Hey Folks, What is the wisdom on running a diesel engine (Yanmar 3jh2) at the dock under load, i.e., with docklines restraining, to get some operating temperature running time? With no load, I believe the engine will never get to operating temperature. Not sure it will with a dockline load either but better than no load. I have done this up to 2000 rpm (max 3600 rpm) for ten minutes without separating docklines or dock so far. Also, an idea is running in reverse since it is inefficient in terms of propelling power but efficient in terms of loading the engine. Thanks for you thoughts. Peter
Running engine at the dock
- Thread starter pdserv
- Start date
- Status
Hot engine time is good
My perception is that weeks (or months) of idleness is not good for any mechanical device. The idea of getting things hot is to boil off condensates accumulated in the engine oil and avoid the glazing that can occur on diesels constantly run a sub-operating temperatures. Several articles I have read espoused the notion of running the diesel hard regularly. Assuming that is correct, the question is is running at the dock at the rpms achieved "good enough." Thanks
My perception is that weeks (or months) of idleness is not good for any mechanical device. The idea of getting things hot is to boil off condensates accumulated in the engine oil and avoid the glazing that can occur on diesels constantly run a sub-operating temperatures. Several articles I have read espoused the notion of running the diesel hard regularly. Assuming that is correct, the question is is running at the dock at the rpms achieved "good enough." Thanks
All the boats up here
sit from October to the end of April out in the cold, on the hard. Doesn't seem to hurt them. As for running a diesel hard, if I'm motoring I'll run her at nearly full revs for the last 15 or 20 mins then let her cool down and then shut off.
sit from October to the end of April out in the cold, on the hard. Doesn't seem to hurt them. As for running a diesel hard, if I'm motoring I'll run her at nearly full revs for the last 15 or 20 mins then let her cool down and then shut off.
None
Get everything ready to cast off, then start your engine, then go. You'll putter slowly out of the marina, then run the engine under load until it warms up to operating temp. Then shut it down and sail. Best thing for the engine. Other issue: your dock neighbors won't hate you for making smelly fumes and noise.
Get everything ready to cast off, then start your engine, then go. You'll putter slowly out of the marina, then run the engine under load until it warms up to operating temp. Then shut it down and sail. Best thing for the engine. Other issue: your dock neighbors won't hate you for making smelly fumes and noise.
Rick...
...what does 'nm' mean? I've seen this on a lot of posts, I just never asked before now. Thanks Jack
...what does 'nm' mean? I've seen this on a lot of posts, I just never asked before now. Thanks Jack
Hot engine = good
Yes, running the engine under load and at full operating temperature is good for it. The automotive engineers that I've spoken with tell me that it takes about 30 minutes at full operating temp to keep the oil clean. The oil has to be over 180 F (200 F is better) to release the contaminates into the PCV system. One of the reasons that sailboat engines die early is that they are seldom run at high enough temperatures for long enough to keep the oil clean. Raw water cooled engines hardly ever get their oil hot enough to do any good since running salt water in cooling systems at 180F plus causes a raft of other problems. Keeping the engine happy is a very good excuse to use your boat more!
Yes, running the engine under load and at full operating temperature is good for it. The automotive engineers that I've spoken with tell me that it takes about 30 minutes at full operating temp to keep the oil clean. The oil has to be over 180 F (200 F is better) to release the contaminates into the PCV system. One of the reasons that sailboat engines die early is that they are seldom run at high enough temperatures for long enough to keep the oil clean. Raw water cooled engines hardly ever get their oil hot enough to do any good since running salt water in cooling systems at 180F plus causes a raft of other problems. Keeping the engine happy is a very good excuse to use your boat more!
I do it sometimes
I keep my boat in the water year round and sometimes can't sail due to weather or whatever. I try to start the engine and run it at least twice a month. It won't get good and hot unless it is in gear. I run it for 10-15 minutes in gear at 1500 rpm and then idle it until it cools before shutting it off. I prefer to go out and motor around as this knocks crud off of the hull. Wide open trottle for a few minutes when not attached to the dock. I check dock lines and gradually increase the rpms to make sure everything is hold well. My Volvo handbook recommends a storage procedure if the engine isn't ran every two weeks to prevent damage. Their procedure is rather long and difficult. running the engine without gettting it hot probably will do more harm than good as far as moisture in the engine etc.
I keep my boat in the water year round and sometimes can't sail due to weather or whatever. I try to start the engine and run it at least twice a month. It won't get good and hot unless it is in gear. I run it for 10-15 minutes in gear at 1500 rpm and then idle it until it cools before shutting it off. I prefer to go out and motor around as this knocks crud off of the hull. Wide open trottle for a few minutes when not attached to the dock. I check dock lines and gradually increase the rpms to make sure everything is hold well. My Volvo handbook recommends a storage procedure if the engine isn't ran every two weeks to prevent damage. Their procedure is rather long and difficult. running the engine without gettting it hot probably will do more harm than good as far as moisture in the engine etc.
May violate a contract
Our marina expressly forbids it.... it's even in the contract! If you are docked at a marina I'd check with the office/dock master first.
Our marina expressly forbids it.... it's even in the contract! If you are docked at a marina I'd check with the office/dock master first.
Standard practice
I was having some overheating problems while slipped at the marina in Manitowac, WI. This is a highly respect marina on L Michigan. I wanted to put my engine under load and asked the service department about this practice. they said they do it all the time. i certainly made sure I plenty of good dock lines holding me in place. I have some 3/4 inchers with a breaking strenght of 12000#.
I was having some overheating problems while slipped at the marina in Manitowac, WI. This is a highly respect marina on L Michigan. I wanted to put my engine under load and asked the service department about this practice. they said they do it all the time. i certainly made sure I plenty of good dock lines holding me in place. I have some 3/4 inchers with a breaking strenght of 12000#.
Interesting post.
Never gave it a thought during all the years of power boating. The tiny engines in sailboats really do not work hard usually.. Therefore wouldn't this be another reason to use synthetic oil. Since we used to change oil in the fall before lay up to get rid of the acid in the used oil that can etch the bearings and wear surfaces during the dormant winter months. Synthetic oil seems to have more of the additives that fight these conditions and the benefit of not having to change oil as often. Down side to synthetic oil is if you have just a slight oil leak the synthetic will find it.
Never gave it a thought during all the years of power boating. The tiny engines in sailboats really do not work hard usually.. Therefore wouldn't this be another reason to use synthetic oil. Since we used to change oil in the fall before lay up to get rid of the acid in the used oil that can etch the bearings and wear surfaces during the dormant winter months. Synthetic oil seems to have more of the additives that fight these conditions and the benefit of not having to change oil as often. Down side to synthetic oil is if you have just a slight oil leak the synthetic will find it.
John C in Norfolk...
exactly what is forbidden in your marina? running the engine at the dock? how do you get out of the slip? I've never seen any language like that and wonder how they would restrict it? In gear? Length of time? RPM?
exactly what is forbidden in your marina? running the engine at the dock? how do you get out of the slip? I've never seen any language like that and wonder how they would restrict it? In gear? Length of time? RPM?
Running engine at dock
The engine doesn't care whether you are tied down or not. The prop's job is the move water which creates resistance that propells the boat. The tranny and engine move the prop. The lines hold the boat down. The boat is running under a load anytime you have it in gear. Just make sure you have strong lines, cleats and dock. I've done it at my dock a bit when working on stuff...mainly engine alignment. I wouldn't suggest it as a method to warm the engine up though.
The engine doesn't care whether you are tied down or not. The prop's job is the move water which creates resistance that propells the boat. The tranny and engine move the prop. The lines hold the boat down. The boat is running under a load anytime you have it in gear. Just make sure you have strong lines, cleats and dock. I've done it at my dock a bit when working on stuff...mainly engine alignment. I wouldn't suggest it as a method to warm the engine up though.
Silt and mud
Depending on the exact arrangement and depth of your slip you could be kicking up a mean mud cloud which could get injested in the raw water intake. This is generally considered to be a bad thing as mud in the strainer and engine heat exchanger tend to make for problems. A mud filled muffler is quite the mess. As for reaching operating temp under no load. The fresh water cooling system has a thermostat that will cause the engine to come up to operating temp. At idle this may take 15-20 min but once the thermostat opens up the engine does not get any hotter. This takes care of water in the oil but does lead to the engine having carbon deposits from not being run under load. Get some warm cloths and go sailing. The frostbite club has plenty of room for new members. And given this years warm weather you may not even qualify for membership.
Depending on the exact arrangement and depth of your slip you could be kicking up a mean mud cloud which could get injested in the raw water intake. This is generally considered to be a bad thing as mud in the strainer and engine heat exchanger tend to make for problems. A mud filled muffler is quite the mess. As for reaching operating temp under no load. The fresh water cooling system has a thermostat that will cause the engine to come up to operating temp. At idle this may take 15-20 min but once the thermostat opens up the engine does not get any hotter. This takes care of water in the oil but does lead to the engine having carbon deposits from not being run under load. Get some warm cloths and go sailing. The frostbite club has plenty of room for new members. And given this years warm weather you may not even qualify for membership.
Just had to sign a new contract for the marina and
it also has a ban against running the engine in gear while tied to the dock. Can't imagine it is easily enforced, probably just to add to your liability should anything "unexpected" happen. I prefer to motor around somewhere to warm the engine for oil changes etc. just seems to take forever otherwise.
it also has a ban against running the engine in gear while tied to the dock. Can't imagine it is easily enforced, probably just to add to your liability should anything "unexpected" happen. I prefer to motor around somewhere to warm the engine for oil changes etc. just seems to take forever otherwise.
Thanks for the discussion
Hey Everyone, Thanks for the discussion. Obviously lots of opinions. FYI I am at a marina where the river will surface freeze at sometime during the winter but the slips will remain open due to a bubbler system. Clearly, motoring the boat around is the preferable alternative (including the philosophical aspects). However, that is not always possible. And, as one responder noted, running the engine is probably easier (and better) than the winter layup process.
Hey Everyone, Thanks for the discussion. Obviously lots of opinions. FYI I am at a marina where the river will surface freeze at sometime during the winter but the slips will remain open due to a bubbler system. Clearly, motoring the boat around is the preferable alternative (including the philosophical aspects). However, that is not always possible. And, as one responder noted, running the engine is probably easier (and better) than the winter layup process.
Chuck R has it right...
...if you change your oil before the winter, then you do not have the mainly sulfuric acid that tends to eat things up. Therefore not running the engine wouldn't hurt a thing. On the other hand cranking it every month or so would run grease around the things that need it which would be a help, running like that for five or so minutes couldn't hurt. For what it is worth. Again...the main thing is to not have the sulfuric acid sitting in the engine, regular oil changes take care of that. Jack Hart
...if you change your oil before the winter, then you do not have the mainly sulfuric acid that tends to eat things up. Therefore not running the engine wouldn't hurt a thing. On the other hand cranking it every month or so would run grease around the things that need it which would be a help, running like that for five or so minutes couldn't hurt. For what it is worth. Again...the main thing is to not have the sulfuric acid sitting in the engine, regular oil changes take care of that. Jack Hart
Rules and Regulations
For Don s/v Tellico: I checked my original contract to get the wording exact: #14 (of 20). Running engine in gear while secured to dock or slips. Long laundry list of Prohibited items here...including (my personal favorite...NOT!) #2. Consuming alcoholoic beverages on Marina Property. Taylor's Landing Marina in Norfolk.
For Don s/v Tellico: I checked my original contract to get the wording exact: #14 (of 20). Running engine in gear while secured to dock or slips. Long laundry list of Prohibited items here...including (my personal favorite...NOT!) #2. Consuming alcoholoic beverages on Marina Property. Taylor's Landing Marina in Norfolk.
John C.
Regarding rule #2: I hope sitting on your boat in the slip you are not considered to be on marina property!
Regarding rule #2: I hope sitting on your boat in the slip you are not considered to be on marina property!
- Status