Simple rigging help for routing Main Halyard to Cockpit

[JonnyQuest]

I am interested in re-routing the main halyard back to the cockpit as my crew is a bit inexperienced (being 3 and 6 years old!). A buddy of mine looked at my current rigging and suggested simply swapping out a single block for a double block at the base of the mast, a double block for a triple block along the route back towards the cockpit, and the current double clutch with a triple clutch. He didn't have experience to help with choosing the right equipment, so I'd like some help here at SBO for my 27 ft 1975 Oday.

1. Is this rigging idea (using blocks and rope clutch) a good idea for a main halyard?

2. I don't currently use a winch for raising the main; will I need one after running my halyard back to the cockpit? (If mechanical assistance would be needed, is there another means of accomplishing that other than fixing a winch to the cabin roof?)

3. How do I determine the correct block and clutch for this application? Defender and West Marine catalogs do not appear to have the guidance in a form I can figure out for my application.

Hooray! Its starting to warm up along the Gulf Coast.

Any help with my rigging adaptation would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

JQ

PS- Photos attached show the current setup of the main halyard, blocks for the cunningham and outhaul (if I recall correctly), and the double clutch.

 

[JVB]

My Catalina 250 WK has a block at the base of the mast, then a rope guide (fairlead ?), then a rope clutch like in your picture. From the rope clutch I can run the halyard to my starboard jib winch which is located on the cabin top. And I do need the winch for the last few feet if I wind is getting to the main sail. Taking the sail down I step on the halyard pinning it to the deck, then release the rope clutch. I let the sail down one fold at a time by momentarily lifting my foot off the halyard and deck.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

You may want to consider an ambitious project ...

I think that a 27' boat like yours (very similar to my 27' boat) is best served by having as many controls led aft as possible. IMO you need a pair of winches on the coach roof. I use ours for the halyards and even sail controls. For instance, I don't think it's possible to use the vang or the outhaul effectively without the aid of the winch. Of course, when you lead the lines aft, you have all those friction losses that make a winch necessary, but the alternative is standing at the base of the mast, which on a boat as small as a 27' boat like ours is more awkward, and possibly more perilous, than on larger sized vessels.

What you first need to install are blocks at the base of the mast. I have 3 heavy duty-sized blocks mounted on the mast (2 came with the boat and 1 I purchased from Rig Rite and it was very expensive) for halyards. The other sail controls (vang, outhaul, 2 reef controls, cunningham) are run through smaller blocks which I purchased and mounted to the base of the mast. You have to be careful to not over-do it. I was able to mount a few to the sail track at the base and the vang is mounted to a saddle at the base so I didn't need a separate block for that line. An alternative is install a collar at the base of the mast that can accomodate blocks or mount blocks to the coach roof itself. You have to decide which works best for your boat and your mounting capacity.

The next step is to mount a deck organizer on the coach roof to turn the lines. My boat came with a pair of doubles, which I replaced with a pair of quads (doubles stacked). In my case I replaced Shaeffer organizers with just a different model of Shaeffers, so the swap was easy and I didn't have to change the holes. I see that you have a pair of organizers fashioned with a pad-eye and some blocks. I would replace those.

My boat came with cabin top winches mounted behind the cleats. I removed the cleats and installed 4 clutches on each side (2 pairs of doubles - Spinlock XAS). You want the clutches mounted far enough ahead of the winches so that the lines coming out do not have to angle more than about 10 degrees, otherwise you will develop too much friction through the clutches. It appears that the best location for winches would be where you currently have the pair of clutches. You would need to remove them and move them forward (and add more).

It my mind, it would be a worthwhile improvement despite the wholesale changes and costs involved. I still have to go to the base of the mast to hook the tack of the reefing cringle to the rams horn when reefing, but that is the only reason for needing to go forward.

Here's a few pictures that show the set-up (winches are covered in a red cover). The organizers are just ahead of the hand rails and the Spinlocks are just aft of the end of the rails.

 

[Ed Schenck]

It appears to me that you have a challenge due to a very round coach roof. You will have to fashion mounts for a flat surface if you add a winch and a deck organizer. Do you have the same double arrangement on port? It looks like there is just one line going to port. Could you move the cunningham or outhaul over to port? That would free up a sheave and clutch slot for the halyard. I guess you still need a mast block. That could be done with a double as suggested by your friend. I think Scott is right when he says you will want a winch.

 

[Joe]

You really just need to purchase one block......a double or a triple... depending on whether you want to mate the single up with the existing double. When you shop for blocks..... they are rated for line size... so simply look on the tag/label to check.. it's not the block that will give way first... it will be the base attachment.. so your padeye should have a backing plate, or at lease some oversized washers on the underside. This link may help http://www.harken.com/blocks/blocks.php

If you want to spend the money for another clutch... so be it... but you only need another clamcleat or cam cleat, or even a simple horn cleat to secure the line.... if you wanted a clutch for the halyard... which is the most common use for clutches... then you can use one of the currently clutched lines for the newer, inexpensive cleat.

All Sailboat Cleats & Cam Cleats | Ronstan Sailboat Cleats & Accessories | Ronstan C-Cleats
Ronstan Medium C-Cleat Cam Cleat Grey

Code: RONRF5010
Price: $23.00

Dimensional Weight: 0.20 pounds

Quantity in Basket: None


Ronstan V-Cleat Large Open Rope 5/16 - 1/2 in.
Code: RONRF5110
Price: $9.80



Give that a try a see how difficult it will be to hoist the mainsail without a winch... you might be able to borrow your primary winch (headsail) to get the final foot. However, if you decide you would rather have a dedicated winch let me suggest the Lewmar #6 or a similar single speed, standard (non self-tailing) style. Winches, especially self tailing ones, are terribly expensive.... plus you'll have to construct a base for it to adapt to your curved roof.

Lewmar Ocean Standard Winch - 6 A Single Speed Aluminum
Code: LEW49006010
Price: $111.00

Finally....... if you go the winch route... mount it as far aft on the cabin top as possible...then relocate your cleats and clutches a foot or so FORWARD of the winch. The line should run through the cleat first.... then to the winch... that way the lines stay cleated while you use the winch for other applications.

PS............... I copied these images from online catalogues...they are not mine...... I do not sell these products, nor charge for commenting on their value or quality.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

My cabin top winches are Lewmar #6. They are perfectly suitable on our boat. I forgot to mention that I can probably raise the sails without the winch but I typically use the winch to make sure that tension is suffient for those breezy days.

 

[JonnyQuest]

Thanks for the rigging help

Thanks to all of you, the suggestions and pointers have helped me out a lot, particularly in ways to re-route existing lines to use my existing clutches for the halyard.

JVB: I think I can get away with rerouting my halyard right away back through an existing clutch and then try out the jib winch to see if the angle is too harsh--I like that I can try it out first.

Scott: I suspect that the angle from my existing clutches to my jib winch is too steep, and would develop too much friction as you pointed out. I also hear you about making a wholesale change-out, if I can swing that cost right now.

Ed: I could move the cunningham or outhaul over to port, which might be a good idea to free up one of the existing clutches. I am leaning towards a winch as I almost need the mechanical help with my current setup--though that may be due to another rigging issue.

Joe: Great info about the cam, clam, and V cleats--particularly regarding using a new cleat for a cunningham or outhaul line instead. Brilliant. Also reminds me that the cam cleat I do have is shot and due for replacement, so I'll incorporate that into my project when I do it. I also appreciate the info that the mount would fail before the block hardware would--that I only need to match the hardware to the line size.

I'll mull it all over and come up with a suitable game plan. Ya'll have been a great help.

Fair winds,

JQ

 

[JonnyQuest]

I'm reading some other postings and it seems that the main halyard would put alot of stress on whatever rigging is used--namely on the coach roof itself. I assume a turning block at the base of the mast reduces/redirects the force so that it isn't pulling up on the coach roof? I don't have a collar to attach blocks. Would a side mounted block attached to the mast be adequate? Or is the only real solution to have the mast pulled and a collar attached? I assume there aren't any collars that are in two pieces that bolt around the mast?

Any other ideas for making the turn from the mast to the deck with the main halyard?