Speed Loss During Tack

[GorillaToast]

Just wondering... How much speed should I expect to lose during a non-racing tack? For example, if I'm doing 3.0 kts going into the tack, is it reasonable to be doing 1.6 kts
when the sails fill again?

Thanks.

 

[Don Guillette]

Gorillatoast: Here's the STANDARD I shoot for in all wind conditions. I have to use the word standard so I don't end up with a bunch of phone calls and emails. I want to complete the tack in under 30 seconds (that's a life time - start counting now from 30 down to zero to see what I mean) and I don't want to lose more than 1 knot of speed. At low speeds, you don't have much to play with so you have to be quick about it. At higher wind speed you can get the job done quicker. If the tack takes longet than 30 seconds a mate has to examine his tacking sequence and improve it.

 

[GorillaToast]

Thanks Don.

I'll count the seconds next time I'm out, but it feels to me I probably finish the tack well under 30. I prepare for the tack by:

1. Wrapping the lazy sheet around its winch
2. Uncleat the working sheet
3. Pushing the tiller away and simultaneously unwrapping the working sheet
4. Waiting for the wind to push the clew through (in light winds this can take a few seconds)
5. Then reeling in the new working sheet while centering the tiller

It would be much more efficient, I know, if I could use both hands to work the sheet, but then I end up turning too far thru the tack.

What would make this work better? Besides getting married to gain 1 crew.

 

[cjb300]

You may want to consider falling off after you complete your tack, allowing the sail to fill and then head up as you trim in the jib.

 

[Chris Patterson]

GT, your tacking procedure sounds exactly like mine. When I come about, I do it sharply though, as to not "lose it" due to lack of speed, or attacking it fast enough. Very interesting subject line though, I'll be real interested in others response. I am in no way a performance sailor, (although I did stay ahead of that macgregor today). MANY more people probably know better than I here. It makes me wonder now, if my sharp rudder angle during this tack doesn't throw the speed brake on her though. I too fall off just a hair, to get the jib full, then point it back in the wind. Hmmmmm..

I wish I knew what Don knows about trimming. I just watch the shape, and trim to whatever the plotter says is fastest.

Now I'm going to have to time it though..

 

[caguy]

Gorilla you are going to lose speed simply because you are going in a different direction. To help speed up the transition try back filling you jib by uncleating but not releasing until the boat changes course. At that point there is enough force in the jib to cause it to pop to the other side. I would think that reducing your time to tack would be more important than maintaining speed. I am not a racer but this technique works well for me.

 

[Don Guillette]

Gorillatoast: Yup, you don't need to marry her just get her interested in sailing with you!!

Try this the next time you're sailing. Don't rush through the tack. That's the kiss of death. Set up your lazy sheet and then start the tack, but DON"T cut you're sheet. Just before the jib breaks and before it goes head to wind. notice what portion of the sail breaks first (top, bottom or even). Refer to your SAIL TRIM USERS GUIDE and set your fairlead accordingly. Let the jib backwind to push the bow over and then cut the jib sheet while your taking up the slack. Then SLOWLY trim in the sheet to power up the jib. It's like a dance step mate. Try it a couple of times and see if you can get it down to a smooth motion. Use both hands and learn to use your foot on the tiller as your 3rd hand.

Better yet, take my advise and find a cute blonde hootsey totsey to handle the helm!!

 

[Joe]

What slows you down is the rudder...... so.... use the jib and main to help do most of the turning.... At the beginning of the tack, especially in light air....drop the main a bit and ease off to gain speed...then ease the rudder to leeward and bring the main up pretty quickly to essentially weather helm the boat as the turn starts... let the jib continue the tack with the backwinding technique caguy described.... when the main comes across it's time to release the jib.... don't trim it all the way...fall off a bit to build your speed... then start heading up.

What you must remember is that in light air tacking close hauled to close hauled will always be slow.. so, drop down a bit, use the main... use the jib...minimum rudder... go low to re build speed, then head up.

 

[GorillaToast]

Ok. Will give all these ideas a try, except for Don's additional crew suggestion. Married or not, women divert your course, cause you to recklessly spend your meager earnings, and require continual compromise - three things I do not wish to introduce into my simple life.

Thanks all.

 

[Joe]

Ok. Will give all these ideas a try, except for Don's additional crew suggestion. Married or not, women divert your course, cause you to recklessly spend your meager earnings, and require continual compromise - three things I do not wish to introduce into my simple life.

Thanks all.

You might google the term "roll tack" to learn some more neat stuff about boat handling.

 

[Joe]

Ok. Will give all these ideas a try, except for Don's additional crew suggestion. Married or not, women divert your course, cause you to recklessly spend your meager earnings, and require continual compromise - three things I do not wish to introduce into my simple life.

Thanks all.

You might google the term "roll tack sailing" to learn some more neat stuff about boat handling.

 

[Don Guillette]

Gorillatoast: You need to give my crew suggestions some more thought. I just looked up your profile and see that you're a golf professional. I'm not DEAR ABBEY but I've been around the block a few times and I know how woman think. I never thought the sail trim forum would get on this tack but listen to me. You must have contact with all kinds of neat gals who just adore you for what you're teaching them about golf. I'll bet they dream of you at night. Some might want to be on the same course you're on -- between swings ask them if they like to go sailing. Some might even want to suppliment your income and you could upgrade to a C30 or at least they might think about buying you a new set of golf clubs. You like that idea don't you?

Compromise is not a bad thing -- especially on cold winter nights and winter in your neck of the woods is right around the corner. If nothing else it could cut down on your electric bill and with the money you saved you could buy some nice upgrades to the C30 you'll be getting soon -- if you follow my advise!!

 

[Chris Patterson]

Haaaaaha. Don, you are the man.

 

[GorillaToast]

Gorillatoast: You need to give my crew suggestions some more thought. I just looked up your profile and see that you're a golf professional. I'm not DEAR ABBEY but I've been around the block a few times and I know how woman think. I never thought the sail trim forum would get on this tack but listen to me. You must have contact with all kinds of neat gals who just adore you for what you're teaching them about golf. I'll bet they dream of you at night. Some might want to be on the same course you're on -- between swings ask them if they like to go sailing. Some might even want to suppliment your income and you could upgrade to a C30 or at least they might think about buying you a new set of golf clubs. You like that idea don't you?

Compromise is not a bad thing -- especially on cold winter nights and winter in your neck of the woods is right around the corner. If nothing else it could cut down on your electric bill and with the money you saved you could buy some nice upgrades to the C30 you'll be getting soon -- if you follow my advise!!

Don, over the course of 12 years in my current position, I have begun paying attention to, and striking up conversations, with more than 10 women. All were cordial, but all too, soon became ex-customers. The rules of cause and effect seem to indicate that women who come to the driving range are only interested in improving their golf swings, not cultivating romantic relationships with golf pros (who are way down the food chain when it comes to financial rewards).

One, tho, discontinue to come back, even allowing me to give her a few free lessons. But when I took her out to play a round of golf, everything was fine until we finished and I took her to her car. After putting her clubs in the trunk of brand new Accord, she asked which car was mine. When I pointed to my old broken-down pickup truck, she promptly left, never to be seen or heard from again.

I understand the rules of survival of the fittest, and know my place.

Back on tack, lack of wind has kept me from trying out the suggestions for improving my tacking. From the looks of the forecast, it'll be until Isaac's residual winds arrive in Ohio before I can.

 

[Chris Patterson]

Bill, this is way off base from sail trim, but that's sort of different from my experience.
A while back, I had more money than I could bury in the backyard, with minimal dealings with the gals.
Recently, when I was spending my days in a long, black, luxury Mercedes, the same. I think they thought I was pretentious maybe? No idea, the incalculable equation. Now, my appearance is a lot like yours, I've seen your picture, and this is by NO MEANS an insult to YOU, but I ain't no Fabio.
I ride around in my old Dodge Truck, that has 312 thousand miles on it, (I'm a good mechanic), and I swear, I can't half keep them chased away. MUCH to my wife's chagrin. Go figure.
I think, in my opinion, that I don't even want the woman that's attracted to a "Mercedes".

My girl now, is from the Westchester area of N.Y., makes more money in a year than I can in 5, and is very cordial, and sophisticated. And worships the ground I walk on. While I've considered having her psychologically evaluated, I think some women just like an ol' country boy...

There's a woman out there, that likes golf "bums", old trucks, and older boats. Knowing "your place", sometimes is the catchall.

 

[CaptGregg]

(I'm a good mechanic),

My girl now worships the ground I walk on.

Chris, sounds like Mechanics is not all that you're good at! :dance:

 

[GorillaToast]

Bill, this is way off base from sail trim, but that's sort of different from my experience.
A while back, I had more money than I could bury in the backyard, with minimal dealings with the gals.
Recently, when I was spending my days in a long, black, luxury Mercedes, the same. I think they thought I was pretentious maybe? No idea, the incalculable equation. Now, my appearance is a lot like yours, I've seen your picture, and this is by NO MEANS an insult to YOU, but I ain't no Fabio.
I ride around in my old Dodge Truck, that has 312 thousand miles on it, (I'm a good mechanic), and I swear, I can't half keep them chased away. MUCH to my wife's chagrin. Go figure.
I think, in my opinion, that I don't even want the woman that's attracted to a "Mercedes".

My girl now, is from the Westchester area of N.Y., makes more money in a year than I can in 5, and is very cordial, and sophisticated. And worships the ground I walk on. While I've considered having her psychologically evaluated, I think some women just like an ol' country boy...

There's a woman out there, that likes golf "bums", old trucks, and older boats. Knowing "your place", sometimes is the catchall.

Chris, the key phrase in this post is "my wife's". When I was married, and they knew it, I couldn't / didn't beat'em off with a stick. But, I was a different man back then. I wouldn't want the kind of woman that would mess with a married man, now.

I was in the same financial boat as you when I was married (for 20 yrs), mine eventually got tired of the "good 'ol country boy and cut me loose. And as far as the women that like trucks and older boats, the last woman I said to, "I've got a boat", almost ran out the door.

Nah, I'll stick with my best friend's advice who said, "when God wants you to have a wife, you won't be able to get rid of her", or something to that effect.