top side handrails

[sailmandan]

Just removed my deck teak handrails on my yami 33. Worn and in need of a rebed.
Found 4 wood screws and 4 machine screws holding them on. Not a lot of confidence in that set up.

Has anybody done anything different or found better ways to screw the hand rails down? Maybe drilled all the way to the inside of the cabin using washers and cap nuts as backing.

Thanks Dan

 

[Tally Ho]

Were the machine screws through the deck?

I don’t have a Yamaha, but on my O’Day 322, the teak handrails were through bolted through the deck and washers and nuts in the inside. The O’Day 322 has a hard liner on the ceiling, and each bolt had a round cutlut in the ceiling liner, with a plastic plug to cover the hole. In fact, most of the cabin top fitting were finished this way (jib tracks, etc.)

I removed them once and what a pain to get them back on…bolts were different lengths depending on location…had to trim some to get the plugs back in place.

Wood screws would concern me.

Greg

 

[jssailem]

I have teak handrails on my cabin top. I had leaks develop after 48 years. I took the bungs out of the rails to get at the machine screwtops. I went inside and removed all the nuts/washers holding the rails. Some of the rail feet had a bit of stubborn adhesive caulk. With a putty knife and a little heat, I could free the rails from the boat. I took the rails to the garage, where I refinished them. I reinstalled them with new machine screws of a proper size, washers, and nylock nuts. I drilled and epoxied the screw holes. I used BedIt Buytl Tape to bed the rails on the cabin top. They came out looking great.

I goofed when finishing the rails. I varnished the rails before installation. I discovered when you replace the bungs, you have to cut them off. Then you sand them. The sanding of the bungs smooth leaves a light patch on the multi-layers of varnish that I had applied. Next time, I will leave the rails unfinished. I'll finish them after the rails are installed and the bungs are inserted and finished. When I next apply varnish to the rails, that will correct the issue.

 

[sailmandan]

Thanks for your thoughts. Most boats have backing washers and nuts for the handrails. I was wondering what other Yamaha owners have discovered.
I may drill all the way through and use a small hole saw to fit the backing washer and nut through the inside liner.
Using plugs is a good thought to finish off the look on the liner.
Thanks
Dan

 

[jssailem]

Using plugs is a good thought to finish off the look on the liner.

That would resolve the issue in the cabin. When you put the screws in the rail, the screw is counter sunk. This leaves a hole in the top of the rail. A wood bung of the hole diameter fills the hole making the rail look solid.

 

[mermike]

I'm not 100% sure. I thought the handrails were through bolted from the inside, with the nuts under the bungs in the rail. Access is under the overhead panels. I'll check when I get back to the boat later this week.

 

[jssailem]

Mermike I think we are talking about the same thing. Perhaps my words were confusing.

On my boat, the rails are on the top deck of the cabin (outside, not inside). The screw head goes through the handrail through the deck into the interior cabin, and a washer and nut secure the rail. On the outside, the screw head is still exposed in its counter sunk hole. It is there I place a wood bung to cover the screw head.

 

[jssailem]

Interior rails can be more challenging as no one wants a series of exposed nuts running across the cabin outside deck top.

 

[mermike]

JS - there was something odd about the Yamaha rail installation, but I don't remember what it was. Might have been that it looked like a PITA to remove them, so I promptly ignored the situation. They're at the point where I can no longer do so.

 

[jssailem]

You have rails installed inside the cabin. I think I remember looking at their orientation. Right above them do you have rails on the outside? If so I would suspect the bolts go through and terminate in the other rail.

 

[mermike]

Can't remember. I'm heading out tomorrow for the PTWBF. I'll check in a couple of days.

 

[jssailem]

I may just drive up there to check it out. I am in Salem working on the steps. Trying to finish shaping them and getting a few coats of varnish covering them. I have been asked to join a luncheon in Sammamish on Sunday. I'll let you know how the project progresses.

 

[Riptide33]

Mine (Yami33) are bolted with washers and nuts on the inside. The nuts are located just behind the cabin handrails. I can send pictures if needed.

 

[kappykaplan]

You have rails installed inside the cabin. I think I remember looking at their orientation. Right above them do you have rails on the outside? If so I would suspect the bolts go through and terminate in the other rail.

This is what was done on my boat.

 

[sailmandan]

Mermike...I removed the overhead panels and found the bolts do not go all the way through cabin top.
So interesting.

On each side starting aft on the handrail.....wood screws are in postions 1,3,5,7.
Machine screws are in positions 2,4,6,8.

Now on a side note, my lifeline stanchion bases are machine screwed into a plate that is glassed in the core. I can see it inside underneath one of the stanchions. Most boats I have seen use thru bolt to nuts and washers for backing plates. Yamaha went to extreme effort glassing in backing plates and tapping for machine screws.

I am wondering if there is a screw in the cabin top core that the machine screws(2,4,6,8) screw into? Or maybe a previous owner ran out of wood screws....doubt that!

I will try to figure out a way to check for nuts in the core....they of course are hard to see.

 

[sailmandan]

Riptide....that is what I think I will end up doing. Drill all the way through and finish off with cap nuts and washers. The liner seems to be flush against the inside the core. Except in the closet and head, the liner seems to have space between the liner and cabin top core because it sounds hollow when tapped on.
Have you ever removed your outside hand rails? And how far forward do the handrail bolts/nuts protrude through the cabin top...into the closet and head?

 

[sailmandan]

Riptide....I would appreciate pics.

 

[Riptide33]

I will have to take alook at where the forward hand rail were. The last owner removed them. This is the only Pic I have on hand. You can see the acron nuts a washer behind the hand rail

 

[jssailem]

You can see the acron nuts a washer behind the hand rail

I wonder if that was the original design or an expedient way to install handrails on the outside. The spacing does not appear to follow the boat builder's attention to detail.

 

[sailmandan]

Perfect...that is what I thought I could do.
It would be interesting to see how far forward they go.
I am going to sit and think.
The handrails are on such a slant that they get worked pretty hard.
Also going to think how many handrails are needed on top.
At some point they become toe trippers. Going to go sailing and see what is needed.
Riptide...thanks so much
Dan