I just pulled the boat and already are making plans for next spring. It is time to re-paint the bottom. Rather than go with another coat of the interlux that is on there now, I think I want to go to VC17. There is some grumbling in the sail club that says that too much copper has been taken out of the VC17 and some of the boats are getting some growth again. Has anyone else had this problem? If so what bottom paint would you use? (Keeping in mind that the main objective is to eek every milisecond of speed out of the boat for club racing.) The directions for VC17 say that it can not be used on metal. I have read several articles on this forum from others who apparantly use VC on their wing keels. My question is this. Do you have to do anything special to put VC17 on the wing keel? Do you do most of the boat with VC17 and use something suitable for metal on the wing keel? I have purchased West Marine bottom paint strip system. The system that uses the plastic bag material after you coat the bottom with stripper. Can anyone give me some advice or comments on how this went for you? How long did you leave the bag on? How did you hold it on? Has anyone tried this in the winter time? Any advice or comments would be welcome. Either here or at bleathen@aol.com Thanks.
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vc17
I have used vc 17 on my wing of our 23 for ever, it did get to the point where there was some rust, so I put interlux , on the keel after grinding to metal , it was a 2 part or 2 step process, like an epoxy then a paint or primer, probably wrong tech word, it is in the archives, it held up good, just pulled boat, still looks good except near waterline that never seems to last as long as rest of bottom paint , anyone else had this problem ? cant help with the bag thing , good luck, MIke B ,
I have used vc 17 on my wing of our 23 for ever, it did get to the point where there was some rust, so I put interlux , on the keel after grinding to metal , it was a 2 part or 2 step process, like an epoxy then a paint or primer, probably wrong tech word, it is in the archives, it held up good, just pulled boat, still looks good except near waterline that never seems to last as long as rest of bottom paint , anyone else had this problem ? cant help with the bag thing , good luck, MIke B ,
bottom paint and boat metal
Let's see if I remember my high school chemistry and physics... Most bottom paints contain some quantity of cuprous oxide (also known as "copper"
to help fend of bottom growth. Unfortunately, the copper in the paint can react with the lead in the keel- creating a 500 pound battery underneath your boat and accelerating the galvanic corrosion process considerably. The problem is even worse in salt water, as I understand it. The best way to prevent this reaction is to put a barrier coat between the keel and the bottom paint. Interlux (maker of VC-17) had a great guide available on their web page about applying bottom paint to metals (home page link below), but I'm not sure that guide is still available. The Interlux method involved using approximately 5 coats of InterProtect 2000E (a 2-part epoxy paint) on the keel to create the barrier, and then covering that with the normal number of coats of bottom paint. If there are any pits, nicks, dings, or corrosion on the keel, they need to be cleaned out while the keel is stripped, and faired over with a fairing compound somewhere in between the coats of InterProtect. I wrote a long article about bottom painting my H23 about 2 years ago- Check the archives for the details. I used Micron CSC, but the preparations should be similar for VC-17. Good luck! --Jon Bastien H25 'Adagio'
Let's see if I remember my high school chemistry and physics... Most bottom paints contain some quantity of cuprous oxide (also known as "copper"
to help fend of bottom growth. Unfortunately, the copper in the paint can react with the lead in the keel- creating a 500 pound battery underneath your boat and accelerating the galvanic corrosion process considerably. The problem is even worse in salt water, as I understand it. The best way to prevent this reaction is to put a barrier coat between the keel and the bottom paint. Interlux (maker of VC-17) had a great guide available on their web page about applying bottom paint to metals (home page link below), but I'm not sure that guide is still available. The Interlux method involved using approximately 5 coats of InterProtect 2000E (a 2-part epoxy paint) on the keel to create the barrier, and then covering that with the normal number of coats of bottom paint. If there are any pits, nicks, dings, or corrosion on the keel, they need to be cleaned out while the keel is stripped, and faired over with a fairing compound somewhere in between the coats of InterProtect. I wrote a long article about bottom painting my H23 about 2 years ago- Check the archives for the details. I used Micron CSC, but the preparations should be similar for VC-17. Good luck! --Jon Bastien H25 'Adagio'VC Tar
Bill, I've used VC17 on the iron keel of my 25.5 in freshwater for 8 years now. I would recommend sanding down the keel and using VC-Tar, an epoxy based barrier coat, before painting with VC17. In fact, I would recommend the VC Tar as a barrier coat for the entire bottom. The barrier coat protects against osmotic blistering as well as giving a very slick surface to the bottom. VC17 holds up very well but it is a thin, hard paint. Annual repainting is a simple matter of lightly sanding with fine sandpaper then rolling it on. I, too, find that there is more "wear" at the water line but only if you go into a 2nd year with the paint job. No bottom paint that I know of will completely prevent algae scum from accumulating. The Copper is mainly for invertebrates such as barnacles. The beauty of the VC 17 is that the Teflon ingredient makes it easy to wipe the scum off with a soft brush or even a sponge with recent paint. The paint is super slick and super fast. I wouldn't use anything else. Dick Vance H-25.5 "Honey Bear"
Bill, I've used VC17 on the iron keel of my 25.5 in freshwater for 8 years now. I would recommend sanding down the keel and using VC-Tar, an epoxy based barrier coat, before painting with VC17. In fact, I would recommend the VC Tar as a barrier coat for the entire bottom. The barrier coat protects against osmotic blistering as well as giving a very slick surface to the bottom. VC17 holds up very well but it is a thin, hard paint. Annual repainting is a simple matter of lightly sanding with fine sandpaper then rolling it on. I, too, find that there is more "wear" at the water line but only if you go into a 2nd year with the paint job. No bottom paint that I know of will completely prevent algae scum from accumulating. The Copper is mainly for invertebrates such as barnacles. The beauty of the VC 17 is that the Teflon ingredient makes it easy to wipe the scum off with a soft brush or even a sponge with recent paint. The paint is super slick and super fast. I wouldn't use anything else. Dick Vance H-25.5 "Honey Bear"
Another VC17 fan
I'm about to redo my bottom paint with VC17 after two years in fresh water. The paint actually wore off about a year ago. I was pleased with VC17, but then again there was no real test as I'm in a low-fouling area. If you leave the boat in salt water, VC may not work for you. Occasional salt water use is OK though. The biggest problem was algae, which ate the paint at the waterline in the first eight months. My keel appears to be coated with some sort of gelcoat or epoxy paint so there is very little rust, just a few spots here and there. After reviewing bottom prep recommendations at the Interlux website, I decided to go with VC Tar rather than the Interprotect, because you can paint anything over VC, but you can't put VC on top of everything. Here's my game plan: Remove all loose paint and rust scale with 60 grit sandpaper. Clean rust pits to bright metal and paint immediately with VC Tar (prevents having to use the Viny-Lux Primewash 353/354). Then apply the first coat of VC Tar to the entire bottom including the keel. After the VC Tar cures, fair with Watertite as needed, then apply 3 more coats of VCTar, followed by 2-3 coats of VC17 (2 coats over most of hull, 3 coats on rudder, bow, leading edge of keel and along the waterline. All paints will be applied to 3 inches above the static waterline of the boat. This avoids the hassle of painting the boot topping and also makes sure that there is a little extra VC for those times when the boat is loaded with extra gear or heeled. That thin stripe of red VC17 above the waterline looks good. The work should go quickly because VC Tar doesn't have to be sanded and VC17 dries in minutes to a hard, slick finish. You have to work quickly with the roller so the paint doesn't dry in the tray. This approach is essentially the Jon Bastien method with some substitutions. His article is very detailed and is still in the forum archives. Peter h23 "Raven"
I'm about to redo my bottom paint with VC17 after two years in fresh water. The paint actually wore off about a year ago. I was pleased with VC17, but then again there was no real test as I'm in a low-fouling area. If you leave the boat in salt water, VC may not work for you. Occasional salt water use is OK though. The biggest problem was algae, which ate the paint at the waterline in the first eight months. My keel appears to be coated with some sort of gelcoat or epoxy paint so there is very little rust, just a few spots here and there. After reviewing bottom prep recommendations at the Interlux website, I decided to go with VC Tar rather than the Interprotect, because you can paint anything over VC, but you can't put VC on top of everything. Here's my game plan: Remove all loose paint and rust scale with 60 grit sandpaper. Clean rust pits to bright metal and paint immediately with VC Tar (prevents having to use the Viny-Lux Primewash 353/354). Then apply the first coat of VC Tar to the entire bottom including the keel. After the VC Tar cures, fair with Watertite as needed, then apply 3 more coats of VCTar, followed by 2-3 coats of VC17 (2 coats over most of hull, 3 coats on rudder, bow, leading edge of keel and along the waterline. All paints will be applied to 3 inches above the static waterline of the boat. This avoids the hassle of painting the boot topping and also makes sure that there is a little extra VC for those times when the boat is loaded with extra gear or heeled. That thin stripe of red VC17 above the waterline looks good. The work should go quickly because VC Tar doesn't have to be sanded and VC17 dries in minutes to a hard, slick finish. You have to work quickly with the roller so the paint doesn't dry in the tray. This approach is essentially the Jon Bastien method with some substitutions. His article is very detailed and is still in the forum archives. Peter h23 "Raven"
Interlux recommended Ultra with Biolux
I called Interlux tech support line on Monday and they recommended Ultra with Biolux for a racing bottom in fresh water. The representative suggested applying 3 coats of Ultra and then burnishing with 600 grit sand paper to get a slick bottom. His feeling was that because of the the anti-slime characteristics of the Ultra, it would be faster than the VC-17. (I plan to use the VC-17, anyway.) As far as the keel goes, mine is cast iron rather than lead. If that is your situation, keep in mind that the keel must be overcoated with epoxy very quickly after all of the rust spots have been ground or sanded to bare metal. Unless you are in very dry conditions, rust will reform on the bare metal within an hour. So, plan to proceed with the epoxy overcoat as soon as you complete removal of rust or any coating that exposes bare metal. Having fun yet? RB
I called Interlux tech support line on Monday and they recommended Ultra with Biolux for a racing bottom in fresh water. The representative suggested applying 3 coats of Ultra and then burnishing with 600 grit sand paper to get a slick bottom. His feeling was that because of the the anti-slime characteristics of the Ultra, it would be faster than the VC-17. (I plan to use the VC-17, anyway.) As far as the keel goes, mine is cast iron rather than lead. If that is your situation, keep in mind that the keel must be overcoated with epoxy very quickly after all of the rust spots have been ground or sanded to bare metal. Unless you are in very dry conditions, rust will reform on the bare metal within an hour. So, plan to proceed with the epoxy overcoat as soon as you complete removal of rust or any coating that exposes bare metal. Having fun yet? RB
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