery compartment. Even though the AGM batteries are not supposed to out gas, I added a blower that runs whenever the engine is running or whenever the battery charger is turned on. I replaced the old 1/2/all battery switch with three seperate on off switches and upgraded all battery cables to a heavier gage (2AWG). The new switches are mounted just above the cutouts in the galley. I added the remote panel for the 40+ as well as a test jacks so I could plug in the digital voltmeter. I put an inspection port where the old battery switch was located which helps when I need to work on the fuel system. I also replaced the 12V wires from the old 1/2/All switch to the Distribution panel and plugged up the hole that Hunter put in the drip pan under the engine. Happy sailing John
to my H34 this past summer. I put two Group 31 AGM house cells and one Group 27 AGM starting battery. One of the house batteries is beside the fuel tank. the other two batteries are end to end in the normal H34 battery location. I installed the True Charge 40 + in the battery compartment. Even though the AGM batteries are not supposed to out gas, I added a blower that runs whenever the engine is running or whenever the battery charger is turned on. I replaced the old 1/2/all battery switch with three seperate on off switches and upgraded all battery cables to a heavier gage (2AWG). The new switches are mounted just above the cutouts in the galley. I added the remote panel for the 40+ as well as a test jacks so I could plug in the digital voltmeter. I put an inspection port where the old battery switch was located which helps when I need to work on the fuel system. I also replaced the 12V wires from the old 1/2/All switch to the Distribution panel and plugged up the hole that Hunter put in the drip pan under the engine. Happy sailing John
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Bobby
AGM/Gel vs wet batteries
Wet batteries outgas when charging, that's why we monitor the fluids. AGM's and gel cell's are still basically wet cells, with the electolyte contained (or absorbed) into a medium. They will still outgas, although not nearly as rapidly as a wet cell. However, you cannot monitor the electrolyle, so that when they start to die (and they will), you don't get as much advance warning. I consider batteries a consumable product and know that I will replace them every 2-3 years. With that said, 6-volt golf cart (or L16's if you have the room) will give you more amp hours per dollar, with a minimum of charger accuracy. You can run a golf cart battery down and revive it, but let a AGM or gel go and they are just expensive ballast. As with everything boat-related, do your homework.
Wet batteries outgas when charging, that's why we monitor the fluids. AGM's and gel cell's are still basically wet cells, with the electolyte contained (or absorbed) into a medium. They will still outgas, although not nearly as rapidly as a wet cell. However, you cannot monitor the electrolyle, so that when they start to die (and they will), you don't get as much advance warning. I consider batteries a consumable product and know that I will replace them every 2-3 years. With that said, 6-volt golf cart (or L16's if you have the room) will give you more amp hours per dollar, with a minimum of charger accuracy. You can run a golf cart battery down and revive it, but let a AGM or gel go and they are just expensive ballast. As with everything boat-related, do your homework.
Got over 10 years on Gels.
I had 2 West Marine Gels on our Hunter 31 for over 10 years. No maintenance at all. Did not even have to clean the terminals in that time. These batteries where left on a charger 24x7. There are several advantages to GEL & AGM batteries. It just so happens that inital purchase price is not one of them. My experience is the overall cost of ownership is about the same as with flooded batteries. We are away from our boat for periods of 4-6 weeks at a time. So the advantage of not worrying about the acid boiling away a major point.
I had 2 West Marine Gels on our Hunter 31 for over 10 years. No maintenance at all. Did not even have to clean the terminals in that time. These batteries where left on a charger 24x7. There are several advantages to GEL & AGM batteries. It just so happens that inital purchase price is not one of them. My experience is the overall cost of ownership is about the same as with flooded batteries. We are away from our boat for periods of 4-6 weeks at a time. So the advantage of not worrying about the acid boiling away a major point.
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Kate
Wet
We have had good luck with the wet and like the less expense. But, as Steve said if you are on the charger 24/7 and never leave the dock the Gels must be fine!
We have had good luck with the wet and like the less expense. But, as Steve said if you are on the charger 24/7 and never leave the dock the Gels must be fine!
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PJ
Replaced & repositioned my batteries
have a 84 H34 & 5-6 yrs ago replaced my batteries with a 8D house under the forward facing settee next to the water heater. the 8d had a lot of staying power but hard to manage. just replaced it with 2 6v golf cart batteries from Sams. yes every fall I have to unscrew the settee to get at the batteries top them off with water & a full charge for winter & do the same in spring but its better than trying to climb down the starboard cockpit hatch. has the same output as the 8D, and you can run them down farther with less damage. Placed the wet cell 12v under the sink next to the water heater, easier to chek the water etc but there is room in a battery box for all 3 if you wish. Seems the 2 6Vs will not have the cranking power of a 12V but for sustained long low draws, they cann't be beat. Another advantage is the weight is almost on center, in the middle and low vs in the stern starboard locker & I have plenty or room for fenders, and extra dock lines etc. Good luck PJ
have a 84 H34 & 5-6 yrs ago replaced my batteries with a 8D house under the forward facing settee next to the water heater. the 8d had a lot of staying power but hard to manage. just replaced it with 2 6v golf cart batteries from Sams. yes every fall I have to unscrew the settee to get at the batteries top them off with water & a full charge for winter & do the same in spring but its better than trying to climb down the starboard cockpit hatch. has the same output as the 8D, and you can run them down farther with less damage. Placed the wet cell 12v under the sink next to the water heater, easier to chek the water etc but there is room in a battery box for all 3 if you wish. Seems the 2 6Vs will not have the cranking power of a 12V but for sustained long low draws, they cann't be beat. Another advantage is the weight is almost on center, in the middle and low vs in the stern starboard locker & I have plenty or room for fenders, and extra dock lines etc. Good luck PJ
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Fred Ficarra
We have ONE bank and they are 6V golfs
Read the West Marine adviser about batteries. We agree with everything that is being said here about batteries. We have been using golf cart 6volts for the past 12 years (we're on our 3rd set) and love 'em. I'm sure our set up isn't for you but this is what we did. #1. Most important, close that hole on the 34s drip pan. Then wire up the boat anyway you want to. What we did was to remove the port water tank and put the batteries there. It keeps them on the port side and trims the 34s starboard tilt. Our boat floats level. The cables and selector switch are simple because the batteries are close to the nav station. The selector switch is under the chart table. It's wired to select engine (start), both, or distribution panel. That way we can disable either receptor of power, we want. The switch is normally on "both". We have four golf carts for 450 amp hours and have room for two more. We will make that decision when we learn what our usage will be. See, this is a remodel. The lighting and appliances are now AC and are powered by a newly installed (this week) Prosine 2.0 that has a 100 amp charger built in. The charger isn't important to us because our cruising style is 'on the hook'. Anyway, all of this works because of our watermaker. We have one water tank in front of the galley and the stern tank is diesel. Our philosophy is 'fuel is freedom', even on a sailboat. We have over 30 pictures and a discussion of some systems on our web page at http://members.tscnet.com/pages/ss427/Epitome's%20Rebuild.html You can cut and paste the link to your browser. It doesn't seem to work yet in "related link" Hope that gives you some ideas.
Read the West Marine adviser about batteries. We agree with everything that is being said here about batteries. We have been using golf cart 6volts for the past 12 years (we're on our 3rd set) and love 'em. I'm sure our set up isn't for you but this is what we did. #1. Most important, close that hole on the 34s drip pan. Then wire up the boat anyway you want to. What we did was to remove the port water tank and put the batteries there. It keeps them on the port side and trims the 34s starboard tilt. Our boat floats level. The cables and selector switch are simple because the batteries are close to the nav station. The selector switch is under the chart table. It's wired to select engine (start), both, or distribution panel. That way we can disable either receptor of power, we want. The switch is normally on "both". We have four golf carts for 450 amp hours and have room for two more. We will make that decision when we learn what our usage will be. See, this is a remodel. The lighting and appliances are now AC and are powered by a newly installed (this week) Prosine 2.0 that has a 100 amp charger built in. The charger isn't important to us because our cruising style is 'on the hook'. Anyway, all of this works because of our watermaker. We have one water tank in front of the galley and the stern tank is diesel. Our philosophy is 'fuel is freedom', even on a sailboat. We have over 30 pictures and a discussion of some systems on our web page at http://members.tscnet.com/pages/ss427/Epitome's%20Rebuild.html You can cut and paste the link to your browser. It doesn't seem to work yet in "related link" Hope that gives you some ideas.
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