Slightly Different Pump Handle Resistance Problem

[Craig522]

Peggie, I posted this a few days ago to the main shared forum by mistake. Can you please take a crack at the problem? Thanks I've read the other thread regarding pump handle resistance and my issue seems different enough to warrant a new thread. This is for a system pumping from the toilet to a holding tank.Whenever the raw sea water intake valve is open, there is a lot of resistance to pumping the toilet dry. If I push through the resistance and hold the handle at the bottom of the stroke for a second, it finally releases the back pressure trying to push the handle back up. I need to do that on every stroke.But the problem does not happen at all if the raw water intake is closed. When I go for day sails and have essentially unlimited fresh water, I pour some in the toilet and flush that way without ever opening the raw water intake at the thru hull. Then the toilet pumps dry very nicely with no handle resistance. It's only when I'm on longer trips and need to flush with sea water that there's a problem.FWIW, it's not a problem that "builds up". The resistance is there immediately when the raw water valve is open, and not there at all when it's closed.I don't think it's a blockage in the raw water line itself though, since I can get sea water INTO the toilet (i.e. "flush" mode) with no resistance.Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

What's the make/model/age of your toilet?

When you flush by just pouring water into the toilet with the intake seacock closed, are you sure the toilet is in the "dry" mode? 'Cuz with the seacock closed, it wouldn't bring in flush water no matter which mode it's in.

 

[Craig522]

Definitely "dry"

I just bought the boat - it's 30 years old, but I don't think the head is. I don't know what make/model it is, but here's a photo of the toilet (if that's not enough, I'll write down the model info next time I'm on board).The toilet is definitely in "dry" mode when I've flushed it using poured in fresh water. (the red lever as shown in the photo). I've done it several times while trying to troubleshoot the problem.Other than the pumping resistance issue, the toilet seems to work great.Thanks for any ideas!

 

[Craig522]

2nd try at uploading photo

If at first you don't succeed ...

 

[David J.11350]

Wilcox-Crittenden HeadMate

Craig,Looks like a WC HeadMate - I just re-built mine and it pumps like a charm. I was having similar trouble pumping in dry mode:1. The repair kit had some troubleshooting tips, one of which addressed the back-pressure problem. I found that I was babying the wet-dry lever, since I didn't know any better. You can push that lever down _past_ horizontal until you feel it 'lock' into place. That relieves the back pressure.2. I would suggest re-building it - it was a good 'hands-on' lesson into how the thing operates. The valves and gaskets in mine were pretty stiff - I'm sure that this was part of the problem too.Or you could just replace the whole thing, but it's up to you.Fair Winds...

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Another great shot of a toilet BOWL...

Whizzit that everyone sends me photos of the bowl, showing almost nothing of the pump? All bowls look alike! It's the pumps that are different. So unfortunately, from what little I can see of the pump in your photo, I don't have a clue how old it is, or even the make/model for certain. I do know it's not a Jabsco...it could be a W-C Headmate...or it could be a Groco HF or any of its predecessors (HC or HE) in the last 30 years...they both have T-handles, they both have wet/dry levers in about the same place...and I can't read the label on the top of the pump. However, they're all "budget" toilets that have average life expectancies of about 10 years...longer only if they're not used very much and rebuilt occasionally. So if you're fairly certain it's at least that old, I wouldn't put any money into it...the kit will cost you $50+ with no guarantee that rebuilding will fix the problem, or that something else that isn't in the kit won't break. I'd just replace it.

 

[Craig522]

Thanks for the advice

This weekend I'll try pushing the lever down further until it locks. Hopefully that solves the problem. If not I'll look into the kit as per David's experience, or price a new toilet and follow Peggie's advice.

 

[David J.11350]

Rebuild kit

Craig,Go to www.wilcox-crittenden.com - they were bought by Thetford, but the site is very good. It has exploded drawings and parts lists.See the link below at Defender.com for the repair kit. I spent about $65 at West Marine because I wanted it fast (though it seems that the wind has stopped blowing around here).I debated a new head, but being resourceful and handy, I thought that I'd take the old one apart first to see how it worked. Once I saw that the valves/gaskets were worn out, I went ahead and did the rebuild.My advice would be to pay attention to how things are together when you take them apart.If you have any more questions, you can email me direct at mdbcjonesatcomcastdotnetGood Luck!