Stress Cracking Along The Hull Just Below The Waterline and The Rudder Shaft

[jmcdowel]

Hi All,
Long time listener, first time poster. I'm currently looking at purchasing a 1985 Beneteau First 375 (asking is 32k CAD) and recently did a walk around with the surveryor. One potentially major issue was the presence of what appear to be stress cracks all along the hull just under the waterline and also around the rudder. Surveyor hadn't really seen that before and couldn't conclude its cause (see attached photos). The vessel has never run aground or struck anything to my knowledge. Wondering is anyone has seen this type of damage before and if they found it to be more cosmetic or an indicator of more serious structural issues.

Thanks for the insights!

 

[jssailem]

looking at... a 1985 Beneteau First 375

37 years old... There are bound to be some age lines. They have not yet invented botox for boats.

Stress cracks (if that is what they are called) happen because the boat has experienced some stress. This can come in many forms, grounding is one of the usual suspects. Added to the list are sailing the boat to her limits, bashing into a dock, being in a violent storm, surviving extreme temperatures.

When deciding to purchase a mature boat, I consider all of the above and then examine the boat to identify if the possibilities create a risk to the boats survival in the waters I plan to explore. Is there greater damage hidden inside the boat from the surface blemishes seen on the outside.

There is no general rule that stress cracks on the outside of a 37 year old boat mean it is going to sink in the next year. On the other hand if inspecting the inside of the hull you find evidence of a leak or fractured supports/frames then the external symptoms were a lead to the internal damage.

The cracks around the rudder tube may be just age, or it may be from high stress put on the rudder by a previous owner. Inspection of the rudder systems is warranted to rule out any issues.

Good luck.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

not an uncommon occurrence on an old boat. Hard to know without opening up some of the cracks to determine depth and water/moisture penetration of the core which isn’t likely going to happen with a boat you don’t yet own.
Are we safe to assume the surveyor inspected the interior hull structure and surface and didn’t find any signs of cracking throughout?

 

[SEMPERAVANTI41]

37 year old boat that has never run aground? Somehow I doubt that. I don't think a grounding has caused all these cracks, but maybe the boat has reached the end of it's useful life.

 

[jmcdowel]

Thanks for the comments thus far. Its true, I can't speak to the past history wrt to impacts or groundings. Closer inspection doesn't show evidence of delam from the underlying fiberglass and looking into the bilge, there is no cracking visible or anything afoul with the stringers. Keel bolts are in fair condition with more rust than I'd like to see - so obviously meticulous bilge cleaning was not on "to-do" roster for some time and they were in contact with water, sea water or otherwise. Many have suggested this is stress occurring from resting in the cradle, and indeed the boat has been used sparingly for the last several years, and the cracking is only as deep as the gelcoat and cosmetic as many like to say. I've got the seller to come down a fair amount in price to reflect these problems, which is a start - obviously the boat is worth zero it sinks to the bottom, but it seems few can say with 100% certainty what the full story is. I'll let the fiberglass guy quote me a scary number for now and think on it a bit more.

 

[jssailem]

If the rest of the boat - The rigging, the sails, the engine, the interior the electronics all look like they have been replaced and in serviceable condition then this might be a good boat for you.

No mature boat is going to be in perfect condition, that would be like finding a Unicorn in the marina.

If you have a fair price that you can live with and you still have funds for a cruising budget, then perhaps this is the boat for you.

 

[Hollyberry]

Apparently those stress cracks in the gelcoat are a 'known Beneteau' thing.. our boat has them too, it's a '91. Pretty much cosmetic, I think, barring other obvious evidence of impact or collision.
You could spend a lot of money having someone 'fix' it..... or not...

Seems like a lot of boat for $32K CAD. Great layout. Lead keel? or cast iron? The latter would concern me more (from a maintenance perspective although it is manageable)
.

 

[jmcdowel]

Thanks Hollyberry, I was curious if any others had noticed these cracks in particular. Otherwise the boat is fair condition with nothing major worrying the inspector (some deck cracks around the hardware, aging keel bolts and a rudder bearing replacement are two main items on the repair list, but not hair on fire problems - I'll just have it dealt with this season because I'm particular). The keel is iron with a few rust spots, but in otherwise good condition. And of course there's the headliner that will need to get removed overtime. At the current price, its looks more and more like we're going to buy ourselves a project for the summer.

 

[jmcdowel]

For those interested and willing to offer advice and thoughts on the purchase, I'm attaching the survey I had done (with personal details redacted for privacy). Negotiated price is 25k Canadian Dollars

 

[SEMPERAVANTI41]

How is it possible to ascertain the value of a 37 year old boat, without starting and running the engine? Did the surveyor check the operation of the GPS and other electrical items? Did the surveyor measure the moisture content of the hull & deck?

 

[jmcdowel]

Boat motor does turn on. That wasnt done by the surveyor. Walking around with the surveyor, the hull is solid glass with no signs of delam and hammer tested with no issue especially in area where the gelcoat cracking can be seen. Deck is solid with no soft spots or signs of high moisture content. The gps us functioning. The boat is on the hard, so wind,depth speed etc couldnt be tested other than they operate. Radar was missing, so thats being looked for. And the wheel attachment for the autohelm is also missing.

 

[Hollyberry]

As I said earlier, the iron keel is an issue - esp if there seems to be questionable factors - such as VERY rusty keelbolts. That's scaring me a bit.
The headliners Beneteau used in that era were a bad idea. Our boat had had most of it removed already and replaced with carpet - another bad idea. We spent last winter addressing those issues and others... the results can be seen here:

Mods to our 35s5

Our recently purchased B 35s5 was something of a project boat. Previous owners had made mods that didn't suit us very well. First thing was having our son (a marine electrician) spend a month removing dead wiring, relocating/upgrading batteries, adding forced air heat and a windlass as well as...

forums.sailboatowners.com

Quite happy with things now... Good luck.

 

[jmcdowel]

Thanks Hollyberry, the keel bolts are number one on the repair list before it go in the water. Waiting on a repair estimate for that.

 

[Mechone]

I have the stress cracks too its a beneteau thing ,if gelcoat is applied too thick it will crack as long as there is no delam . My buddy owns the same boat we won a 50 mile race last year on it . That is very cheap for that boat in todays market especally in Canada the boat would be more the 40K to 55K range. He replaced his keel bolts first thing , I believe he had to cut to access some ,he also had rudder play, the fiberglass pocket wears not the bearing so replaciing the bearing may not give you results your looking for ,the pocket must be glassed to shrink bearing. His keel as is mine is cast ,we both had rust every year on haul out ,until we added teardrop anodes one each side of keel . That was 4 years ago neither of us has had rust since. Check the rudder for moisture very common. I believe your surveyor is way off the mark on price same boat in US is 35,000 which is 46,000 cdn and Canadian market is hot for sailboats my boat has gone up 20k then what I paid for it . My neighbor on dock paid 60 k for a 331 4 years ago and sold it in 2 days for 91k

 

[jmcdowel]

Thanks Mechone, this is what'd heard and discovered through my research, but I'm most glad to hear firsthand experience from owners. Spoke to several fiberglass repair and they all said there's no delam and it would be a waste of money for the cosmetic repair.

Were able to source new bolts or have them machined?

She's set to be trucked and delivered by the end of June, so now I've got the time to find the specs and plan the bolt replacement.

 

[jssailem]

it would be a waste of money for the cosmetic repair.

Tell that to the owners of mature cars, trophy wives, or boat owners who like their boat to share the bling they give their significant other.

Money is spent never wasted on a boat.