I recently purchased a 1998 Catalina 36 (Mk II) which has a vacu flush head. A couple of weeks ago I noticed a foul odor in the head. The other day I pumped out the holding tank, which I think was overdue for a pump-out. However, the odor persisted. I took up the sole outside where the head is and found that the forward-most part of the bilge had water in it that appeared and smelled as if it came from the holding tank. I cleaned all that up, and I think the odor has gone, but I'm left with a couple of questions. 1)I'm trying to figure out how the set up for this system works. The holding tank has three hoses attached. One comes from the vacuum pump and clearly is an intake hose. Then there is another hose that goest to the pumpout on the deck. Finally, there is a smaller hose that goes from the top of the tank up to underneath the deck. It appears that it is clamped onto the bottom of one of the lifeline stanchions. When I run the vacuum pump, clearly this hose outlet serves to release pressure of air build-up. But if it's clamped to the bottom of the stanchion, how can it serve this purpose? Conversely, it has to allow air to enter the tank when I pump it out. How can it do this? 2)Also, the hose from the vacuum pump to the holding tank has a "T" in it. One end of this "T" goes to the holding tank and the bottom of the "T" goes directly to a through hull. I assume that the shut-off valve for this hose should remain closed so that I don't pump waste into the water (unless I'm far enough off-shore). Is this right? 3)I'm trying to figure out where the sewage water that was in the bilge came from when I failed to pump out the holding tank in time. It must have been leaking from somewhere, but with everything torn up and when I run the vacuum pump I can't find any leaks. 4)Independent of these questions, there is another issue. At one point, when I was checking to see how the through-hull shut-off valves worked, there must have been an intake of water and the top of the holding tank sprung up a little bit. The hodling tank is under the port seat in the main saloon area. Its top is now slightly convex, and this prevents the plywood that goes over it from sitting down flat. The top won't spring back down. Any suggestions for this? Thanks in advance for any comments/answers/suggestions John
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Answers...
1. If you inspect the stanchion carefully, you'll find a slit in it that allows air to escape and be pulled in. It's the way Catalina vents all their tanks, but is a horrible way to do it because the slit is so small that it gets clogged easily...nor does it allow anywhere near enough air exchange to prevent tank contents from being anaerobic. 2. You've assessed that one correctly....the tee provides the option of flushing into the tank or directly overboard. 3. My guess: the tank overflowed into the vent (that guess is backed up by the fact that the top of your tank is now bulging)...the slit in the stanchion is clogged, which created so much back pressure that waste escaped from the tank wherever it could. I suspect the vent is still clogged, which has pressurized the tank...which is why the top is still bulging. So before you do ANYthing else, clear the vent. Better yet, install a thru-hull for it and relocate the vent line to it. You won't find the leak in the system between the toilet and the vacuum pump...it'll be the tank or a connection to the tank that's leaking. If there's an inspection port, or a sender for the SeaLand Tankwatch, threaded into the top of the tank, that's the most likely place for a pressurized holding to leak...unless the tank was pressurized enough to crack it. Also check the vent connection to the stanchion...that's another possibility. To understand how the VacuFlush works: Although SeaLand packages the toilet and holding tank as a "system," they are actually completely separate. The VacuFlush actually ends at the vacuum pump. The suction only pulls the waste as far as the vacuum pump...the pump then has two functions--it pulls the air out of the system between the pump and the toilet while it pushes the flush the rest of the way to the tank or thru-hull. So anyhing to with the holding tank starts after the vacuum pump...anything that affects the actual operation of the toilet is between the toilet and the vacuum pump. I suggest you download and print the manual for the VacuFlush http://www.sealandtechnology.com/pdf/600340006%20VacuFlush%20OM.pdf and keep it on the boat...'cuz the manual includes just about every possible symptom, possible causes and cures that a VacuFlush can develop. It doesn't address holding tank issues, though...and this time it's the tank and venting of the tank that's causing your problems. Or, it may NOT be sewage...trapped stagnant water below the sole is a real "primordial soup" that, especially in hot weather, can easily smell like a sewer. So if you can't find any sign of a leak, that's likely to be it. However, your bulging tank indicates that you do have a clogged vent.
1. If you inspect the stanchion carefully, you'll find a slit in it that allows air to escape and be pulled in. It's the way Catalina vents all their tanks, but is a horrible way to do it because the slit is so small that it gets clogged easily...nor does it allow anywhere near enough air exchange to prevent tank contents from being anaerobic. 2. You've assessed that one correctly....the tee provides the option of flushing into the tank or directly overboard. 3. My guess: the tank overflowed into the vent (that guess is backed up by the fact that the top of your tank is now bulging)...the slit in the stanchion is clogged, which created so much back pressure that waste escaped from the tank wherever it could. I suspect the vent is still clogged, which has pressurized the tank...which is why the top is still bulging. So before you do ANYthing else, clear the vent. Better yet, install a thru-hull for it and relocate the vent line to it. You won't find the leak in the system between the toilet and the vacuum pump...it'll be the tank or a connection to the tank that's leaking. If there's an inspection port, or a sender for the SeaLand Tankwatch, threaded into the top of the tank, that's the most likely place for a pressurized holding to leak...unless the tank was pressurized enough to crack it. Also check the vent connection to the stanchion...that's another possibility. To understand how the VacuFlush works: Although SeaLand packages the toilet and holding tank as a "system," they are actually completely separate. The VacuFlush actually ends at the vacuum pump. The suction only pulls the waste as far as the vacuum pump...the pump then has two functions--it pulls the air out of the system between the pump and the toilet while it pushes the flush the rest of the way to the tank or thru-hull. So anyhing to with the holding tank starts after the vacuum pump...anything that affects the actual operation of the toilet is between the toilet and the vacuum pump. I suggest you download and print the manual for the VacuFlush http://www.sealandtechnology.com/pdf/600340006%20VacuFlush%20OM.pdf and keep it on the boat...'cuz the manual includes just about every possible symptom, possible causes and cures that a VacuFlush can develop. It doesn't address holding tank issues, though...and this time it's the tank and venting of the tank that's causing your problems. Or, it may NOT be sewage...trapped stagnant water below the sole is a real "primordial soup" that, especially in hot weather, can easily smell like a sewer. So if you can't find any sign of a leak, that's likely to be it. However, your bulging tank indicates that you do have a clogged vent.
thanks
Peggy, Thanks for your detailed and careful explanation. It does not seem as if it was leaking from the top of that pressure release hose. The reason I say that is that I think I would see a stain on the inside of the topside, where the water was running down. I will check to see if that slit you mentioned is clogged up but I suspect it's not since I sent a blast of freon up the hose. I also disconnected both ends and blasted it down that same hose so if it was clogged it would be clear now. It did seem as if the water in the forward most compartment of the bilge was from the holding tank and that it did not come from the holding tank because originally, all the sewage-looking (and smelling) water was only in the forward-most section of the bilge. The little hole in the divider that allows water to pass from this section to the other sections of the bilge was clogged (with something that looked like fecal matter). Therefore, it seems to me that the water must have gone directly into this forward section of the bilge. There waere no water stains running from under the holding tank down and forward to this (or any other) part of the bilge. I tried filling up the toilet all the way and then emptying it to see if I could see water running down into the bilge. I didn't see any. So maybe (hopefully) there was just a pressure built-up that forced out water from somewhere down lower (assuming the water came from the toilet, etc.) As for the bulge in the top of the holding tank: I think it's just sprung. I took off the release hose and that bulge (ever so slight) remained, so it couldn't have been just the pressure that was holding it up. My last task is to try to eliminate the odor. I wiped down the entire head with Pine Sol, then Formula 409 and I'm airing it out now. I also thoroughly cleaned the bilge and also the shower sump (which was full of water but not anything that looked like sewage). Hopefully this will eliminate the odor. Thank you again for your explanations.
Peggy, Thanks for your detailed and careful explanation. It does not seem as if it was leaking from the top of that pressure release hose. The reason I say that is that I think I would see a stain on the inside of the topside, where the water was running down. I will check to see if that slit you mentioned is clogged up but I suspect it's not since I sent a blast of freon up the hose. I also disconnected both ends and blasted it down that same hose so if it was clogged it would be clear now. It did seem as if the water in the forward most compartment of the bilge was from the holding tank and that it did not come from the holding tank because originally, all the sewage-looking (and smelling) water was only in the forward-most section of the bilge. The little hole in the divider that allows water to pass from this section to the other sections of the bilge was clogged (with something that looked like fecal matter). Therefore, it seems to me that the water must have gone directly into this forward section of the bilge. There waere no water stains running from under the holding tank down and forward to this (or any other) part of the bilge. I tried filling up the toilet all the way and then emptying it to see if I could see water running down into the bilge. I didn't see any. So maybe (hopefully) there was just a pressure built-up that forced out water from somewhere down lower (assuming the water came from the toilet, etc.) As for the bulge in the top of the holding tank: I think it's just sprung. I took off the release hose and that bulge (ever so slight) remained, so it couldn't have been just the pressure that was holding it up. My last task is to try to eliminate the odor. I wiped down the entire head with Pine Sol, then Formula 409 and I'm airing it out now. I also thoroughly cleaned the bilge and also the shower sump (which was full of water but not anything that looked like sewage). Hopefully this will eliminate the odor. Thank you again for your explanations.
Vent line may be clear, but that doesn't mean
that there's no buildup of waste or a dirt dauber nest in the stanchion or the slit in it. "originally, all the sewage-looking (and smelling) water was only in the forward-most section of the bilge. The little hole in the divider that allows water to pass from this section to the other sections of the bilge was clogged (with something that looked like fecal matter)." No dampness around or under the tank pretty much rules out the tank as the source of the foul water...your description of it sounds like the "primordial soup"...and that stuff in it that looked like fecal matter could very well be the molds, fungi etc that grow in it. Cleaning it out was the first step...airing it out is the next step. If any odor returns, ask BEFORE using anything else to get rid of it. As for your tank bulge...pressurizing a tank is the only thing that can cause a wall or the top of a tank as thick as a SeaLand tank to bulge...and a LOT of pressurize to permanently deform it.
that there's no buildup of waste or a dirt dauber nest in the stanchion or the slit in it. "originally, all the sewage-looking (and smelling) water was only in the forward-most section of the bilge. The little hole in the divider that allows water to pass from this section to the other sections of the bilge was clogged (with something that looked like fecal matter)." No dampness around or under the tank pretty much rules out the tank as the source of the foul water...your description of it sounds like the "primordial soup"...and that stuff in it that looked like fecal matter could very well be the molds, fungi etc that grow in it. Cleaning it out was the first step...airing it out is the next step. If any odor returns, ask BEFORE using anything else to get rid of it. As for your tank bulge...pressurizing a tank is the only thing that can cause a wall or the top of a tank as thick as a SeaLand tank to bulge...and a LOT of pressurize to permanently deform it.
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