Repeat post: anyone out there removed MD6A exhaust manifold?

Oct 19, 2019
921
Albin Vega 27 Limerick
Hi.

I'm minded to do above to clean out soot as engine seems to be choked.

Obviously there are the 4 bolts to be removed and the gasket to be
protected.

I'm not too sure what else needs to be removed to allow removal of
manifold - there is very little space.

Can anyone who has been through the process outline the procedure -
I'm aware of my mechanical limitations..

Thanks,

John

Vega 1447 Breakaway
 
Oct 31, 2019
23
John ,last year ,for no reason my engine cloged up and
it was the rubber silencer(Elastomuffle) , it was old
and deteriorated from inside and peaces of rubber came
to clog the exhaust.Don't if you have the same exhaust
arragement as mine .MD6a


Hope this helps .... Patrice
 
Oct 31, 2019
23
John ,last year ,for no reason my engine cloged up and
it was the rubber silencer(Elastomuffle) , it was old
and deteriorated from inside and peaces of rubber came
to clog the exhaust.Don't if you have the same exhaust
arragement as mine .MD6a


Hope this helps .... Patrice
 
Oct 31, 2019
40
Hi John
I have reservations with the "soot" issue in your exhaust. Besides other
things I am a certified diesel mechanic and in all my years of marine and
industrial work have never run across this issue. There are 4 main reasons
your engine will smoke black.

1: Lack of air, either a plugged air filter or collapsed hose can cause
this, but the volvo factory setup it is impossible.

2: Too much fuel from the injection pump to the engine, but this will result
in an overpowered engine and since you describe a power loss again I will
rule this out.

3: Worn injector tip/tips or sticking injector/injectors. This one is also
easily diagnosed. With the engine idling at the dock listen to the exhaust.
If the usual putt putt putt is irregular normally thats an injector. I go a
step further, I tie off well to the dock. I work my engine in gear at full
pull and then I use a wrench and loosen the injector line to the injector,
the engine will fall in power and I listen to see if the remaining injector
has the engine runing smoothly, then I tighten the first injector and open
the second. The engine should fall to the same rpm and sound the same. If
ANY difference is noted pull both injectors and have them rebuilt. Dont go
to a boat place, take them to the nearest place that works on Semi trucks,
you'll find the Volvo nozzle quite common. A personal "tip" or cheat of mine
with the volvo injectors and other that are "clamped down" in place instead
of threaded in. Loosen the 2 nuts that hold the injectors in about 2 turns,
enough the brackets that hold them in place will move slightly then start
the engine, they will pop themselves out, failing this losten them another
turn, lightly tap them with a hammer and start it again, if they still stick
work the engine until 1 pops out. Lightly tighten it slightly snug and
repeat until the other pops out and then pull them both. They can be a bear
to remove otherwise and even I have ruined injectors trying to pry/twist
them out. I have pulled over 100 this way with no problem.

4: Late injection pump timing, this one is also easy to look for. The engine
is hard starting especially cold, when it starts it smokes white/grey and
until warm and sometimes even a little when warm. (next time it's at idle
after dark shine a good flashlight behind the boat, if you see smoke in the
beam bingo) Under light loading it runs smoothly but as soon as you ask for
"all she's got" she smokes black like a destroyer. Put her in gear and throw
her the coal while tied to the dock. look at the exhaust, is it making wet
black soot right on the water behind the boat like black lilly pads? If so
the timing is late.

I have yet to work on a 6A or 6B that the timing was even close to correct.
Without getting all technical the system used to drive the pump with even
moderate normal wear can have the pumps as late as 5 degrees or more easily.

In order for soot to build up in the manifold enough to restrict, your
exhaust would have to almost be liquid and SOAKED in oil and unburned
diesel, and then have to cool and harden layer by layer. Long before the
manifold built up enough to choke up your much smaller exhaust port in the
stern would have been completely plugged as the exhaust was cooler there
creating more buildup than the hotter manifold. You wont find a diesel even
2 hours old without a layer of soot in it, but as it builds up it gets blown
away in chips and chunks every time you throttle up.

Also LONG before it affected power or performance of your motor so much
back pressure would build your exhaust would be a loud hisslike a punctured
tire or blown air line whenever you wound her out, If you just hear putt
putt putt your fine.

These symptoms affect ALL diesels not just our volvo's and these tests also
work on any marine diesel.. If you are even slightly handy with tools you
can test the injectors in less than 5 minutes. If they test well I can
easily tell you or your mechanic how to manually bump up your timing just
for a test. My bet is slow timing and the volvo is very forgiving about
timing. If the increase works do it again until you hear a distinct diesel
"knock" when she's working, at that point back it off a bit and your all
done, no rocket science involved. Keep in mind that by design the 6A and 6B
will smoke slightly black at full throttle when worked hard enough to pull
her below her max rpm. If it smokes before it starts working hard and
pulling down it's injectors or pump timing. Although it could be a problem
with the pump I consider our pumps to be the most bulletproof in the
business, built well and simple design with little to go wrong. I have seen
one bad one, and that guy ran it for years with no fuel filter and then his
wife ran gasoline through it sealing it's fate.

Anyway I hope this helps you. If you narrow it down I'll be glad to tell you
how to fix it .

Claude
 
Oct 30, 2019
1,459
Claude: Thanks for sharing your expertise on the forum. I've saved your
message 'just in case' my Yanmar gets sick!

Peter
'Sin Tacha' #1331
 
Oct 30, 2019
106
Claude,
Thanks for the very nice explanation for the causes of black exhaust
smoke. Your explanation of the timing being late makes a lot of
sense and my MD6B behaves exactly as you describe. I have wanted to
check and adjust the timing, but have not found a good procedure.
Would you be willing to describe how to check and adjust the timing?

Thanks
Paul
V2926 "Overture"
 
Oct 31, 2019
40
Hi Paul
It's fairly easy to do. First you take a scribe or pointed sharp object and
scratch the pump and engine well to mark where the pump is now. Since left
and right are easily confused depending on how you look at the engine and
when discussing rotation I use a simpler explaination.

The first 3-4 I set I used all the correct timing proceedure, marks,
rotation and counter rotation check again bla bla bla and followed the book.
This is a long and lenghtly process and expensive to have done because of
the time consumed. When they were finished I looked at the results and
played with them. I determined there was a fairly large "comfort zone" in
timing that the 6's were happy with, performed well and smoked little to
none. If your timing got a bit behind you suddenly get mass smoke (black)
when working hard, slight smoke (grey/white) when cold and sometimes even
when warm at idle. If you get a bit ahead you get "kick back" when trying to
start and a very loud and obnoxious diesel knock that would make an old
Yanmar YSB-12 jealous. Anyplace in the middle is fine, maybe not perfect but
the Volvo will be happy and so will you.

To advance the timing simply losten the nuts that hold the pump enough that
you can use a large set of channel locks or a rubber.plastic hammer, or
crowbar (whatever works) and twist or tap it the opposite direction of your
raw water pump rotation. Just pull the cover on the raw water pump and look
at the impeller to determine which way it is turning (it never hurts to look
at it anyway) and to advance the timing move the pump the OPPOSITE
direction.

Only slightly move the pump enough to tell you moved it. Now snug the nuts
back to almost full torque and give it a work right there at the dock. Did
the smoke clear up some? better power? Slightly more pronounced diesel
knock? If so repeat the process until you reach the point where you can have
full throttle and advance the combi enough to pull the engine down a bit
before you see any signs of black smoke.

Normally I'll start mine up, allow it to warm up then advance the combi to
full speed of the engine. At this point I advance the combi slowly until I
hear the engine working hard and check the exhaust. There should be no smoke
or only the slightest hint of smoke but not objectionable. At that time I
will advance the combi until I actually pull the engine down 100-200 rpm
from full speed and then you should see some smoke even with a new 6A or 6B.

Remember your engine is working alot harder tied to the dock at full prop
pitch than it would be underway so underway there will be less smoke.

I talked a fellow through this on his mobile/cell phone about 3 months ago.
It took him more time to find his tools etc than it did to set his timing.
On his first advance almost all the smoke was gone and it started better. He
quit right there and was happy even before more tweaking. His mechanic had
told him days before he needed injectors, injection pump work and gave him a
$2100 USD estimate. In the end it cost him 2 hours of his time and a 40
minute long distance call to me. This guy is a realtor and his mechanical
experince prior to this was 3 lawn mower spark plugs and an automotive oil
change.

Just remember you CANT screw this up. If it gets to be too much, you get
cold feet, you decide to let the mechanic do it or whatever just twist the
pump back to your marks you made and tighten it back down, no harm done.

The only problems i've had with helping people through email or the phone
were they forgot to tighten the pump back down before attempting to start it
or never loostened it enough to move easily and had a hard time adjusting
it.

For all of you with different brands of diesels it is also this simple. Even
if you dont know which way to spin the pump for advance it's easily
determined. Mark it, Move it slightly and start it. If you advanced it the
diesel knock will always be more pronounced and the engine more peppy (but
dont do it unless you have the smoke described above) if you retarded it the
start may be harder and the smoke will definately show up or increase. Again
if you think it's not right put it back to your marks and tighten it down,
no harm done.

Lastly with this in hand, and your knowledge you can ask your mechanic to
do it. Since you know now what he has to do, and how he has to do it, he'll
have a hard time riding the clock or "pumping up" the problem or the work.
It should NEVER take more than 2 hours of his time.

If you need more help im always about someplace and im not above talking
you or your hired wrench/spanner through it.

Claude
 
Oct 31, 2019
84
This post has popped up on my mail 4 times and counting. maybe you could go to private mail if this has turned into a conversation..... Thanks

pfmarrack paul@... wrote: Claude,
Many thanks. Thats exactly what I needed. I'll let you know how it
turns out.

Paul
 
Feb 28, 2006
127
Paul & Claude,

Please don't go to private mail. This has been a very interesting and useful exchange. I'm looking forward to hearing how things turn out. Thank you Claude for your generous sharing of your knowledge.

Garry
"Raven" V2427
 
Dec 11, 2007
179
- - port st. lucie,fl.
I too have found the interchange very interesting. I will probably
check the timing on my engine with this knowledge.
Richard ,V1812
 
Oct 30, 2019
106
Claude,
I finally got around to advancing the timing. The black smoke/soot
when under load is gone. Some white grey smoke at startup which
diminishes as it warms up. Engine is smoother at any speed and
sounds like a machine gun during acceleration. A little harder to
start when cold. Did I turn to far or not enough?

Thanks
Paul
V2926
 
Oct 31, 2019
40
Hi Paul
If it continues to machine gun (diesel knock) after the engine reaches
speed it's a bit fast, if after it reaches speed it quiets down it sounds
like your in the ballpark. There will be a faint knock, a bit more than you
had before when your cruising. That knock is normal for the MD's and most
likely your not used to it since it was times slow since you got it most
likely. Just enjoy the newfound power and fuel milage (slow grin)

The harder to start part.... does it spin as fast as before or does it seem
like it wants to "kick back" against the starter a bit until it spins up to
speed? If so I'd go back 1-2 degrees. It wont damage it if it's kicking back
it's just annoying. With these engines long before you set the timing high
enough to do damage it will kick back so hard you cant start it.

Also you now have an audible indicator as to where your getting your best
fuel consumption with the combi. You can slowly advance the pitch until that
knock comes back and when you hear it your really starting to "throw the
coal to it" and as a rule from "quiet" to "machine gun" is about double the
fuel consumption with less than 1/2 a knot speed increase. Run it up slowly
until you hear the knock starting, back it off a tad and ride.

Claude
V1460