If you were to have a major rudder failure, how would you rig an emergency rudder to get home? Do you keep equipment on board for this kind of emergency?
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Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net
Rudder failure
Dec.21, 2000 Dear Bob, What we would do in response would depend on the extent of the failure. If the cable leading to the quadrant failed we have a spare cable and could replace the broken one, even at sea of necessary. I've already had the binnacle apart to inspect it and know how to run the cable and chain. I have additional cable and appropriate sized bulldog clamps to clamp a short piece of cable (which I also have) to the existing cable if I choose to go that route. If we decided to wait until we got into port to effect repairs the rudder post extension would come out of the port side locker and be fitted to the rudder post along with one of the two tiller handles I have on board that fit into it. I have tested this in operation under sail and was surprised at how easy the boat steered, a tribute to Beneteau's semi-balanced spade rudder. If the rudder fell off the opening through the hull would have to be blocked using the wood and underwater epoxy i have on board for that purpose. A rudder would then be rigged using a cabin door and the spinnaker pole . The door would be drilled to take a line to lash it to the pole and the pole would be lashed to the backstay. I have two hand drills and two electric drills (one battery operated) and the appropriate size bits, lines and hardware on board to do this. I haven't wanted to drill holes in any of my cabin doors to try this, but I have read of others who have done it with success. Other than these possible solutions I haven't given the matter much thought, so maybe some other readers can share their thoughts with us as well. And you shouldn't be worrying about it over the Christmas season, either. Merry Christmas to you and yours Bob Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Aboard The Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia
Dec.21, 2000 Dear Bob, What we would do in response would depend on the extent of the failure. If the cable leading to the quadrant failed we have a spare cable and could replace the broken one, even at sea of necessary. I've already had the binnacle apart to inspect it and know how to run the cable and chain. I have additional cable and appropriate sized bulldog clamps to clamp a short piece of cable (which I also have) to the existing cable if I choose to go that route. If we decided to wait until we got into port to effect repairs the rudder post extension would come out of the port side locker and be fitted to the rudder post along with one of the two tiller handles I have on board that fit into it. I have tested this in operation under sail and was surprised at how easy the boat steered, a tribute to Beneteau's semi-balanced spade rudder. If the rudder fell off the opening through the hull would have to be blocked using the wood and underwater epoxy i have on board for that purpose. A rudder would then be rigged using a cabin door and the spinnaker pole . The door would be drilled to take a line to lash it to the pole and the pole would be lashed to the backstay. I have two hand drills and two electric drills (one battery operated) and the appropriate size bits, lines and hardware on board to do this. I haven't wanted to drill holes in any of my cabin doors to try this, but I have read of others who have done it with success. Other than these possible solutions I haven't given the matter much thought, so maybe some other readers can share their thoughts with us as well. And you shouldn't be worrying about it over the Christmas season, either. Merry Christmas to you and yours Bob Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Aboard The Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia
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Rob Rich
That does it Pickton
First I was jealous of your location, especially at this time of the year. After reading a few of your posts, I am now jealous of your overall sailing knowledge. Great post! I am going to store this tip and impress the hell out of people if I ever need to use it! Rob
First I was jealous of your location, especially at this time of the year. After reading a few of your posts, I am now jealous of your overall sailing knowledge. Great post! I am going to store this tip and impress the hell out of people if I ever need to use it! Rob
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David Foster
Lumber, line and tools
Brian nailed the answer. The more general case is: Carry some marine lumber, line, and tools (hammer, saw, drills, bolts, etc.). Together with other stuff on the Lillie, this is the basis for: An emergency rudder (wood spar plus a piece of marine plywood - the door is a great backup for this.) Major hole in the hull (wood spar running from the opposite side of the cabin bracing the plywood backing a cushion over the hole and tightened with wedges.) And so on. Whenever the Admiral comes up with a problem (this is one of her leisure activities), we come up with a workable solution, and make sure we could implement with the materials at hand. A recent example resulted in mounting a fire extinguisher in the cockpit storage, since a fire in the companionway (over the engine, and by the stove) would block safe access to the two extinguishers in the cabin.
Brian nailed the answer. The more general case is: Carry some marine lumber, line, and tools (hammer, saw, drills, bolts, etc.). Together with other stuff on the Lillie, this is the basis for: An emergency rudder (wood spar plus a piece of marine plywood - the door is a great backup for this.) Major hole in the hull (wood spar running from the opposite side of the cabin bracing the plywood backing a cushion over the hole and tightened with wedges.) And so on. Whenever the Admiral comes up with a problem (this is one of her leisure activities), we come up with a workable solution, and make sure we could implement with the materials at hand. A recent example resulted in mounting a fire extinguisher in the cockpit storage, since a fire in the companionway (over the engine, and by the stove) would block safe access to the two extinguishers in the cabin.
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Justin - O'day Owners Web
yea! I'm not the only neurotic one!
<G> Its good to see everyone planning ahead. Nothing contributes more to survival in emergency situations than forethought, and the confidence that comes with it. Darcy and I practice recoveries and so one regularly. One thing we added to repetoir late in the season was sailing with the rudder tied amidships, using sail to tack and steer. Its a lot easier to do in my laser than the Catalina! If we had an emergency rudder failure, we are lucky to have outboard power. Vectoring its thrust give excellent control, even when using the sails for propulsion. If I lost the engine, I'd trail a warp to stabilize the boat, use the main for power, back the jib if I wanted to tack, use heel angle to head up and sheeted jib with slack main to head down My favorite way to cross the nasty bar outside one of the passages into Casco Bay is to go through it powered up under sail, but using the engine to keep us square to the following nasties. Never had time to look at the GPS while doing this, but we're flying. Justin - O'day Owners' Web
<G> Its good to see everyone planning ahead. Nothing contributes more to survival in emergency situations than forethought, and the confidence that comes with it. Darcy and I practice recoveries and so one regularly. One thing we added to repetoir late in the season was sailing with the rudder tied amidships, using sail to tack and steer. Its a lot easier to do in my laser than the Catalina! If we had an emergency rudder failure, we are lucky to have outboard power. Vectoring its thrust give excellent control, even when using the sails for propulsion. If I lost the engine, I'd trail a warp to stabilize the boat, use the main for power, back the jib if I wanted to tack, use heel angle to head up and sheeted jib with slack main to head down My favorite way to cross the nasty bar outside one of the passages into Casco Bay is to go through it powered up under sail, but using the engine to keep us square to the following nasties. Never had time to look at the GPS while doing this, but we're flying. Justin - O'day Owners' Web
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Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net
One other thing...
Dec.23, 2000 I seem to be suffering more and more from cruiseheimers because it seems whenever I write something there is always something else I meant to add. In this case it is this: if you are a sailing a relatively small and light weight boat you can conl it's direction at least to some extent buy towing a bucket with lines attached to each quarter. By pulling the bucket over to one quarter or another we were able to induce enough drag to steer the boat, a San Juan 24(? it might have been a 28?) albeit it quite slowly. Still it gave us some directional control. I was tryingthis on my boat with a larger 5 gallon bucket but the handle failed and we lost it. I have since tried it again and we cut holes in the sides of the bucket to tie the lines. Chafe was a problem and the line started sawing through the bucket, but it would work for the short term. I have fire extinguishers in every cabin as well as next to the nav and galley. May I say that Rob's idea about adding a fire extinguisher in the cockpit area is a great suggestion that I'm going to implement. We carry a lot of various chemicals on board in the cockpit lockers and a spontaneous combustion fire there is always a concern, as is an engine fire which is under the companionway. I think an extinguisher in both of my cockpit lockers is worth doiing, and thanks for the tip. Merry Christmas you guys. Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Aboard the Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia
Dec.23, 2000 I seem to be suffering more and more from cruiseheimers because it seems whenever I write something there is always something else I meant to add. In this case it is this: if you are a sailing a relatively small and light weight boat you can conl it's direction at least to some extent buy towing a bucket with lines attached to each quarter. By pulling the bucket over to one quarter or another we were able to induce enough drag to steer the boat, a San Juan 24(? it might have been a 28?) albeit it quite slowly. Still it gave us some directional control. I was tryingthis on my boat with a larger 5 gallon bucket but the handle failed and we lost it. I have since tried it again and we cut holes in the sides of the bucket to tie the lines. Chafe was a problem and the line started sawing through the bucket, but it would work for the short term. I have fire extinguishers in every cabin as well as next to the nav and galley. May I say that Rob's idea about adding a fire extinguisher in the cockpit area is a great suggestion that I'm going to implement. We carry a lot of various chemicals on board in the cockpit lockers and a spontaneous combustion fire there is always a concern, as is an engine fire which is under the companionway. I think an extinguisher in both of my cockpit lockers is worth doiing, and thanks for the tip. Merry Christmas you guys. Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Aboard the Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia
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Rod Worrell
Some Other Thought
Brian, since you are staying up with this forum while aboard The Legend, fill us in on what it is like in the St. Lucia area right now! Regarding rudder issues, we lost our steering cables last April while underway in Galveston Bay in preparation of sailing in the Unrulely Regatta. Reaction was interesting, but pulling out our regular tiller, which is in the lazarette, and slipping it onto the rudder post of our Catalina 30 gave us control. Because of the wheel's location, we weren't able to set the tiller in a true horizontal attitude. Rather we (me) held on tightly and steered with the tiller at about a 45 degree angle upwards. Maybe we were crazy, but we went on with the race and actually did pretty good all things considered. I say this part to add the second part and that is in any condition less than ideal, trying to splice or replace the cables while underway probably would not be an easy "5 minute fix". Our situation was caused by lack of a rudder stop on the quadrant which allowed the rudder to be turned way past its normal or intended angle and in coming about when I swung the wheel the other way, "snap". Whoever had our boat before us and added the wheel system either never went sailing or knew there wasn't the rudder stop and steered carefully! The lesson is that myself and our surveyor never looked this closely at what would have been expected to be in place. If any of the readers also have a retrofit wheel system, you may want to peer down below and make sure your rudder stop is in place and functioning. Last thought. I read a suggestion of Larry Pardey's several years ago and that was to drill a (1") hole through the aft top portion of one's rudder (epoxy the walls of the hole) so that if the wheel and tiller weren't working one could still work a line through the hole in such a way that there would be a port and starb'd end of the line to steer the rudder by. I noticed this "feature" on a new Island Packet's rudder that just arrived in a nearby yard the other day, too. Lastly, your question does raise some ideas on how to produce an emergency rudder out of what's on board. Rather than initially sacrificing a companionway board, there are several cover boards down below that fit over the seat/bunk holes that are good-sized. I think I will go ahead and prepare a couple of them just for this back-up purpose. Thanks for causing us to create contingency plans.
Brian, since you are staying up with this forum while aboard The Legend, fill us in on what it is like in the St. Lucia area right now! Regarding rudder issues, we lost our steering cables last April while underway in Galveston Bay in preparation of sailing in the Unrulely Regatta. Reaction was interesting, but pulling out our regular tiller, which is in the lazarette, and slipping it onto the rudder post of our Catalina 30 gave us control. Because of the wheel's location, we weren't able to set the tiller in a true horizontal attitude. Rather we (me) held on tightly and steered with the tiller at about a 45 degree angle upwards. Maybe we were crazy, but we went on with the race and actually did pretty good all things considered. I say this part to add the second part and that is in any condition less than ideal, trying to splice or replace the cables while underway probably would not be an easy "5 minute fix". Our situation was caused by lack of a rudder stop on the quadrant which allowed the rudder to be turned way past its normal or intended angle and in coming about when I swung the wheel the other way, "snap". Whoever had our boat before us and added the wheel system either never went sailing or knew there wasn't the rudder stop and steered carefully! The lesson is that myself and our surveyor never looked this closely at what would have been expected to be in place. If any of the readers also have a retrofit wheel system, you may want to peer down below and make sure your rudder stop is in place and functioning. Last thought. I read a suggestion of Larry Pardey's several years ago and that was to drill a (1") hole through the aft top portion of one's rudder (epoxy the walls of the hole) so that if the wheel and tiller weren't working one could still work a line through the hole in such a way that there would be a port and starb'd end of the line to steer the rudder by. I noticed this "feature" on a new Island Packet's rudder that just arrived in a nearby yard the other day, too. Lastly, your question does raise some ideas on how to produce an emergency rudder out of what's on board. Rather than initially sacrificing a companionway board, there are several cover boards down below that fit over the seat/bunk holes that are good-sized. I think I will go ahead and prepare a couple of them just for this back-up purpose. Thanks for causing us to create contingency plans.
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Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net
Good points, Rod
Dec. 27, 2000 Dear Rod, To answer your first question, the weather down here is wonderful, a balmy 80 to 85° during the day, dropping to a chilly 75°F. at night. You almost need to sleep under a sheet. This is the rainy season but we have only had 4 or 5 days where it has been overcast and raining all day. Most of the time you get these intense rain squalls that last 10 to15 minutes and then the sun comes out again. This is also the season of the "Christmas trades" that blow at 25 to 30 knots. We've seen 44 knots in the gales recently, but gales are rare. Even the Christmas trades are benign this year, only blowing for a few days and then diminishing to 15 to 20 knots for a few days before starting up again. Last year they blew from around Dec. 4 to the end of March with only a couple of brief breaks, one of which we used to bolt from Isla Margarita to Trinidad. In the Christmas trades seas will run 8 to 10 feet or larger if they have blown for awhile. Most of the time seas are 5 to 8 feet and in summer this diminishes further to 3 to5 feet. Now isn't that more about the weather then you really wanted to know? To address the rest of your points, which are well taken by the way, first let me say congratulations on carrying on racing with the jury rigged tiller. Good for you! I wonder, could you have offset the rudder post extension to one side so the tiller cleared the wheel? I appreciate this might have proven a bit awkward as a steering position. On The Legend the wheel is huge and the tiller actually extends through the spokes. This is not as awkward as it sounds because the wheel only has 5 spokes so there is lots of room to swing the tiller, and if the cable were broken the wheel could be turned without effecting the rudder. I remember reading Larry Pardey's article about running a hole trough the aft end of the rudder and using it to afix pre-rigged steering lines. This idea actually originated hundreds of years ago in the early days of sail when rudders were transom hung and extended well above the water line, and so could be relatively easily reached. I have a hard time cleaning the hull under the transom when a one foot sea is running. Can you imagine going over the side to attach lines to your rudder in a pounding sea or storm? Better to keep the crew on board and rig an auxillary tiller and rudder post in my opinion. I agree with your comment that splicing the steering cable is no 5 minute repair. First, you can only do it if the break is in the middle of a clear run of cable ( fat chance of that) and not at a swaged fitting or around a turning block . Second, even with the good access to the steering cable and quadrant that I have in the lazaret on The Legend, the idea of crawling down there and spending an hour or more hind end uppermost in a rolling sea fixing the cable gives me the dry heaves. In reality we are much more likely to use the rudder post extension and tiller to get into an anchorage and then do the appropriate repair at anchor, and then it is most likely that I would replace the cable. With respect to using cover boards or spare lumber on board to build a spare rudder, none of our cover boards or pieces of wood we carry are large enough to give an effective surface area to steer our boat, which is after all over 46 feet long and displaced 11 tonnes B.C. ( Before Cruising). Obviously it is better to sacrifice a cabin door than loose the ship for want of an adequate sized piece of wood. Needless to say all of our plans were made in contemplation of the fact that we were not going to be able to call up Boats U.S. and ask for a tow ! I hope your not freezing your toucas off up there in the frozen north - what a winter you guys are having! Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Warm and Snug in the Tropics, Aboard the Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia ;-))
Dec. 27, 2000 Dear Rod, To answer your first question, the weather down here is wonderful, a balmy 80 to 85° during the day, dropping to a chilly 75°F. at night. You almost need to sleep under a sheet. This is the rainy season but we have only had 4 or 5 days where it has been overcast and raining all day. Most of the time you get these intense rain squalls that last 10 to15 minutes and then the sun comes out again. This is also the season of the "Christmas trades" that blow at 25 to 30 knots. We've seen 44 knots in the gales recently, but gales are rare. Even the Christmas trades are benign this year, only blowing for a few days and then diminishing to 15 to 20 knots for a few days before starting up again. Last year they blew from around Dec. 4 to the end of March with only a couple of brief breaks, one of which we used to bolt from Isla Margarita to Trinidad. In the Christmas trades seas will run 8 to 10 feet or larger if they have blown for awhile. Most of the time seas are 5 to 8 feet and in summer this diminishes further to 3 to5 feet. Now isn't that more about the weather then you really wanted to know? To address the rest of your points, which are well taken by the way, first let me say congratulations on carrying on racing with the jury rigged tiller. Good for you! I wonder, could you have offset the rudder post extension to one side so the tiller cleared the wheel? I appreciate this might have proven a bit awkward as a steering position. On The Legend the wheel is huge and the tiller actually extends through the spokes. This is not as awkward as it sounds because the wheel only has 5 spokes so there is lots of room to swing the tiller, and if the cable were broken the wheel could be turned without effecting the rudder. I remember reading Larry Pardey's article about running a hole trough the aft end of the rudder and using it to afix pre-rigged steering lines. This idea actually originated hundreds of years ago in the early days of sail when rudders were transom hung and extended well above the water line, and so could be relatively easily reached. I have a hard time cleaning the hull under the transom when a one foot sea is running. Can you imagine going over the side to attach lines to your rudder in a pounding sea or storm? Better to keep the crew on board and rig an auxillary tiller and rudder post in my opinion. I agree with your comment that splicing the steering cable is no 5 minute repair. First, you can only do it if the break is in the middle of a clear run of cable ( fat chance of that) and not at a swaged fitting or around a turning block . Second, even with the good access to the steering cable and quadrant that I have in the lazaret on The Legend, the idea of crawling down there and spending an hour or more hind end uppermost in a rolling sea fixing the cable gives me the dry heaves. In reality we are much more likely to use the rudder post extension and tiller to get into an anchorage and then do the appropriate repair at anchor, and then it is most likely that I would replace the cable. With respect to using cover boards or spare lumber on board to build a spare rudder, none of our cover boards or pieces of wood we carry are large enough to give an effective surface area to steer our boat, which is after all over 46 feet long and displaced 11 tonnes B.C. ( Before Cruising). Obviously it is better to sacrifice a cabin door than loose the ship for want of an adequate sized piece of wood. Needless to say all of our plans were made in contemplation of the fact that we were not going to be able to call up Boats U.S. and ask for a tow ! I hope your not freezing your toucas off up there in the frozen north - what a winter you guys are having! Brian Pickton of BeneteauOwners.net Warm and Snug in the Tropics, Aboard the Legend, Rodney Bay, St. Lucia ;-))
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