Spreader/Steaming Wiring question...

[Team118]

At the end of last season, the spreader/steaming light stopped working.

When I originally rewired the boat, I did not take down the mast so I used the original wiring for the anchor, running, steaming and spreader lights.

The spreader/steaming light looks like the pic below...

I noticed that when it worked, if I turned on the steaming light, I couldn't turn on he spreader light and vice-versa. Now it does not work.

I went up today and the bulbs are fine, so I took the light down. There are three wires coming out of the light, but there are only 2 wires coming out of the mast to the light....I fear one of the wires may broken off and fell back into the mast.

I can get the spreader light to work on my tool bench, but I can't get the steaming light to work. Is this light set up as a three way? Should there be 3 wires coming out of the mast to this light or 2.

If there should be 3 wires, can I rewire the back of the light so that both lights go on at the same time? It will be at least another year before I engage in taking down the mast. If it can be rewired, does anyone have a schematic of this light or suggestions?

Thanks in advance for any thoughts or suggestions.
Chris

 

[KelenE]

I just bought my '85 Catalina 30 last fall and took the mast off when I decommissioned it. I had the same problem with that steaming/spreader light not working. I removed the fixture from the mast, but didn't disconnect the wires, so I'm not sure about your 3 wires from the fixture to the 2 wires coming up the mast. The problem was the ground wire to the spreader light which on mine came in a pigtail from the steaming light. I cleaned all the connections up and it worked. There was a spade connection which needs to be cleaned, too. You may have 2 separate ground wires on your fixture. Good luck!
Jerry

 

[Twice Around]

Hi Team118,
I have recently replaced a 20 year old steaming light with this same fitting (Aqua Series 25). I just installed mine a few weeks ago. This is a 3-wire light, with a common ground. If you only have two wires to work with and aren't dropping the stick and if it were me, I would not wire the spreader light and have a functioning steaming light.

Don't know why the fixture wasn't wired with 3 wires inside a common jacket though, so how would you lose one?

Good Luck.

-Twice Around
'77 C-30 #511
SRFKA4TL

 

[Team118]

The only I assume there should be 3 wires coming out of the mast is because there are 3 wires coming out of the light.

2 of the wires were connected to 2 of the wires on the lamp fixture, the other wire on the light fixture was just hanging there not connected to anything.

I can jury rig the light and get the spreader light(bottom light) to go on no problem, I can't for the life of me get the steaming light to work. The light is ok...

I personally think the wire that broke was the common black ground wire and what is left are the 2 legs for each light. If that's the case, I can always re-route the leg for the spreader and make that a ground wire and at least get the steaming light to work.

If I could get my head around the wiring, I would try to resolder everything so that both lights go. This way I have an under power light and a deck light...

I think I'll take a picture of the back of the light and post it tonight.

Thanks for the advice guys.

...Twice around, my boat is a '77 too, #689. Are you saying that there are only 2 wires that come out of the mast or that there should be 3 (one being the common ground, the other 2 being a yellow and white wire for the lights?)

 

[Twice Around]

mast wiring

My boat does not have the original rig...the first one came down in 1987-ish, but the replacement rig (which has now been up over 20 years) was pretty much wired the same way the original mast was, as far as I can tell.

I took my mast down over the winter for new standing rigging and lots of mast work. My boat had the tractor style headlights on the spreaders (wired separately) & a 2-wire light for the steaming light. I removed the tractor lights, & got the integrated Series 25 light (the same as yours) and re-wired the entire mast this winter (new 3 wire to steaming light), also adding a conduit, to allow for internal halyards and to get rid of the wire slap I 'enjoyed' many nights last summer.

Maybe I am misunderstanding your problem. There should be one ground (-) and two hot (+) wires, one for the spreader & one for the steaming. Can you not get the steaming light to work on a bench? (I believe you said you removed the light from the mast for troubleshooting) I recall that the wiring schematic is not quite what I'd call 'idiot-proof' with this light..the terminals do not all look the same. I have not lit up my lights yet with the mast on sawhorses, but I probably should before stepping.

I hope to be at the mast today after work to continue prepping for stepping next week, maybe I can open up mine and snap a pic of the wiring for you. I'll take a 12 v battery with me as well to check a few things and make sure I am not talking out of my you-know-what!

edit - more random thoughts - What about access to the wiring somewhere else? like the back of the switch panel..that might help too..can you tell which colors are at the switch? - or maybe you have an access panel at the base of the mast? The original wiring goes down into the compression post and there is a 4-prong connector...one common ground for EVERYTHING, and 3 (+) for anchor, spreader, & steaming. what a nightmare to troubleshoot. - I am seeing by re-reading your post that you have done some re-wiring, so maybe we need to start where you stopped and work up?

One more - There are two long screws in the series 25 (#1 Phillips, so be careful) that allow you to pull the base off and get to the insides...maybe one of the wires in there is loose??? - I am minimizing terminals and junctions (especially potentially wet ones that are outside), so I ran my wires straight into the light fixture, and I'll have a big terminal block inside the boat (probably in the head on teh compression post) to eliminate that 4-prong pile of **** .

 

[Twice Around]

Hi team118,

Here is a pic. After my warning, I forgot to take a #1 phillips with me so i couldn't take it apart when I got to the mast today - but I hope I can help you a little bit.

The white wire is the (+) for the spreader light.
The green wire is the (+) for the steaming light.
The black wire (which you can barely see but it terminates at center top of the fixture behind the festoon bulb) is common ground for the two bulbs.

Sorry the forum doesn't let me upload higher res pics.

I will be at the mast many more times prior to putting it up, so let me know if this is not helpful.

 

[Team118]

Thanks for the help Shawn.

The PO replaced the spreaders with the aluminum upgrades and replaced the seperate headlight style speaders with the integrated steaming/spreader light system.

That is is where the failure occured. One of the wires broke and the loose end worked itself back into the mast and is floating around down there somewhere.

I rewired the entire boat with the exception of the forward running lights and the mast lighting in its entirity. But only to where all the wires come together just aft of the galley wall, back in the port storage locker by the AC fusing...assuming most Cat 30's of that era are close. The original lighting I mentioned is spliced into new wiring to a panel that I installed in the cockpit to handle the outisde lighting.

The only thing I can do is either unstep the mast or take the 2 wires that are still outside of the mast and redesiginate them as a positive and negative. That will be no problem, just a question of moving one to the negative bus bar...

It would be nice if I could re-wire the back of the lighting so that both lights work together. Below is a pic of the light. The wire that is circled was the one that was broken clean off. The other 2 were wired but did not work.

On the bench, those 2 wires will light the spreader light only (the bottom round bulb). For the life of me I can't get the festoon bulb to light...it will light if I connect a wire to each end.

Any thoughts?

Again, thanks for answering and then going to your boat and taking the time to do some extra digging for me...

Chris

 

[Twice Around]

Hi Chris,
I do not think that unit is wired correctly. Got a few things out of the office this morning, but I will check back in later to give my $0.02.

P.S. > I threw my #1 Phillips in the truck, so if I have time to swing by the mast today, I'll crack the thing open.:dance:

edit - OK...let's try this..check out my pic below. Even though all three of those wires are the same color - I think I followed them. This is how I'd wire it - also...take a minute and make sure the connections are good & clean up the bulb & metal parts with sandpaper or pocket knife...sometimes those festoon bulbs don't make good contact. And 2nd...if you replace that deck light bulb with a 20watt BA-9S base halogen, you'll get tons more light (& more battery drain).

In case I screwed up the wires, I also labeled the three terminals. Did you try a meter on that bulb...the top of the base looks a little suspect???

Hope this helps.

 

[Team118]

Shawn;

I just got home from work and I'm going to bed! Have to be up in 6 hours...

I'm going to sand the connections and see if I can get my lights to work based on your pic.

I'll let you know tomorrow afternoon!

Thanks
Chris

 

[foolproof]

Wiring Problem

Hey Chris:

What about using the two wires you have to pull three new wires? Simply tie three different color wires to the two that are there, then pull the two wires up and out of the mast, and Voila!, you have the three wires you need to seperate the lights. While you're at it, maybe pull and extra wire or two for any further lighting you may want to add later.

ps I really like the lighting panel in the cockpit. How do you keep it dry?

 

[foolproof]

Shawn got it right

Chris:

It looks like Shawn got the wiring right. There is a common ground, and two seperate wires for the two lights. Check his edits of your picture, and try wiring like he shows. You will definitely need three wires to make it work correctly.

The first picture I got off of Catalina Direct. It doesn't show the spreader light, but you can see which wire is what, and Shawn did get it right.

Mike

 

[Team118]

Mike and Shawn;

Thanks for the help. I did get each of the lights to wok independantly from each other last night. I'll have to rewire the back of the light and then switch one of the legs to make i a negative.

In order to rerun wires, I would have to take out one of the 'post panels' down below to get access to the wiring coming of the mast. That would mean removing the teak plugs, etc. A much bigger job than I'm prepared to do this summer. The marina I'm in is scheduled for some major recostruction next winter and I'm going to have to haul out at another marina. They have the ability to remove the mast, so I'm going to do then. That way I can rewire all of it with LED spreaders, an LED light for Windex, LED anchor lighting, etc.

The light panel is one of those waterproof outdoor swithc panels from Blue Seas. I ran a positive leg from DC panel to the outdoor panel, install a stand alone negative bus that has one leg running to the main common negative bus bar in the engine bay. It controls running lights, spreader, anchor, steaming, knotmeter and depthfinder. This spring I removed the knot and depth and installed Humminbird 587i plotter/fish finde and a new compass with a night light. These 2 will be wired together, so I'll have an extra switch.

I haven't had any issues will leaking water. The negative bar is attached to the chipboard wall that isolates th stern storage area from the port locker.

Thanks
Chris

 

[Twice Around]

Great news Chris.

I've been pretty busy the last couple of weeks, sorry I am late catching up.

I got my boat splashed and the stick re-stepped this weekend. Now I have 20 feet of wire hanging out of the head that I need to run to a power source so I can see if my re-wiring worked. It will be a little while before I get a chance to run it properly to switches/busbars.

Of course, it is pouring down rain here in the Chesapeake for the next three days while I try to get the boat ready for cruising to Baltimore next weekend.