Starting Engine on pallet

[cdells]

Happy Easter everyone,

I am just wondering if there are any considerations I am missing before I test my new (to me) engine on pallet. I pulled out my old Westerbeke 21 last year and have been slowly going through the one I bought on ebay while it sits in my garage. I did basic maintenance and cleaned up all the connections on the wiring harness but I am not sure what to do about the alternator. Should I leave it hooked up to the starter solenoid when I test? Do I need to have fuse between the starter solenoid and the positive terminal on the battery? The negative terminal on the battery should just ground to the engine correct? My plan is to run it for a few minutes to make sure the basics are in order before I install the engine and lose access to all the nooks and crannies. Any thoughts appreciated.
SF
Chris

 

[Rich Stidger]

I would connect the engine to the battery just as it would be installed. The alternator should be connected as well to the battery. You can use a remote momentary switch to operate the starter solenoid.
Before attempting a start, I would turn over the engine a couple revolutions by hand just to be sure it isn't frozen or seized.
Attach a hose to the raw water input and let the pump suck out of a bucket.
I'm not familiar with your engine, so I don't know if it is self-priming, so you made need to bleed the injectors.
WATER LOCK HAZARD!! DONT CRANK THE ENGINE FOR MORE THAN 20 SECONDS WHILE THE PUMP IS PULLING WATER OUT OF THE BUCKET. REMOVE THE HOSE IF NECESSARY UNTIL THE ENGINE STARTS.
After it starts you can warm it up and check for proper running temp with an IR thermometer and also verify that the alternator is working.

 

[Rick Webb]

That was something we had to do in Auto Shop class in High School. We Just filled the filter bowl with fuel and used jumper cables between the battery and starter. It'd run for a minute or so. No idea what brand of engine it was.

I'd leave the alternator belt disconnected altogether. Wouldn't worry about coolant for a two-minute run.

Sounds like a fun way to spend an afternoon.

 

[RitSim]

I would expect and handle the fact that the engine will kick sideways during start and possibly run/acceleration. Agree with with Rick above about starter cables and alternator not required. However, I would do the cooling water. Sucking water back into the pistons is not an issue if the water muffler is not there. Hand rotation prior to start is key to avoiding damage from assembly mistakes.

 

[jssailem]

Here is the first fire of our rebuilt 1973 Perkins in the shop.
Battery connected: Positive to the Starter and negative to the engine block
Fuel hose into a gallon of diesel on the floor.
Took awhile to get the timing set. Once that was right there was a few puffs then Varoom.
Ran for less than 3 minutes.

https://forums.sailboatowners.com/attachments/varoom-mp4.216915/

Here is a picture of the engine sitting on the shop table.
Oil in the block. No coolant. Fuel tank attached. Engine started.

 

[cdells]

I think I need to have the belt connected since there is only one and it is what turns the coolant/fresh water pump. I'll report back on how it goes

 

[jssailem]

I have only one belt. I did not use coolant in the engine. Not run longe enough to create any heat.

We drained the oil before we installed the engine into the boat.

When we installed the engine in the boat is when we poured in the coolant and fresh oil into the engine. We also connected the alternator and installed the fan belt making sure we had a good alignment of the belt to the alternator. This took us about 30 minutes to assure.

I would check the raw water pump before you install engine. That was a hiccup in my install. The water pump failed as we drove the boat back to the slip. We had to replace the draw water pump.

 

[Rick Webb]

If you really think you need the coolant flowing just hook up a garden hose.

A few pieces of PVC couplers and adapters could make the connection from the hose to the water pump.

Probably some You Tubes on guys doing this.

 

[Rick Webb]

If you have an electric fuel pump and want to run it for more than a minute or so a small wire from the battery to the fuel pump will power the pump. Then a jumper cable to the block and battery the other cable clamped to the battery then touch it to the starter and vroom varoom.

 

[JoeWhite]

Since the engine is out, I would recommend installing a #8 black wire from alternator ground lug to the engine ground bolt. The alternator grounding bracket bolt does not provide reliable ground. You may find a failed alternator for no apparent reason when you least expect it.

 

[cdells]

Well...it didn't go well. Lots of sparking when I tried to connect the negative terminal to the battery lug. I should have taken the hint but put it on anyway. The key was in the off position and there was a red glow in the alternator and a quick small flame. Burned the diodes I guess? I think I had all the wires going to the right places based on the schematic but maybe the grounding bracket wasn't good like JoeWhite said.
If the diodes are shot then I wonder if I just need to buy a new one or if it could be repaired for cheaper? And if I am going to buy a new one should I updgrade from 50Amp to 70 (or higher). I don't have a huge battery bank but I plan on increasing to 300AH in the future.

 

[jssailem]

Ok. Let’s take this one part at a time.

• a red glow in the alternator and a quick small flame. Burned the diodes I guess?
  • Response. Yes, at least. Maybe also the insulation on the coil wires. It is not going to come back without some shop time.
• I think I had all the wires going to the right places based on the schematic but maybe the grounding bracket wasn't good like JoeWhite said.
  • Response. Let’s not beat ourselves up. Something was not correct and there was a short to ground. Possibly the wires you connected possibly a bad alternator was shipped. Not the end of the world. Based on what you say you likely would have replaced the alternator anyway.
• If the diodes are shot then I wonder if I just need to buy a new one or if it could be repaired for cheaper?
  • Response. You can buy a rebuilt automotive 75 Amp alternator for about $75 depending on the shop and your part of the country. You take the burnt one in and they may give you a core discount. DIY repair requires alternator knowledge that I guess is not in your wheelhouse.
• And if I am going to buy a new one should I updgrade from 50Amp to 70 (or higher). I don't have a huge battery bank but I plan on increasing to 300AH in the future.
  • Response. An Upgrade now, based on your planned increase would be money wisely spent. The Amp value of the alternator is relevant in determining the length of time needed to run your engine charging the your battery bank. There is a second twist to this puzzle. The Amp label (50 amp to 70 or higher) describes peak amps. As the engine heats up the alternator and the alternator heats up due to it producing DC power the Amp output declines (to keep the alternator from burning up). This means it takes longer to charge the 300 amp hour battery bank at 20 amps per hour than at 40 amps per hour.

I think of such projects as systems rather than parts. The Batteries, the alternator, the regulator and the power source (your engine) all need to work in harmony. They can be added over time (phased development of the system) but they need to be sourced so that they compliment the system.

Good luck.

 

[Rich Stidger]

@cdells - All alternators are not the same. Most autotype alternators are spec'ed at peak current when cold. The average current (RMS AMPS) is about 70% of that rating. And after it heats up, the available current decreases more. So a 70A alternator may only source 40A average when hot.
Look for a quality alternator that is spec'ed with a hot temperature.
BUT- be sure to understand what went wrong with your smoked alternator, so that you don't repeat with your new one.

 

[JoeWhite]

Increasing the load on the engine by installing higher output alternator causes increased pressure in the cylinders and increased wear on the piston rings. Consider installing solar panels with mppt charger, it provides free energy. 2 100 watt solar panels will provide 10Amps or more. Sufficient to power your electronics and fridge and charge your battery possibly.

 

[cdells]

Thanks for the great responses guys, I’ve got my work set up for the weekend!

 

[dlochner]

Lots of good suggestions. One missing was the return line for the fuel system. Don't forget it.

 

[TimFromLI]

If you want to start the engine without the alternator try using a "link belt" temporarily. I used one for a few days while my alternator was in the shop. Make it just a little smaller than it will fit easily and then turn the pulley by hand to get it to on the rest of the way. Like a bike chain. Good luck with the alternator, maybe a shop can look at it if they can't fix it, maybe they will have some insight into what went wrong.