My wife and I had been out of sailing for 20 years rearing our children. We bought a Hunter 33 last year to enjoy on the Chesapeake. We love the boat but had a real problem handling the boat in winds of 25 to 30 knots. We furl reef and played with that but still had trouble. The boat headed hard up wind and kicked quite a bit. It was a chore to steer and handle. We both felt we had never achieved a balanced sail display in the high winds. We would love some advice. We have the RGB rig. We have the big main and a gib. Any ideas and advice??? Please help???
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heading up/bearing off
Sail balance comes in two measures; total sail area to wind speed and fore-n-aft balance. Once you get the right amount of sail up for the wind speed present you have to balance it fore-n-aft. I can't talk to how many reefs a 25-30 knot wind would take but I'm thinking at least 2 for a 33'. You indicated that the boat wanted to turn into the wind. That is an indication that the amount of sail you have behind the CLR (center of lateral resistance aka center of the keel) is too large or the amount before the CLR is too small. If you are over canvased then reef the main, if under canvased then unfurl the fore-sail. If the boat is constantly bearing off the wind then reverse the directions previously given. I find that if I stay on top of things, as the wind picks up or drops off I can tweek one sail then the other to keep the fore-n-aft and total sail area balanced. Of course this is all assumes that the sails are trimmed correctly. One thing I have seen many folks do is try to bring in the boom or jib clew too close to the boat centerline. The boat heels over a lot, developes leeway, and generally is not much fun to walk around in. It does not go as fast either. The old adage that boats sail fastest that sail upright is still true. so let the boom out a little and check your speed. if it went up, let it out some more. The pictures we see in the sales brochures are not boats sailing at their best IMHO and are just manufactures trying to make the boat appeal to people.
Sail balance comes in two measures; total sail area to wind speed and fore-n-aft balance. Once you get the right amount of sail up for the wind speed present you have to balance it fore-n-aft. I can't talk to how many reefs a 25-30 knot wind would take but I'm thinking at least 2 for a 33'. You indicated that the boat wanted to turn into the wind. That is an indication that the amount of sail you have behind the CLR (center of lateral resistance aka center of the keel) is too large or the amount before the CLR is too small. If you are over canvased then reef the main, if under canvased then unfurl the fore-sail. If the boat is constantly bearing off the wind then reverse the directions previously given. I find that if I stay on top of things, as the wind picks up or drops off I can tweek one sail then the other to keep the fore-n-aft and total sail area balanced. Of course this is all assumes that the sails are trimmed correctly. One thing I have seen many folks do is try to bring in the boom or jib clew too close to the boat centerline. The boat heels over a lot, developes leeway, and generally is not much fun to walk around in. It does not go as fast either. The old adage that boats sail fastest that sail upright is still true. so let the boom out a little and check your speed. if it went up, let it out some more. The pictures we see in the sales brochures are not boats sailing at their best IMHO and are just manufactures trying to make the boat appeal to people.
What Year and model
I will agree with already said reef and reef the main as much as you can and let out the boom. What year boat will help other owners help you more. If it's the newer hunters with arch than reef and let out that boom over the arch,they sail much better straight up with less heeling, 25 to 30 means to me you need to put all reefs in and let out the main. Nick
I will agree with already said reef and reef the main as much as you can and let out the boom. What year boat will help other owners help you more. If it's the newer hunters with arch than reef and let out that boom over the arch,they sail much better straight up with less heeling, 25 to 30 means to me you need to put all reefs in and let out the main. Nick
Thank you and more...
I should have given you more data on the boat. It is the 2005 Hunter 33 with the furl main and jib and the cockpit arch. Our previous boat was a Pearson 30. It is taking me some time to adjust from one to the other. The Pearson was driven by the jib, the Hunter seems to be driven by the main. The advice on tracking the lateral forces was very good. If it kicks up , reef the main. I am sure I am not doing that enough. My wife was a racer and she thinks she is pretty good at setting sails. I will work on this and keep in mind to 1) Keep her upright 2) Consider the lateral force and the kick of the boat 3 Let that boom out to spill a little air Any other thoughts are greatly appreciated.
I should have given you more data on the boat. It is the 2005 Hunter 33 with the furl main and jib and the cockpit arch. Our previous boat was a Pearson 30. It is taking me some time to adjust from one to the other. The Pearson was driven by the jib, the Hunter seems to be driven by the main. The advice on tracking the lateral forces was very good. If it kicks up , reef the main. I am sure I am not doing that enough. My wife was a racer and she thinks she is pretty good at setting sails. I will work on this and keep in mind to 1) Keep her upright 2) Consider the lateral force and the kick of the boat 3 Let that boom out to spill a little air Any other thoughts are greatly appreciated.
I have the H320 in-mast furl
I would recommend reefing the main to half-size in 25-30. If that doesn't give you sufficient speed, either (1) go to one-quarter reefed main or (2) crank in the main completely and just sail on the jib. Works fine, though a little dicey coming about. Whatever you do, don't rattle the First Mate.
I would recommend reefing the main to half-size in 25-30. If that doesn't give you sufficient speed, either (1) go to one-quarter reefed main or (2) crank in the main completely and just sail on the jib. Works fine, though a little dicey coming about. Whatever you do, don't rattle the First Mate.
My 36
My hunter 36 is not that much different than your 33. I also have Inmast furling main and she will really sail faster if you roll in the main and heel less in that kind of wind and will handle better. My wife does not like when we heel more than 15-20%. Last year was my first year with my 2007 36 Inmast so still learning to work the main furling,it has been a trial and error how much sail to let out,this year I will try marking the boom at how much sail works at what wind speed. We really like how easy it is to use the furling main and reefing it just so easy. Nick
My hunter 36 is not that much different than your 33. I also have Inmast furling main and she will really sail faster if you roll in the main and heel less in that kind of wind and will handle better. My wife does not like when we heel more than 15-20%. Last year was my first year with my 2007 36 Inmast so still learning to work the main furling,it has been a trial and error how much sail to let out,this year I will try marking the boom at how much sail works at what wind speed. We really like how easy it is to use the furling main and reefing it just so easy. Nick
Hunter in high wind.
I agree with most of comments. We have a Hunter 310 with an Arch. We have found we reef the Main first. We try to keep the heel to 15 degrees, and sails balance - don't hold too much helm. Last year we reefed both sails, let out the main - 25 kts of wind and maintained 6-7 kts from Herrinton Harbour to the Choptank. We have a roller furling Main and Jib. With the large Main and small Jib we almost always reduce the Main 1st.
I agree with most of comments. We have a Hunter 310 with an Arch. We have found we reef the Main first. We try to keep the heel to 15 degrees, and sails balance - don't hold too much helm. Last year we reefed both sails, let out the main - 25 kts of wind and maintained 6-7 kts from Herrinton Harbour to the Choptank. We have a roller furling Main and Jib. With the large Main and small Jib we almost always reduce the Main 1st.
Twist
About all I can add to this is to add twist to your sails...let the boom rise up by easing the boom vang; let the jib twist by moving the cars back. This will dump air at the top of the sails and the boat stand up a little. Just don't let the sails flog. Steve
About all I can add to this is to add twist to your sails...let the boom rise up by easing the boom vang; let the jib twist by moving the cars back. This will dump air at the top of the sails and the boat stand up a little. Just don't let the sails flog. Steve
nice boat
Last year was our first year on our '05 33. I always started reefing ( rolling) at 15 knots as she ( the boat) likes to sail flat and will maintain a good balance. I sailed in 20- 25 knots and could let go of the wheel and maintain course. It's easy to reef and unroll, so keep experimenting until you get the feel. If you take in too much sail, you can easily let more out. I found with the furling main without battens, that I had no power under main alone. I could do 4.5 - 5 knots under the jib alone, but not with just the main.
Last year was our first year on our '05 33. I always started reefing ( rolling) at 15 knots as she ( the boat) likes to sail flat and will maintain a good balance. I sailed in 20- 25 knots and could let go of the wheel and maintain course. It's easy to reef and unroll, so keep experimenting until you get the feel. If you take in too much sail, you can easily let more out. I found with the furling main without battens, that I had no power under main alone. I could do 4.5 - 5 knots under the jib alone, but not with just the main.
As far as reefing a roller main - I refer you to
This link. I examined the area of triangle to determine the percentage of sail still exposed. Its a thought....
This link. I examined the area of triangle to determine the percentage of sail still exposed. Its a thought....
a low-math alternative to Jim's method
Instead of marking the sail, mark the mast. As a starting point of reference, take the boat out on a day when you know the wind will build at a fairly constant level to a point beyond your normal comfort level. Begin with the main reefed so that the top of the leech exits the mast at a recognizable point, such as the top spreader. Now, keep one eye on the rudder angle and the other on the anemometer, which should be set to apparent wind. Go to weather. Every time the wind builds a degree or two, note the amount of weather helm/lee helm you're experiencing by noting how many degrees the rudder has to be over to keep the boat on track. It should be fairly easy to tell the points when the boat goes from being underpowered to being right in the groove to being overpowered. Trust the helm. So now you've got a number, such as "first spreader equals 25 knots apparent." And you can probably project what the ideal wind speed is for the top of the mast (e.g. "Full main equals 18 knots apparent.") Cool. Now measure the difference between the point where the leech emerges when full out and the initial reference point, such as the first spreader. Let's say it's 7 feet, just to make this easy. Now do the math. At 19 kts apparent you'll want to reef one foot below full; at 20 kts apparent you'll want to reef at two feet below full; et cetera. Now, before the naysayers (mathematicians) start barking about how the geometry of this system is imperfect, let me just state for the record that the leech is hollow, and that very few mainsails constitute perfect triangles, and that we're talking apparent wind rather than true, which is an additional fudge factor, and that the the final variable is the flatness of the main, which differs from one set to another. Let me also mention the caveat that this system works better with a fraction rig than a masthead rig, because with the latter you'll want to furl both sails equally to keep the rig balanced. Otherwise, it works. And it's fairly easy once you've figured the first reference point. Best part of this system, once you've worked everything out, is that you can glance at the apparent wind speed and then instruct the crew to bring out enough main so that the leech is X feet above the first spreader (or whatever your mark is) and you'll have nailed it.
Instead of marking the sail, mark the mast. As a starting point of reference, take the boat out on a day when you know the wind will build at a fairly constant level to a point beyond your normal comfort level. Begin with the main reefed so that the top of the leech exits the mast at a recognizable point, such as the top spreader. Now, keep one eye on the rudder angle and the other on the anemometer, which should be set to apparent wind. Go to weather. Every time the wind builds a degree or two, note the amount of weather helm/lee helm you're experiencing by noting how many degrees the rudder has to be over to keep the boat on track. It should be fairly easy to tell the points when the boat goes from being underpowered to being right in the groove to being overpowered. Trust the helm. So now you've got a number, such as "first spreader equals 25 knots apparent." And you can probably project what the ideal wind speed is for the top of the mast (e.g. "Full main equals 18 knots apparent.") Cool. Now measure the difference between the point where the leech emerges when full out and the initial reference point, such as the first spreader. Let's say it's 7 feet, just to make this easy. Now do the math. At 19 kts apparent you'll want to reef one foot below full; at 20 kts apparent you'll want to reef at two feet below full; et cetera. Now, before the naysayers (mathematicians) start barking about how the geometry of this system is imperfect, let me just state for the record that the leech is hollow, and that very few mainsails constitute perfect triangles, and that we're talking apparent wind rather than true, which is an additional fudge factor, and that the the final variable is the flatness of the main, which differs from one set to another. Let me also mention the caveat that this system works better with a fraction rig than a masthead rig, because with the latter you'll want to furl both sails equally to keep the rig balanced. Otherwise, it works. And it's fairly easy once you've figured the first reference point. Best part of this system, once you've worked everything out, is that you can glance at the apparent wind speed and then instruct the crew to bring out enough main so that the leech is X feet above the first spreader (or whatever your mark is) and you'll have nailed it.
25 to 30 knots
i have a 2007 hunter 33 25 knots on the central coast of ca. is normal sailing weather here.on my hunter i have found furling in about half my mainsail and one third my headsail ease the main sheet a bit she just takes off
i have a 2007 hunter 33 25 knots on the central coast of ca. is normal sailing weather here.on my hunter i have found furling in about half my mainsail and one third my headsail ease the main sheet a bit she just takes off
While on the subject...
I there a trick to keep an in mast furling main from coming out all the way out when you are taking it out in the 25-30 KT winds? I normally take it all the way out ( actually it comes out all by itself one I start pulling on the outhaul), go foward to change the furler lever over to rachet, then come back into the cockpit and furl the sail in the desired amount. Pain in the rear!
I there a trick to keep an in mast furling main from coming out all the way out when you are taking it out in the 25-30 KT winds? I normally take it all the way out ( actually it comes out all by itself one I start pulling on the outhaul), go foward to change the furler lever over to rachet, then come back into the cockpit and furl the sail in the desired amount. Pain in the rear!
To stop or control the unfurling (for Broke sailor)
You can brake the unfurling of the main when it's on the way out by using the furling lines (both furl-in and furl-out). As you know, the single-loop furling line goes round the furling winch at the mast; until now, it sounds like you have always been letting this winch free-wheel as the sail comes out. If you apply controlled tension on both furling lines at the same time as the sail comes out you can slow down or stop the furling winch at any point. If you stop the winch turning, the sail stops unfurling. When you have the sail out as far as you want it (and no further), use the line locks on the furling lines to keep the sail at that reef point while you go up and put the drum ratchet on. Then tighten up on your outhaul. Voila!
You can brake the unfurling of the main when it's on the way out by using the furling lines (both furl-in and furl-out). As you know, the single-loop furling line goes round the furling winch at the mast; until now, it sounds like you have always been letting this winch free-wheel as the sail comes out. If you apply controlled tension on both furling lines at the same time as the sail comes out you can slow down or stop the furling winch at any point. If you stop the winch turning, the sail stops unfurling. When you have the sail out as far as you want it (and no further), use the line locks on the furling lines to keep the sail at that reef point while you go up and put the drum ratchet on. Then tighten up on your outhaul. Voila!
wrap your furl
in hard wind i wrap my main furl , open the clets and hold tension on yhe main while pulling the outhaul then i get only what i want
in hard wind i wrap my main furl , open the clets and hold tension on yhe main while pulling the outhaul then i get only what i want
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