Saltwater flush

[Tim R.]

Hi Peggie, I have a Jabsco electric flush toilet with macerator. It flushes with fresh water that is fed via solenoid as per manufacturers instructions. I would like to convert to saltwater flush but realize that means pumping in salt water which is a little scarey. How are these systems typicaly setup so as not to flood/sink the boat should the pump run continuously?

Thanks

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Why do you want to do this?

Everybody else wants to switch TO fresh water flush to eliminate noise and sea water odors...WHY do you want to ADD noise and odor?

It can be done. You'd have to add a remote intake pump (Jabsco ParMax is what Jabsco uses)...follow installation instructions carefully. As for how to avoid sinking the boat while you're aboard...if you hear the pump running and see water running out from under the head door, turn the pump off. To avoid sinking the boat when no is aboard, close the intake seacock before leavng.

 

[Tim R.]

Peggy I have always had sw flush toilets so I know how to keep it from getting smelly. And we have a 80 gallon tank that is fiberglass built into the boat. Hoses can permeate but I do not worry about 5/8" fg permeating. I never thought of the noise the intake pump would make. Maybe I can do it with a manual pump.

We currently live aboard and plan to do some long range cruising so for both it is best to make the water last as long as possible. Winter refills can be chilly.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

You're not actually considering using a manual pump...

to supply water to a macerating electric toilet? If you do, carry a bunch of replacement discharge impellers.

If you want a sea water toilet, BUY a sea water toilet...a manual toilet--although manual toilets have to be maintained, electric toilets don't...a decent quality sea water electric toilet. But DON'T try to turn a silk purse (oh, it's a Jabsco..make that a polyester purse) into a sow's ear unless you want create more problems than it'll solvel.

You say you've always had sea water toilets and know how to keep 'em from getting smelly. You're in Maine...you know how to prevent odor in water that's too cold to produce any odor! I dunno where you're headed, but if it's into warmer climes, you may regret switching toilet that uses sea water...'cuz it's not the tank that's gonna stink, it's the toilet!

Do we need to talk?

 

[Tim R.]

Thanks for the slap in the face Peggy. Just brainstorming here and I see how the electric toilet fills and then flushes. In fact we use it mostly manually where we push the button to fill it and then push the button to flush. The toilet doesn't care how it gets the water as long as it gets enough.

As for stinky SW toilets, our rule was to always rinse with fresh water after every use which uses a lot less water than a flush cycle. We also use Odorlos religiously.

Switching to SW flush would be an option for our present northern living, not a permanent switch.

I really do not know too much about the quality of electric toilets. This one came with the boat(with a spare macerator and control panel). I do think that Raritan makes a superior manual toilet over Jabsco though. What is the best electric flush toilet out there?

BTW, Maine water creates plenty of odor when left in a warm boat for a few days. Thanks to your book/advice and lots of hard work, all of our boats have been odor free.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Which model Jabsco do you have?

'Cuz I've been going on the assumption that it's one of the 370xx series that has single flush button to start a motor that simultaneously opens the solenoid valve to let flush water in and run the discharge impeller. They aren't wired to bring in flush water and flush as separate operations. So I need to know which toilet you do have.

The Raritan Elegance is best "bang for the buck" in electric macerating toilets these days...super quiet and has a pump and macerator that can even chew up a tampon (but not a steady of diet of 'em!) The optional "smart flush" panel provides 4 flush options including dry bowl ..and with the addition of the optional "sea fresh" system can be installed to let you choose at will between fresh water and sea water. Check it out here: Raritan Elegance toilet

 

[Tim R.]

Re: Which model Jabsco do you have?

Nope. It is the 58xx0 model. It has a programable control pad with flush, quick flush, fill and empty. You can program it to leave the bowl empty or full. It claims to be quiet as does the Raritan but it is hard to describe any macerator as quiet.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Macerator misconceptions...

It's not the macerator that makes most of the noise...it's the intake pump on a sea water toilet (which also needs most of the power, btw). That's why toilets designed to use onboard pressurized flush water are so much quieter than sea water toilets...solenoid valves don't make any noise. However, there's even a big difference in how much noise discharge macerators and impellers make in some makes/models vs. others. The Elegance is incredibly quiet...when it was still in development even the folks at Raritan were blown away by how quiet it is.

However, your Jabsco is one of their more expensive ones...so I suggest you talk to them about how to add a remote sea water intake pump to it that will make it "either/or" fresh or sea water flush. Raritan does have a system to do that they call the "sea fresh system" but I don't know if it'll work with a Jabsco toilet. Vic Willman, who posts here as "headmaster," can answer that question. Meanwhile, give Jabsco tech support a call or shoot 'em an email.

 

[Head Master18695]

Re: Macerator misconceptions...

Tim R., have a look at the wiring diagram on page 6, left hand side, for the controller and the output to either the raw water pump or the electric solenoid valve.

http://www.ittflowcontrol.com/files/58xx0_Deluxe_Flush_Toilet_Datasheet.pdf

Then call their customer service to see if they use the same controller for either, and if it can carry the added amperage for the raw water pump. Talk to Michael Irving in ITT's customer service unit (978) 282-5227. Explain what you wish to do.

Based on the wiring diagram, you could add their raw water pump, and then use a selector switch and pump relay, to hook it all up. See what he thinks of the idea. He's a nice fellow and is pretty sharp!

 

[Guest]

Sea water flush

Hi Tim, at some risk of stirring Peggie's ire, our 1991 P42 has two original Jabsco electric heads that draw sea water for flushing into one holding tank. The power panel has one switch for both heads and a macerator switch for the overboard discharge macerator pump. Each head has a through hull for raw water flushing. The head uses a combo pump and macerator motor to bring sea water in for flushing and a macerator for chewing up the material on its way to the holding tank during the flushing operation.

Each head has an electrically operated anti siphon solenoid valve; aft is located in the engine compartment and forward is located inside a small compartment forward of the main cabin cabinets starboard side. These help to prevent water from siphoning into the bowl after flushing since both the heads and holding tank are below the waterline.

The holding tank on our boat is located beneath the main cabin sole starboard side by the setee. The through hull seacock for the macerator pump is located on the forward side of the holding tank. A small sole compartment hatch on the starboard side next to the compression post is where we have two seacocks; one for the forward cabin head sea water intake and the other for the holding tank macerator pump. Our macerator draws from the tank via a wye valve arrangement.

When it's time for use I first open the through hull, turn on the head switch and activate the flush button to bring in some sea water to the bowl. When ready I hold the flush button down for at least five full seconds to allow enough time for the bowl contents to reach the holding tank. I return everything to their normal position when done.

If our tank is close to full, there is no pump out facility nearby and we're in a legal place to dump I will open the macerator pump through hull and activate the macerator switch until the tank is empty. The pump sound will change to a slightly higher but distinctive pitch at that point. Close all through hulls when done. Sea water will slowly seep back into the holding tank if left open.

We've been very happy with the P42's head operation over the years. I prefer using raw water to fresh and smell has never been a problem except for the first flush after an extended period of no use. I hope this helps.

Terry Cox

 

[Head Master18695]

Re: Sea water flush

Two things: Peggie has informed me that Mike Irving is no longer in ITT Jabsco's Customer Service Department any longer, that he's been promoted to another department.

And secondly, Terry cox mentioned that when he's in an area where it's legal to dump overboard, he uses the macerator pump to empty his holding tank. Unless you're 3 or more miles out to sea, THERE IS NOWHERE in U.S. waters where that is legal.

 

[Tim R.]

Thanks folks. It looks like the best option for me is to use my Lavac when I want to conserve fresh water. This would most likely be when off shore so no worries about the overboard discharge. It can also be diverted to the large holding tank in the bow if needed.