I have an ODay 25 and would like to know how to prevent the boom from flopping over to the side while raising and lowering the mast. I saw a picture in the manual that shows two plates attached to the shrouds but I do not have those. Does anyone have a better way? I would like to do this with my wife helping me. I would appreciate any input.
Stepping the Mast
- Thread starter Steve Melford
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My O'Day 25 has the triangular plates on my side stays We raise our mast from the cockpit with the mast cast forward and the boom attached in a gin pole fashion.
A guy I know uses 2 small diameter lines from the boom out to each side and attached to cleats. He says this keeps the boom from flopping to either side.
I would think that once you put your (gin pole?) lifting system under weight (raising the mast) the boom should stay in line.
I'm somewhat new to this so maybe others will have a better idea.
A guy I know uses 2 small diameter lines from the boom out to each side and attached to cleats. He says this keeps the boom from flopping to either side.
I would think that once you put your (gin pole?) lifting system under weight (raising the mast) the boom should stay in line.
I'm somewhat new to this so maybe others will have a better idea.
Hi Steve,
I would suggest that you install two pad eyes on your deck, one on each side for pivot bridles as I have done. One side of the pivot bridles can hook on to these pad eyes, and you'll need to put a small stainless steel shackle in between the toggles of your side stay turnbuckles on each side of your boat for the second connection of the pivot bridles.
Pivot bridles are "Y" shaped and they consist of 1/4" braid with a large stainless steel ring in the center, and snap hooks. These items can be purchased at any hardware store or Lowe's.
The stainless steel ring wants to come even with the pivot point of your mast Tabernacle. Then you need to make up two even bridles to go from the end of your boom to the rings on the pivot bridles. This is what keeps the boom straight. I would even go a step further and build a mast yoke out of wood that can be clamped to your mast within reaching distance, and run a set of temporary stays(baby stays) from small eye bolts on each side of the mast yoke, to the pivot bridle rings.
As far as installing the pad eyes go; it going to take some careful planning to get them in the right place. When I first installed my pad eyes to my deck, I screwed up and didn't place them far enough out from the centerline of my mast in relation to the small shackles connected to my turnbuckle toggles on both sides. Consequently what happened was, one side of my pivot bridles is longer than the other side. It still worked, but I had to remember that the short ropes on my pivot bridles needed to go on the pad eyes in order for the rings to come right. I relocated my pad eyes last year and even though I had to re drill holes and fill the other holes, I feel it was worth it because I want it to be right. You want the pivot bridles to be even. That way, there's never any guess work about which way they have to go.
What you can probably do right now is make up a set of bridles out of rope to go from the end of your boom to connect into the top of your turnbuckles on each side which are closest to the bow of your boat and more in line aftwartships to your mast. Jeff, one of our yacht club members who has an O'Day 25 without triangular plates on his stays, does this and it seems to work for him. You may need to loosen or disconnect the other two stays, I'm not certain. Check your mast raising directions for more info on that. What really complicates this whole procedure is the furler. You need someone to hold and guide it with the mast as it goes up or down. Always have the wind coming directly from the bow when you raise/lower from the bow and make sure that the boat is level. A wind coming from the side could blow the mast over.
Personally, I don't like raising a mast from the bow. I've been raising my mast from the stern for many years now. Today I use a stainless steel Gin Pole to raise the mast with my furler connected, and I do this all by myself. A temporary mast crutch is needed on the stern rail in order to support the mast and allow you to pin the Tabernacle. The wind needs to be coming directly from the stern and the boat needs to be level.
If you need pics and info on this, send me an email and I'll be glad to get them to you. sailtrinkka1986@verizon.net All I know is, Jeff is able to raise/lower his mast on his OD 25 by connecting the boom bridles to the tops of his turnbuckles. I've seen him do it last year. He says that the mast kind of binds a little when it goes up and he needs to lift it a little by hand to get it started. This is probably because the pivot point at the turnbuckles is a little off center, but it works.
The mast yoke that you can build to hold your temporary stays can be a very simple construction of wood to fit the mast nice and snug using a bolt and wing nut to make it tighter. It doesn't have to be as fancy as mine.
Joe
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If you have these triangular plates on your boat, you're in like Flynn. It's true that when you connect your main sheet to the boom and put some tension on it, the boom will straighten out, but the bridles that attach to your plates from the end of the boom will give your mast a little more lateral stability when it's being raised/lowered. I would suggest that if you want more lateral stability in your mast raising, that you build a mast yoke with eye bolts attached to it, and add a bridle to each of the eye bolts to your triangular plates. This would really make that mast stable. The MacGregor people have been setting their boats up with baby stay attachments for years. Only, the decks on the Macs are flat and are even with the mast Tabernacle. So consequently they can get by with just one attachment plate on each side of the boat for the baby stays. Pivot bridles are not needed. For the mast attachment, the Mac people are using a bent tang on each side of the mast held in place with a 3/8" bolt which is within reaching distance. Not something I'd want to install on my mast, but it works for their boats. I have internal halyards on my mast and I think I'll stick with my mast yoke for attaching the baby stays. Here's a site that will give you fellows a better understanding of mast raising and pivot bridle set up. Check it out.
http://slowflight.net/upgrades/tips-GinPole.html This fellow's mast attachment for his baby stays involves using the Main Halyard and a quick link in the sail track. I used this idea up to this year and it works, but it's too much of a hassle to mess with halyards. I used a regular metal bail type sail slide in place of the quick link. My friend Wayne on the other hand, built his mast yoke out of a combination of wood and metal with a bolt with a round knob to make it tighter, and it works just great. These are pics I took of Wayne's mast raising rig compliments of my friend Wayne. When I first saw him raise his mast at the club dock with the furler attached to the Gin Pole, all by himself, it just blew my mind. I made up my mind right then and there that now I can have a roller furler on my boat and be able to raise my mast by myself too. Wayne uses a small boat winch to raise his mast and I use my boom vang with a longer line on it.
Joe
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We have two guys in our club that use the boom for a Gin Pole to raise the mast from the bow on their boats. One guy has an O'Day 26 and the other an O'Day 25. They both seem to favor it. The guy with the 26 built a special mast crutch with a roller on it for his bow pulpit. This allows him to roll his mast forward. When he runs his mast out, he needs to hold his mast down at the mast hinge until he gets the Tabernacle pinned because the mast is a little top heavy when you raise it from the bow which is not the case if he were to raise it from the stern.
There are a few advantages to raising a mast from aft. When you get ready to trailer your boat to the ramp, you can leave the mast tied to the mast crutches with the mast track pointing down, with all your stays connected to the chain plates, save the fore stay. If you do a lot of trailering, you don't have to worry about dirt collecting in the mast groove. The mast is always ready to be slid back to allow you to pin the tabernacle, and it shouldn't be top heavy. The roller furler is on top of the mast and ready to go up easier than if you raise the mast from the bow, and the furler is under the mast.
If you raise your mast from the bow, your tabernacle hinge plate on your mast needs to face aft. If your mast track is facing down, you're going to have to flip the mast over by hand. That means that you'll need to straighten out all your stays and connect them up after you get your mast in position. You're going to need to leave your back stay off until the mast is all the way up. I suppose that this is OK if you're only doing it twice a season. If you take your time, make sure the boat is level and the wind is coming from the right direction, it's very doable and good. Here's some pics of mast raising on Ray's 26, compliments of my friend and fellow club member, Ray. Ray's brother in-law was up from Arizona to assist him in getting it up.
Joe
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Here's my take on it.
http://forums.oday.sailboatowners.com/album.php?albumid=1052
I don't like the idea of stepping the mast from the forward position. When it's laying on the bow pulpit it's way unbalanced. Raising from the stern seems better. That's a good sized mast on the 25. Having it resting on a crutch on the transom makes for a better balance and easier setup and handling. IMHO
Rich
http://forums.oday.sailboatowners.com/album.php?albumid=1052
I don't like the idea of stepping the mast from the forward position. When it's laying on the bow pulpit it's way unbalanced. Raising from the stern seems better. That's a good sized mast on the 25. Having it resting on a crutch on the transom makes for a better balance and easier setup and handling. IMHO
Rich
The problem is that the boom needs to be guyed on each side and the mast step is higher than an attachment point on the side deck by the chainplates unless you use the system that oday offered with the triangular pieces or the setup that Joe came up with.
Rich
Rich
John,
The boom on my boat is 9' long. That doesn't give you much of a choice of how high or low it can be placed on the mast. You would probably need to guy it to your pivot bridles. On the other hand, if you make up your own Gin Pole with a yoke that fits snug to the mast, you could make it to fit for the height you want on the mast, plus you wouldn't need to guy it to anything if you don't have a roller furler. You would need to secure it to your mast with a rope or belt of some kind. I use a bridle on my Gin Pole but Wayne doesn't. He just uses a bridle for his temporary stays which connect to a mast yoke within reaching distance. If you make up your own Gin Pole, you have the option of using a small boat winch attached to it, or you can go the same route I did and use your boom vang with a line that will need to be a little longer than what came with it. Both work fine. I've used my Gin Pole to raise masts on a Bristol 24, a Tanzer 22, and a Hunter 23. It worked fine on each of these boats. It can work provided you can support the mast in the stern with a crutch you can make, a small step ladder, or even two 2X4s bolted together to form a large pair of scissors strapped to the stern rail. Support for the mast is key to stern mast raising/lowering. My new Gin Pole is only 1" stainless steel pipe. My son welded a 1 1/8"X 6" stainless steel pipe to one end and I'm able to put it together with a fast pin to hold it. He welded a stainless steel triangular plate to the end of the Pole to accommodate the shackles for the Jib halyard, the bridles and the boom vang attachment. That triangular plate was originally attached to my back stay for my main sheet attachment to my boom before I changed it over to a traveler.
If you decide to go with a Gin Pole and block and tackle, you're going to need to place the Gin Pole high enough on the mast to make room for your boom vang when the mast is up. If you go with the small boat winch, you can go a little lower with the Gin Pole. If you place the pole too low on the mast, it may be too high to reach the end to connect the boom vang and Jib halyard when the mast is down and ready to go up. This is something you need to consider when making the pole because the pole needs to be within an inch or two from the fore stay when the mast is up. If the pole is a little short, the angle of the block and tackle will have a tendency to pull the Gin Pole yoke off the mast when the mast is up. This is one reason for securing the Gin Pole to the mast. Like the boom on an O'Day 25 or 26, the Gin Pole provides the angle for the mast to be raised from the stern.
One of the biggest reasons why I wouldn't use my boom for a Gin Pole is this; When I trailered my boat for eight years, I always left my sail on my boom with the sail cover on it, stowed in the cabin. After I got my mast up and fore stay connected, all I had to do was go into the cabin and attach my topping lift to the end of my boom and lead it out of the cabin. It's like having an extra set of hands. Once the goose neck is connected to mast, the sail slides can be run into the mast feeder. I still do this to this day. I didn't have a Gin Pole back then and I did it all by hand including getting the mast up by myself. Of course, I didn't have a furler either, so things went a whole lot faster than they do today for me.
Today, that Gin Pole is stored under the settees in the cabin just in case I need to take my mast down because of a 200 year old drawbridge that is constantly breaking down on the Taunton River. Most of the time they can only give me one leaf of that junky old bridge because the guys are always working on it with a cherry picker on a barge. I hope I live long enough to see the new bridge completed next year and be able to use it. :cussing:Joe
That makes sense Joe. Thanks. I'm attracted to any approach that minimizes additional parts so that's why I was asking. I hope you see the new bridge built also!
BTW, does every one here on the forums know that it's really Penny that has all the answers and you just type what she tells you? I've seen her sit behind you on Skype so I'm pretty sure that's what's going on!
Just kidding!!!!
BTW, does every one here on the forums know that it's really Penny that has all the answers and you just type what she tells you? I've seen her sit behind you on Skype so I'm pretty sure that's what's going on!
Just kidding!!!!
BTW, does every one here on the forums know that it's really Penny that has all the answers and you just type what she tells you? I've seen her sit behind you on Skype so I'm pretty sure that's what's going on!
Just kidding!!!!
I like that one John! :dance: I think my wife is jealous of Penny because Penny loves sailing. Actually, Penny is a good First Mate because she never gives me any S*&# when we're out sailing!
Ahoy!
Joe
Just kidding!!!!
I like that one John! :dance: I think my wife is jealous of Penny because Penny loves sailing. Actually, Penny is a good First Mate because she never gives me any S*&# when we're out sailing!
Ahoy!
Joe
thanks to all. I have some great ideas now based on all of your information. I will send pics when I get it completed.
Steve
Steve
Steve,
If you decide to go with the pad eyes, take your time and test out your theories before you drill any holes in your deck. What I did was make up my bridles first by making the ropes of equal length to the rings, and making sure that the Rings came even with the pivot point in the mast. Then I clipped one of the snaps into the small shackle that I inserted between the lowest toggle in my turnbuckle. I took the other snap and connected it to the pad eye and stretched it out the way it would be with the bridle tension on it. Then I marked the deck with a pencil where the pad eye needed to go. It's a matter of just eye balling it and readjusting the ropes to get it right. In theory, if you were to stand athwartships to the centerline of the Port side of your boat with a plumb bob eying where the pivot point on your mast is in relation to your side deck, you'll come up with a centerline. If the distance from the centerline to the small shackle in the toggles is 12" toward the stern, the distance of your pad eye should be 12" from the centerline toward the bow.
I installed some small stainless steel back-up plates in the cabin for these pad eyes, but we really aren't talking about any real heavy strain that will be on them. The strain on the baby stays and the mast yoke wouldn't be any greater than having two of your crew grabbing hold of your mast to steady it as it goes up. These are just some of my thoughts and hopefully you'll get a better understanding of what is involved. Good luck with that and I look forward to seeing the pics when it's done.
Joe
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