Have an interesting question I hope someone can answer. I'm in the market for a used vessel and when reviewing the classifieds I find a boat listed as "two years old", etc, etc. I called to get the specifics and this first owner says the vessel was actually manufactured in 1996 but not commissionned until late 1997 so he felt he could reasonably call it a 1998 model in terms of price comparisons. Is this right when referring to some standard guide like NADA Marine or should it be a 1996 model with "low hours" and then consideration would be given by classifying it as "high retail", to use NADA terms? Obviously a boat is worth what one will pay for it BUT I hope to encourage this seller to see it more my way... ie I like the boat and need a break! By the way, anyone out there with a 26-32 footer less than 5 years old in great shape? Serious buyer here and looking vigorously. David medsight@home.com (just e-mail me directly if you'd like)
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LaDonna Bubak - Catalina Owners
Interesting interpretation
Wow, I wouldn't have thought of that one on my own. When I see a boat listed as a '98, I would expect that boat to have been built in late '97/early '98. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what I would expect. LaDonna
Wow, I wouldn't have thought of that one on my own. When I see a boat listed as a '98, I would expect that boat to have been built in late '97/early '98. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what I would expect. LaDonna
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Justin Wolfe/PYI
What's on the regs.
I would think the registration/title/documentation would say this boat is either a 1996 or a 1977 model. Not commissioning it doesn't count. The hull was layed, all the hoses & wiring were in. Besides where did this boat sit for a year. Was it exposed to the elements during that year? I would base your agrument on the papers. If they agree it is an 1998 then so be it. Like you said, it is whatever you agree to pay. As a reference our boat's hull was laid in October of 1976, but our boat is a 1977. The previous hull number was laid in September of 1976 and it is a 1976.
I would think the registration/title/documentation would say this boat is either a 1996 or a 1977 model. Not commissioning it doesn't count. The hull was layed, all the hoses & wiring were in. Besides where did this boat sit for a year. Was it exposed to the elements during that year? I would base your agrument on the papers. If they agree it is an 1998 then so be it. Like you said, it is whatever you agree to pay. As a reference our boat's hull was laid in October of 1976, but our boat is a 1977. The previous hull number was laid in September of 1976 and it is a 1976.
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Justin - O'day Owner's Web
I'd wonder what else is shady...
I agree with the others; this is unorthodox at best. I submit that a person engaging in one questionable behavior is likely to be engaged in another. At the very least that person has demonstrated a willingness to bend the rules to advantage. Make sure you heed the surveyor's words, and I might stop paying much attention to the seller. I would also make sure you're willing to walk away. Justin - O'day Owner's Web
I agree with the others; this is unorthodox at best. I submit that a person engaging in one questionable behavior is likely to be engaged in another. At the very least that person has demonstrated a willingness to bend the rules to advantage. Make sure you heed the surveyor's words, and I might stop paying much attention to the seller. I would also make sure you're willing to walk away. Justin - O'day Owner's Web
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Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
The model year is what the HIN says it is
I've replaced everything but the hull on my 1980 boat since I bought her in '96...but that doesn't make it a '96 model boat, just an exceptionally well-found 1980 boat that would bring top dollar for a 1980 boat. The seller prob'ly isn't trying to pull anything shady, just--like a lot of sellers--thinks his boat is worth more than it is and is trying to justify his reasoning....I've seen similar logic in ads for 2-5 year old boats that compare their asking price with the price of a new one. The "book" isn't the final word...there are many factors that determine the value of any particular hull--fresh water compared to salt, local economic conditions, how competitive the market is for new ones (a single Hunter dealer within 100 miles is gonna get higher prices than dealers in a market where several compete, keeping the local prices of used boats up too), whether a particular "brand" or model is hot locally or virtually unknown... All of the above and more can send the local "fair market value" of any boat well above or well below BUC or NADA values. Only a survey will establish the true local market value for it. Trouble is, this particular seller won't believe any buyer's survey until he's seen several from different surveyors, so he's not likely to come down any time soon. Then again, maybe the d'd thing WILL survey high. Only one way to find out...make what you consider a reasonable offer--subject to survey and sea trial.
I've replaced everything but the hull on my 1980 boat since I bought her in '96...but that doesn't make it a '96 model boat, just an exceptionally well-found 1980 boat that would bring top dollar for a 1980 boat. The seller prob'ly isn't trying to pull anything shady, just--like a lot of sellers--thinks his boat is worth more than it is and is trying to justify his reasoning....I've seen similar logic in ads for 2-5 year old boats that compare their asking price with the price of a new one. The "book" isn't the final word...there are many factors that determine the value of any particular hull--fresh water compared to salt, local economic conditions, how competitive the market is for new ones (a single Hunter dealer within 100 miles is gonna get higher prices than dealers in a market where several compete, keeping the local prices of used boats up too), whether a particular "brand" or model is hot locally or virtually unknown... All of the above and more can send the local "fair market value" of any boat well above or well below BUC or NADA values. Only a survey will establish the true local market value for it. Trouble is, this particular seller won't believe any buyer's survey until he's seen several from different surveyors, so he's not likely to come down any time soon. Then again, maybe the d'd thing WILL survey high. Only one way to find out...make what you consider a reasonable offer--subject to survey and sea trial.
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GERRY HULL
BUILD YEAR VS. MODEL YEAR
Look on the molded in HIN [hull identification number] on the starboard transom. 14 digits. Look at the last 3 digits. If, for example, the last three read "898" it is a 98 model [ last two] and a 98 build [the first digit] Another example... "687" this is a 1987 model laid up in August or later of 1986 but qualifying as a 87 model. Since it takes time to finish aboat the model year vs. the build year exists. Practically speaking, once the boat gets to be 5 years or so old it makes no practical difference in value. Here it is condition, condition, condition ! Equipment counts for little unless it is high quality and recent. A long list of old equipment can largely be discounted.
Look on the molded in HIN [hull identification number] on the starboard transom. 14 digits. Look at the last 3 digits. If, for example, the last three read "898" it is a 98 model [ last two] and a 98 build [the first digit] Another example... "687" this is a 1987 model laid up in August or later of 1986 but qualifying as a 87 model. Since it takes time to finish aboat the model year vs. the build year exists. Practically speaking, once the boat gets to be 5 years or so old it makes no practical difference in value. Here it is condition, condition, condition ! Equipment counts for little unless it is high quality and recent. A long list of old equipment can largely be discounted.
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Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
You raise an interesting point, Gerry...
Some sellers seem to think that a new engine or a complete new set of sails adds the cost of 'em to the value of the boat....it doesn't. If the boat hadn't needed 'em, the seller wouldn't have spent the money to replace 'em...and all it can do is move the overall condition of the boat up from "engine and sails are completely shot and need replacing" to "engine and sails in excellent condition" in a survey. Even if any equipment that's been replaced or added is a major upgrade from the original, it might add a tiny bit to the value of the boat, but nowhere near the entire cost of it. For instance, I added an icemaker to my boat: retail value, nearly $1,000. But it only adds about $100 to the survey value of my boat...however, it does make the boat more appealing, and thus will help it to sell faster, than an identical model that doesn't have one. But while engines that don't run or tattered sails subtract from the value of a boat, the fact that the engines or sails--or fresh water pump or toilet--happen to be brand new don't add a penny more than older engines or sails or other equipment in excellent condition.
Some sellers seem to think that a new engine or a complete new set of sails adds the cost of 'em to the value of the boat....it doesn't. If the boat hadn't needed 'em, the seller wouldn't have spent the money to replace 'em...and all it can do is move the overall condition of the boat up from "engine and sails are completely shot and need replacing" to "engine and sails in excellent condition" in a survey. Even if any equipment that's been replaced or added is a major upgrade from the original, it might add a tiny bit to the value of the boat, but nowhere near the entire cost of it. For instance, I added an icemaker to my boat: retail value, nearly $1,000. But it only adds about $100 to the survey value of my boat...however, it does make the boat more appealing, and thus will help it to sell faster, than an identical model that doesn't have one. But while engines that don't run or tattered sails subtract from the value of a boat, the fact that the engines or sails--or fresh water pump or toilet--happen to be brand new don't add a penny more than older engines or sails or other equipment in excellent condition.
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