Looking at buying a 1977 27 Hunter. Any advice from experience with this boat? Please help someone new to Hunters. Moving up from a Catalina 22, and hoping to get a good boat.
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What I Found on C-Pearl (My '77 H27)
We bought our 1977 H27 two years ago, and are very pleased with it. It's a good boat, well-concieved and well-built. It's just right for our kind of sailing (Columbia River). Of course, it goes without saying that you should have it surveyed by a reputable surveyor. Based on our experience, here are some things to look for. These aren't necessarily Hunter-specific. They are C-Pearl-specific, though
* Seacocks. The originals were brass gate valves (open/close with a knob instead of a lever), which are ackward to open and close in the tight spaces they are in. Ours were way beyond their life, very corroded and in need of replacement. If the previous owner has replaced yours with ball cocks (open/close with a lever), you're ahead of the game. * Mast compression. Look at the cabin top at the base of the mast for cracks in the fiberglass for evidence of the mast compressing into the top. * Standing rig. As with any boat, check the condition of the stays and shrouds and their associated hardware, including the amount of slack taken up over time with the turnbuckles. If you can, hang a weight from the main halyard and see where it plumbs relative to the mast. If the mast is raked back about 4 degrees, as it should be, the weight will touch (or point to) the boom about 6 or 7 inches from the mast. If it does, then look at the backstay and forestay turnbuckles to see how far in or out they are cranked. Also, if the rig seems plumb side-to-side, check the shroud tensions and the turnbuckles to see how far in they had to be tightened to achieve plumb. If the stay and shroud turnbuckles don't have much more range left to tighten, either the mast has compressed quite a bit into the cabin top, or the standing rigging has stretched out, or both. * Evidence of mold, mildew, or water marks on the fabric covering the inside of the hull. Especially if you see water marks, you will want to look for leaking ports, toe rails, or other opportunities for water to enter the cabin. Leaking ports seem to be a well-worn discussion around here. * Ventilation. The '77 27 came with a couple of different portlight configurations. Ours came with large deadlights (non-opening). The head and v-berth have smaller deadlights. The only ventilation on my model is from the v-berth hatch through to the companion way hatch. Other '77 27's came with smaller ports, but they were opening types, offering better ventilation options at the cost of less daylight brightening the cabin. Both types are equally prone to leaking, as on most any boat, but my choice would definately be for the smaller opening type. * Drip rate on the stuffing box. Check this without the engine running, and again with the engine running and the prop turning. If it drips faster than about one drop per minute, you will want to ask about when the last time it was repacked or retightened (or even its history of being repacked). This is for a general idea of the condition of the shaft. * General condition of the engine. The 8hp Yanmar they came with is a good, tough little hard-working engine. Maybe a bit underpowered for the boat, but it does its job pretty reliably. Look for the usual things you would check on any engine, such as oil leaks, color of the exhaust under load, condition of hoses, etc. * Various drainage areas into the bilge. You will want to see that the hidden areas will drain into the bilge to keep them dry. For example, under the settees, under the icebox, under the stuffing box (but not under the engine), behind the head, etc. My boat has good drainage under one settee, but not under the other. Very bothersome. * Bottom paint and blisters. When you have it hauled for survey, pay close attention to what the surveyor says about the paint, and especially the blisters. Large (quarter-sized or larger) blisters, can indicate water damage 3 or more layers down into the fiberglass. That spells ca-ching, ca-ching to your boat repair yard. If there are just a few and they are small, going only into the first layer, they can be dealt with relatively inexpensively at bottom paint time. By the way, if you are buying the boat in salt water and are moving it to fresh water, as we did, blister development accelerates due to the differential in salinity (osmosis, dontcha know), so those few little pea-sized blisters you see at survey will develop rather quickly into larger ones. Ca-ching, ca-ching. * Placement of the traveller. This certainly is not a deal-breaking thing, and can be changed, but it may effect your sailing enjoyment. The 27 came with two (possibly three, but I'm not sure) main sheet placements, so yours could be in any of these places: traveller aft of the tiller, double purchases on the cabin top (no traveller), and possibly a traveller aft of the companion way. Ours has the traveller behind the tiller. This gives the best performance, since there is better mechanical advantage on the boom and the least stress on the traveller and purchase. However, it is the least convenient for the comfort of anyone in the cockpit. If you don't sweep them off the boat with the tiller, the main sheet might do the trick for you . Well, these are just a few things that sprang to mind. I'm sure others will have more to add. Good luck with finding your boat. Hunters are great boats. - Jim
We bought our 1977 H27 two years ago, and are very pleased with it. It's a good boat, well-concieved and well-built. It's just right for our kind of sailing (Columbia River). Of course, it goes without saying that you should have it surveyed by a reputable surveyor. Based on our experience, here are some things to look for. These aren't necessarily Hunter-specific. They are C-Pearl-specific, though
* Seacocks. The originals were brass gate valves (open/close with a knob instead of a lever), which are ackward to open and close in the tight spaces they are in. Ours were way beyond their life, very corroded and in need of replacement. If the previous owner has replaced yours with ball cocks (open/close with a lever), you're ahead of the game. * Mast compression. Look at the cabin top at the base of the mast for cracks in the fiberglass for evidence of the mast compressing into the top. * Standing rig. As with any boat, check the condition of the stays and shrouds and their associated hardware, including the amount of slack taken up over time with the turnbuckles. If you can, hang a weight from the main halyard and see where it plumbs relative to the mast. If the mast is raked back about 4 degrees, as it should be, the weight will touch (or point to) the boom about 6 or 7 inches from the mast. If it does, then look at the backstay and forestay turnbuckles to see how far in or out they are cranked. Also, if the rig seems plumb side-to-side, check the shroud tensions and the turnbuckles to see how far in they had to be tightened to achieve plumb. If the stay and shroud turnbuckles don't have much more range left to tighten, either the mast has compressed quite a bit into the cabin top, or the standing rigging has stretched out, or both. * Evidence of mold, mildew, or water marks on the fabric covering the inside of the hull. Especially if you see water marks, you will want to look for leaking ports, toe rails, or other opportunities for water to enter the cabin. Leaking ports seem to be a well-worn discussion around here. * Ventilation. The '77 27 came with a couple of different portlight configurations. Ours came with large deadlights (non-opening). The head and v-berth have smaller deadlights. The only ventilation on my model is from the v-berth hatch through to the companion way hatch. Other '77 27's came with smaller ports, but they were opening types, offering better ventilation options at the cost of less daylight brightening the cabin. Both types are equally prone to leaking, as on most any boat, but my choice would definately be for the smaller opening type. * Drip rate on the stuffing box. Check this without the engine running, and again with the engine running and the prop turning. If it drips faster than about one drop per minute, you will want to ask about when the last time it was repacked or retightened (or even its history of being repacked). This is for a general idea of the condition of the shaft. * General condition of the engine. The 8hp Yanmar they came with is a good, tough little hard-working engine. Maybe a bit underpowered for the boat, but it does its job pretty reliably. Look for the usual things you would check on any engine, such as oil leaks, color of the exhaust under load, condition of hoses, etc. * Various drainage areas into the bilge. You will want to see that the hidden areas will drain into the bilge to keep them dry. For example, under the settees, under the icebox, under the stuffing box (but not under the engine), behind the head, etc. My boat has good drainage under one settee, but not under the other. Very bothersome. * Bottom paint and blisters. When you have it hauled for survey, pay close attention to what the surveyor says about the paint, and especially the blisters. Large (quarter-sized or larger) blisters, can indicate water damage 3 or more layers down into the fiberglass. That spells ca-ching, ca-ching to your boat repair yard. If there are just a few and they are small, going only into the first layer, they can be dealt with relatively inexpensively at bottom paint time. By the way, if you are buying the boat in salt water and are moving it to fresh water, as we did, blister development accelerates due to the differential in salinity (osmosis, dontcha know), so those few little pea-sized blisters you see at survey will develop rather quickly into larger ones. Ca-ching, ca-ching. * Placement of the traveller. This certainly is not a deal-breaking thing, and can be changed, but it may effect your sailing enjoyment. The 27 came with two (possibly three, but I'm not sure) main sheet placements, so yours could be in any of these places: traveller aft of the tiller, double purchases on the cabin top (no traveller), and possibly a traveller aft of the companion way. Ours has the traveller behind the tiller. This gives the best performance, since there is better mechanical advantage on the boom and the least stress on the traveller and purchase. However, it is the least convenient for the comfort of anyone in the cockpit. If you don't sweep them off the boat with the tiller, the main sheet might do the trick for you . Well, these are just a few things that sprang to mind. I'm sure others will have more to add. Good luck with finding your boat. Hunters are great boats. - JimWater in the deck core
Jim's response is so complete, that I will just hit one hight point: You need a really good moisture survey of the deck and cabin roof. After 26 years, some seepage of water into the coring used to stiffen these structures will cause rot, and disappearance of the wood core. (end grain balsa on our '77 h27.) This, in turn, could lead to a number of symptoms, depending where it occurs: - Collapse of the mast step, forcing the cabin roof and liner down around the compression post, and associated arch. - Leaks around the portlights. - Wobbly stanchions. The stanchions on our boat were remounted before we bought her, while we redid the mast step last year. I think most of the other possible issues are pretty easy to spot. Check the owner reviews, and some other recent posts on the same subject. David Lady Lillie
Jim's response is so complete, that I will just hit one hight point: You need a really good moisture survey of the deck and cabin roof. After 26 years, some seepage of water into the coring used to stiffen these structures will cause rot, and disappearance of the wood core. (end grain balsa on our '77 h27.) This, in turn, could lead to a number of symptoms, depending where it occurs: - Collapse of the mast step, forcing the cabin roof and liner down around the compression post, and associated arch. - Leaks around the portlights. - Wobbly stanchions. The stanchions on our boat were remounted before we bought her, while we redid the mast step last year. I think most of the other possible issues are pretty easy to spot. Check the owner reviews, and some other recent posts on the same subject. David Lady Lillie
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