Significant weatherhelm on a beneteau 343

[Philip_Oceanis 361]

What is the most wind people are comfortable with their mid 30' boats? I have been out a couple times on my 343 in 20+iKTS and it is a bit sporty even with deeply reefed sails.

Also, how close to a run do you get with the swept back spreaders?

Even with 20-25knots true wind, if I reef and balance the boat accordingly and waves are not a big issue then I am quite comfortable. It really depends on the sea state.
How close to run? Well, I really enjoy genoa on the spinakle pole on one side and main sail with a preventer on the other side. So it's 180 degrees. It feels really nice. But don't try it without a pole or both sails in the same direction. Anything above, let's say 120 degrees, is horrible.

As far as weatherhelm is concerned (which is the initial discussion) the Beneteau 361 also needs to be refeed quite early and the main sail, even a furling one like mine, has really a lot of power. Playing with the traveller and the main sheet is essential.

 

[bob_pattison]

120 reefing marks

Hi Kurt,
Hard to guess...as the clew height of your 120% would really dictate the position of the blocks. But as a very rough guess, the length of the two sails would be about 20-22 inches different..so if you moved the lead forward about 20" you'll be in the ballpark. (unless the clew height is quite high relative to the original sail, if so then it might be some place between)

bp

Bob,
Thanks for the tuning guide. My 343 has a 120 genoa. Since your guide is based on a 140 genoa, what adjustments would you recommend to your suggested lead positions?

Kurt Kamrad

 

[yachtsman]

May be good if it still heads up to check your mast rake..

 

[Davefromoregon]

A couple friends and I went out for a long weekend going from Portland, OR to Hood River. On the stretch of the Columbia from Cascade Locks to Hood River, it is a 25 mile wind tunnel. I have been out a few times in 15-22 knot wind and have gotten relatively confident or at least not panicked. We had a tailwind that exceeded 25 k knots before we completely furled the sails and motored.

Has anyone here taken a 343 out in this kind of wind? We were reefing early and aggressively and still didn't get comfortable. Some of this was the wave action. We did encounter 3' waves and at times felt like we had the rudder and bow out of the water. After we turned around, I believe we saw winds up to 35.

Is this beyond the capability of the boat or just the current skills of her skipper? My assumption I am the weak partner here rather than the boat.

Do other 343 owners take their boats out in this sort of wind? I have been trying to deal with the fact that this boat does not run well due to the swept back stays. We tried a series broad reaches to work around this problem and we reefed early and aggressively. I think we had less than 50% of the main up after we completely furled the jib.

Also, I hit one big wave head on, water went over the front and sent water through one of the deck windows. It was properly closed. Is this par for the course or should this be part of my winter maintenance?

 

[Gunni]

Downwind sailing is advanced sailing. The boat handles much differently and the rudder doesn't bite as effectively. Throw in some quartering waves and the stern will be pushed left/right. You likely had 35kt winds the entire time, and 25kts apparent from astern. Your boat needs very little sail to make way in wind like that. In conditions like that I would factor in the best angle to the waves (Columbia also has wicked current actions that shape and drive waves - very challenging), maybe triple reef the main, flatten the sail to keep it off the spreaders, and also reef the jib. If you need to go dead downwind due to narrow navigation constraints you would find it much easier to roll up the main and run on reefed jib alone. Upwind I would want to come back out with some main to balance the boat and prevent hobby-horsing in those square waves.

 

[Davefromoregon]

Downwind sailing is advanced sailing. The boat handles much differently and the rudder doesn't bite as effectively. Throw in some quartering waves and the stern will be pushed left/right. You likely had 35kt winds the entire time, and 25kts apparent from astern. Your boat needs very little sail to make way in wind like that. In conditions like that I would factor in the best angle to the waves (Columbia also has wicked current actions that shape and drive waves - very challenging), maybe triple reef the main, flatten the sail to keep it off the spreaders, and also reef the jib. If you need to go dead downwind due to narrow navigation constraints you would find it much easier to roll up the main and run on reefed jib alone. Upwind I would want to come back out with some main to balance the boat and prevent hobby-horsing in those square waves.

It isa furling main, so our reefing was probably close to a triple reef. I have a wind gauge that provides true and apparent wind. The true was up over 30, and appRent less.

I'll try the furled jib next time and put away the main first.

 

[BigEasy]

Dave,
In 10 - 20 knot winds, the 343 shouldn't be rounding up if the sails are balanced.
The center of effort is too far aft.
Check the mast for excessive rake; probably not the cause.
Check the sail trim as follows:
Make sure the main is flat by tensioning outhaul & vang
Adjust traveler downwind of the boats centerline to decrease angle of attack
on main; therefore, depowering main. This adjustment doesn't affect the sail
twist, so its easy to return to a more upwind setting if you overcorrect without
having to adjust the main twist.
Decrease tension on mainsheet that will increase twist in the upper third of the
main. With increased twist, the sail is spilling more wind aloft; therefore,
depowering the main
Finally, if the above is insufficient, reef the main further. If the boat is rounding
up, its because the main is essentially overpowering the rudder. If the wind is
eratic & gusty, you might have to continually adjust the traveler to
prevent the roundups.
Oh, Don Guillette's book on sail trim may help you in figuring
the sail trim for varying conditions.
Hope all of this helps

 

[Davefromoregon]

By now, I am OK up to 20knots. Thanks to information provided here....

The problem was from 20-25.